M1 Garand reload questions

[plodder]

I am a Newbie to reloading for the Garand & need advice:

I plan to use my once fired Greek Ball M2 brass for reloads. I want to load some 150 gr. Hornady SST for use on deer. However, the Hornady SSTs have a cannelure ring that does not come close to contact with the case neck when the bullet is pressed in to the correct dimension (3.34" called for in the military small arms ammo technical file, but all of my Greek surplus measure about 3.32" straight out of the spam can and they feed flawlessly: see photos).

My question is: will this bullet work reliably and accurately in the M1 when it is pressed in to the 3.34" total length dimension but the cannelure is exposed as shown?

Any advices on loading? (Planning to use IMR4895 with CCI #34 NATO primers)

 

[Sport45]

Welcome to THR!

That's a good bullet, powder, and primer choice for the M1. As long as you have 1 caliber (.308") seated into the neck I wouldn't be concerend with the cannelure showing. I don't crimp bullets for my M1 and have seen no bullet movement in use.

If you want to crimp, just let the cannelure set your seating depth and work up from the starting load. The M1 isn't very sensitive to OAL cartridge length. I've shot many 123-125gr bullets with no feed problems.

 

[jpwilly]

What Sport45 said is correct.

 

[Sunray]

"...have a cannelure..." Hi. You can ignore the cannelure on any bullet. The 3.340" is SAAMI(Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers' Institute) spec max OAL for .30-06 ammo. I've always loaded to 3.340", but 3.320" is close enough. 20 thou won't cause any grief. Never crimped the bullet, myself, either. Neck tension should be enough.
"...Greek Ball M2 brass..." Might require removing the primer crimp. Despite reading thousands of reloading posts about HXP brass, I can never remember if they have a primer crimp. No such thing as milsurp .30-06, of any kind, up here. Doesn't matter anyway. Any .30-06 brass works just fine in an M1.
The only thing that's important when loading for any semi-auto is that you must full length resize every time and watch the case lengths. Other than that it's no different than loading for any rifle. You must work up the load for your rifle. An SST will do for deer, but so will any 150 grain SP. The point makes no difference to accuracy. The base of the bullet does.
You don't need CCI 'milspec' primers either. They're just a marketing gimmick for magnum primers. Thousands of rounds have been loaded for M1 Rifles long before CCI came up with the brilliant marketing idea of 'milspec' primers.
Magnum primers are about the powder used. They burn a bit hotter for a bit longer and are made to light hard to ignite powders and extreme cold weather shooting. Otherwise, regular primers are fine.
IMR4895 will do nicely, but IMR4064 gives more consistent accuracy. Varget will do as well. Didn't exist when I worked up my loads. And Bambi won't care anyway. Being able to hit a 9" pie plate, every time, at 100 yards, off hand, with your load, is far more important. Work up the load(how is below) then practice at 100, on the 9" pie plate, until you can. Think sling for standing stability with an M1. Not the greatest rifle for still hunting either. That 9ish pounds gets really heavy. Doesn't matter in a blind, of course.
Do this. Beginning with the starting load given in your manual, load 8 rounds only(one clip. Write the powder charge on a bit of masking tape and put it on the clip.). Go up by half a grain of powder, loading 8 of each, (put 'em in a clip when loaded) until you get to the max load in your manual.
Then go shooting off a bench. Shoot at 100 yards, for group only, slowly and deliberately. Change targets between strings of 8 and allow time for the barrel to cool.
When you find the best group, load more with that charge and sight in.
I'd be thinking about 3.5 to 4 inches high at 100 for a 150. Puts you on target out to about 300. Peep sights aren't great in low light at dawn or dusk though. Hard to see the front sight.

 

[mdemetz]

In the M1 Garand section of Hornady's reloading manual, they show a COL of 3.185" for their 150gr BT-FMJ(#3037).

 

[plodder]

Thanks

Guys:
Thanks for the quick response & info on cannelure/Overall Length.
Just to be clear: Does everyone agree that a variance of up to .02" in OAL for the loaded M1 30-06 not make a noticable difference in accuracy or reliablility of feeding with the M1? (Tech manual stipulates 3.34" vs. my loaded 150 g. SST at 3.32")

 

[Walkalong]

Just remember to use loads intended for the Garand, and not bolt guns, but you probably know that.

Speer manuals mark them as such. Some manuals refer to them as "service rifle" loads.

(Planning to use IMR4895 with CCI #34 NATO primers)

Which makes the above advise moot. IMR 4895 is perfect for Garands. 47 Grs of IMR 4895 under a 155 Gr A Max is what I am loading. (On advise from folks here)

 

[rg1]

I've loaded the Hornady 150 SST to Hornady's recommended length at
3.230" and they feed and shoot well in 3 different Garands. I do seat and crimp in the cannelure. Hornady has a Garand section and they recommend seating 150 A-Max to 3.240", 168 A-Max and their 168 BT to 3.240", and their 178 grain A-Max to 3.240". No need to try and seat the 150 SST to the maximum length of 3.340" or even 3.320". The profiles of the Greek ball and military bullets is different and the cannelure position of 150 ball and the SST are different. Seated out to 3.320-3.340" you're only going to have about .200" of the SST bullet in the case neck. Not enough case neck tension. You don't "have" to seat exactly to the cannelure nor crimp if you don't want to but you need to seat the 150SST with the cannelure near the case mouth. I'd try a few rounds seated to Hornady's recommended length. They'll feed and shoot fine.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

3.340" is the Maximum overall length of a 30-06 cartridge, not the length you have to load it to. As long as you are within the Min/Max limits any length which works well in your rifle is fine. Just remember if you are using the Max charge allowed with a certain powder and you shorted the OAL pressure can rise to unsafe limits.

 

[Sunray]

"...Does everyone agree..." We're not likely to agree on much of anything. Internet forums are just like that. snicker. The box of 220 grain Silvertips I fired out of my rifle with no damage(never saw nor heard of any M1 being damaged by the ammo alone prior to being on the Internet.), long ago, will cause some guys to have a coronary at the very thought. Anyway, 20 thou isn't a lot and won't matter a great deal. 3.320" will be fine.
"...Tech manual stipulates..." For .30 M2 ammo with its 152 grain FMJ bullet. It's a military spec that really hasn't much to do with reloading. Military specs are about 'this is how we want it.' and they change over time.
.30 M1 ammo with its 174.5 grain BT bullet at 2647 fps was the ammo the M1 Rifle was designed to use and it was used for all tests of the Rifle.
.30 M2 ammo only exists because .30 M1 ammo gave too much range for a lot of National Guard ranges of the time. So the bullet weight was dropped to a 152 grain flat based bullet at 2700 fps, upped, in 1940, to 2800 fps to match the ballistics of the .30 AP's 168 grain bullet.
Reloading is about tailoring the ammo to your rifle. Working up a load with your SST's does that. The most important part is that a 150 SST will kill deer with no fuss.
You may want to think about working up a load with a 165 grain hunting bullet though. A 165 will kill any game you care to hunt. Which one isn't terribly important. Any SP will feed though an M1. So will a 165 grain SST. It'll give you one hunting load for everything. M1's like the weight too.
"...IMR 4895 is perfect for Garands..." The powder used for military ammo, of course, but it doesn't give the consistent accuracy that IMR4064 does.
"...only going to have about .200" of the SST bullet in the case..." That's plenty. The neck of a .30-06 case is only .388" long anyway. .200" is over 50%.

 

[plodder]

Wow Sunray! You are a veritable fount of ordinance knowledge. Particularly considering that you reside in an oppressive, regulated and constrained land of former subjects.

Thanks to all for the insights on my new favorite rifle's loads.

 

[Larry E]

Rounds feed into the chamber of the M1 without having to rise very much at all so OAL is pretty unimportant. M1's are rebarreled to .308 and feed with no problems so that's not to worry about.

As others have said use loads from Hornady's M1 section. If you use powders slower than 4895, 4064, Varget, Reloder 15, and similar you will bend the operating rod and accuracy will go right into the toilet.

LC 69 ammunition chronographs at about 2675 fps out of my M1, so I load it with something that gives about that velocity. It will easily shoot minute of deer.

 

[Kernel]

Download and read this article from American Rifleman, March 1986:

Reloading for the M1 Rifle by John R. Clarke

http://www.divshare.com/download/12436604-0b7

 

[MEHavey]

I noted that in both this article and the 1985 Handloader article on Garand reloading, Clarke cites/uses Federal 210 primers. Was this before the Federal <-> Slamfire connection was identified?

 

[cheygriz]

You can also use the Remington 9 1/2 large rifle primer. It too, is MilSpec, for service rifle loads.