Model of 1911 U.S. Army

[Khornet]

A buddy who doesn't shoot was cleaning out his late uncle's stuff and found this old 1911. Brough it to me to examine etc.

Finish is a flat charcoal black with texture like Parkerizing. The above markings, all caps, are on the right side of the slide starting near the forward edge of the ejection port. SN#356XXX just above the trigger to the rear of the end of the slide-stop pin. Flat mainspring housing with no grooves or checkering, and there is a lanyard ring on its butt. The rear edges of the trigger guard don't appear to have been relieved. On the frame left side ahead of the trigger guard is marked UNITED STATES PROPERTY. Patent dates on the slide run 1897-1913. It's a Colt. Wood checkered double-diamond grips.

With a box of Evansville Ordnanace Plant ball ammo, steel cased, headstamp ECS 43.

So I think this is a plain 1911, not an A1. There is some bluing wear at the front of the slide and frame, holster wear most likely, but minimal.

Function seems fine, tho I haven't fired it. All safeties work.

Any info you folks have about this baby? Value? I told him he needs to give this to someone who will love it and give it a good home....he just laughed.

 

[yayarx7]

The info i have is that the 1911 was not parked just blued, unless reworked at some point.

Is it marked with an arsenal code, ie. AA, SA Ect.?

 

[Khornet]

No arsenal code, far as I can see.

Above the mag release button is what appears to be a bird's head with "S15" beneath it, the whole thing maybe 1/8" tall.

 

[yayarx7]

The eagles head is a springfield inspection mark

The serial number indicates a 1918 Colt manufacture though

At around the #350,000 mark (in mid-1918) the finish was changed yet again to a very coarse final finish that made the bluing appear black in appearance

Just found this.

 

[Old Fuff]

Khornet:

As previously noted the U.S. Army Model 1911 pistol you have, serial number 356XXX was made in 1918, and delivered by Colt to the Ordnance Depot, Bush Terminal, Brooklyn, NY along with a shipment of 5000 guns on July 5, 1918. The Bush Terminal was a shipping facility where armaments intended for the AEF were shipped directly to Europe during World War One.

The finish may be original, or it may have been Parkerized during a later referbishing. However Parkerizing is usually slate gray or gray-green in color. If it had gone through rebuild(s) I would expect the grips to be changed from wood to plastic. The fact that they weren't makes me think that the gun's finish might be original. If so, it would be worth considerably more then one that had been refinished (as most were). One clue. The guns that were blued were wire-brushed first. Those that were Parkerized were sand-blasted.

 

[Jim Watson]

He has a VERY nice 1911. Old 367xxx in the next room is an AA rework, parkerized and with some A1 bits, and pretty well used after that, but it was my first .45 and is a keeper.

If it is really still in the original "black army" finish, it is worth a good deal of money, Blue Book says $1000 - $2000 depending on the percent remaining. But check with a serious GI collector for a current specialty item value.

On another board there is a description and picture of a repro 1911 built by a centerfold gunsmith at some tremendous cost to look like what Colt did routinely back then.

DO NOT let him (or you) get any idea of "customizing" this piece of history.

I wouldn't shoot that ECS 43 steel case ammo. It is corrosive primed, which can be easily handled by PROPER (wet) cleaning, but you wouldn't have to let it slide but once to ruin a barrel. I don't know if the steel cases would be very kind to the extractor either. That stuff was wartime expedient and I have read that most of it was held back for stateside training and brass cases went to war.

 

[Old Fuff]

Jim:

The steel-cased stuff was mainly intended to be used in sub-machine guns, and yes it does ruin Government Model extractors - usually in short order.

At one time I shot up a lot of it because it was cheap - in a 1917 revolver. Of course I had to carefully clean the chambers and barrel when I got done.

 

[Khornet]

WOW

this finish is black, not gray or gray-green like most Park finishes I've seen. The barrel is blued, not in the white, marked Colt 45 Auto. Looks just like that pic, yayrx. Cleaned 'er all up last night. What a lovely gun.

 

[BigG]

Sounds like a great heirloom. Keep it original. I thought all 1911s were blued but they may have went from high polish to brushed finish somewhere along the way. DSK will probably wander by and fill in the blanks.

 

[Old Fuff]

BigG:

All military 1911 .45 pistols were blued. But the luster and color depended on how the metal was polished before the bluing process. Commercial guns were highly polished. Military guns were course polished to remove tool marks and then wire brushed. During part of World War One the brushed finish was much rougher and as a consequence the blue was flatter and darker. Even so, the blueing process remained the same as before.

After the war, pistols that were referbished were finished using what ever process was in place at the time, at the facility that did the rebuilding.

 

[BigG]

Got you Old Fuff, thanks! It's all in the metal prep. Same bluing/finishing process will give different results based on underlying surface.

 

[cidirkona]

Khornet:

there is a lanyard ring on its butt.

Hehehehehehe...

 

[45R]

Nice picture