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Mosin Nagant purchase question

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by Centurian22, May 10, 2019.

  1. Centurian22

    Centurian22 Member

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    Hi all, long time no post. So my wife and I started the tradition of buying each of our children a Mosin around the time they’re born to give to them later on. Of course this started when they were still $100-$125 a piece. We are expecting our third child (boy number two) in Sept and despite the price hike, the wife doesn’t want to deviate from our Mosin plan so that way the kids don’t argue over who gets what. So I have begun the search for a $300-$400 Mosin Nagant 91/30, something I never imagined myself doing.

    I don’t care for the idea of getting one from gunbroker sight unseen, thankfully my local gun shop has two in currently; a round and a hex receiver. While I would prefer the hex since I don’t have one, in keeping to the “they all get the same gun” theme, I’m looking at the round.

    It’s priced at $375 (if I remember correctly). I work away from home for a month at a time so I got the shop to send me some pictures. 1942 “izzy” All looks good except the rear of the receiver (see picture circled), I’ve never seen anything similar, it looks like someone got freaky with a dremel and blued over it but I can’t imagine why. Dealer claims “casting marks” and while I don’t distrust him, I don’t personally believe that’s what’s actually occurred. As crazy overbuilt as the Mosin’s are I don’t expect what’s there to affect function or safety, and I believe I could “buff it out” and re-blue if it really bothers me. I’m mainly asking if anyone thinks there would be any problems caused by what’s visible (also the crown looks a bit rough to me if anyone cares to comment on that also), and do you think $375 is a fair price given condition in current market or should I be haggling down? It is matching numbers as seen in the pictures.

    Any help or suggestions are appreciated.

     
  2. entropy

    entropy Member

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    The chewed-up looking area on the back behind the bolt is normal for a '42 Ishevsk 91/30. They were cutting every step they could to get them in soldiers' hands. Fine machining went out the window. They aren't 'casting marks' , proving your dealer knows squat, they are rough machining marks.
    You could probably find better for less with a little looking around on some of the gun forums. The '42 Ishevsk is the most common variant Mosin made; for $375 you should at least be able to find a hex receiver (pre-'36) Matching numbers is not a 'thing' with Mosin collecting like it is with Mausers or US milsurps.
    Offer $250 and settle at no more than $300.
     
  3. GunnyUSMC

    GunnyUSMC Member

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    Entropy pretty much hit it on the head on all points. :thumbup:
    The 42 Izhevsk in your pics is common of a war time production/refurbished Mosin. It is referred to as a lined out forced matched rifle. When rifles were refurbished after the was, they were disassembled and separating by parts. The parts were then cleaned and inspected. Once the parts passed inspection they were refinished.
    Rifles were assembled from parts. The SN# on the barrel shank was restamped on the bolt and magazine floorplate.
    Depending on where, or when, it was refurbished the old numbers on the bolt, floorplate and buttplate were ground off and restampd, or the old number was lined through and then restamped. One is not worth more then the other .

    You might say I know a little about Mosins, I have a few.
    F24C08EC-CB59-410D-8787-691D7A8D03E9.jpeg

    And look at that. There just happens to be a 42 Izhevsk on the right front corner in my Mosin closet.
    20016565-2112-4214-9DE5-6696E0A44D95.jpeg

    Rough mill work is common on war time production rifles. You’re Dealer doesn’t know much about Mosins and his price is high.
    DE8735DD-9BCB-41C7-8AB2-D3A19733903A.jpeg
     
  4. Centurian22

    Centurian22 Member

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    Thank you both. I was fairly certain mosins were milled and not cast but in my initial googling couldn’t put my finger on the “proof” quick enough. I’m glad that it’s nothing “out of the ordinary”. I was familiar with the general concept of forced matching but I appreciate the level of detail you went into about it which I have not heard before. The two I already have are a 42 Tula and 43 Izzy.

    He wants $400 or $425 (I have a crap memory) for the hex but I haven’t gotten any pictures of that one. I won’t be in as much of a hurry to jump on this one as I initially was and will take your suggestions on talking him down if I don’t find better.

    Thanks.
     
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  5. Driftertank

    Driftertank Member

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    Watching the prices on Mosins these days makes me appreciate my little $79 "as-issued" 1947 M44 a lot more.

    And chuckle with a bit of schadenfreude at the guy i worked with who bubba'ed out his M38. Poor guy...
     
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  6. hdbiker

    hdbiker Member

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    I picked up a minty 1946 referb #44 at a yard sale for 75.00 bucks. hdbiker
     
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  7. Centurian22

    Centurian22 Member

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    Hdbiker recently? That’s awesome. Wish I could get so lucky.
     
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  8. caribou

    caribou Member

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    What matters is that the internals are smooth and fit, the trigger works, the barrel straight and the sights lined up.

    During refurb, they replaced and gauged all parts and brought the guns back into spec.
    A dip in cosmo and sealed in a crate for WW III.

    There were days when All the variations of Mosin were 75$ and under. Bubba used to declare that there were millions and they were always gonna be junk, so hacksaw away......and now those M44s went from 50$ to 350$ as a starting price.

    91/30 s can still be found for 300$ and under if you look a bit.
     
  9. StationOps

    StationOps Member

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    Do you have a Cabela's nearby? The local Cabela's has six or so Mosins ranging from $349 to $399, so if you have a Cabela's, they may have a larger selection.
     
  10. kozak6

    kozak6 Member

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    $375 is a little high, but $375 OTD wouldn't be too bad compared to paying shipping, transfer and maybe tax.

    Bore condition is a huge deal. It's probably full of gunk, but it's so easy to remove the bolt you might as well have a peek.

    I think a bigger problem is ammo. Cheap 7.62x54r isn't a thing anymore, and without derailing the thread with politics, relations with Russia remain difficult.
     
  11. caribou

    caribou Member

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    Cheap milsurp 7.62-54r is gone, but there’s a variety of domesticly produced ammo available for target, hunting and what not, and it’s corrosive free priming for easier clean up
     
  12. Speedo66

    Speedo66 Member

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    AIM Surplus has Tula versions in stock.
     
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  13. Scooter22

    Scooter22 Member

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    I was told they were making them with their hammers and sickles.
     
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  14. Centurian22

    Centurian22 Member

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    Sadly no Cabela’s in the state of TN and Bass Pro is a few hours away. Thanks for the tip on Aim Surplus. If only I had kept my C&R current. If nothing else that gives me some leverage against the local shop on the price.

    As to ammo I still have a fair bit of my original 440 spam can left and these aren’t going to be shot in high volume. I also have some brass ammo and plan to get dies for reloading them. I also have always wanted to try one of the chamber adapters to shoot .32s&w long out of the Mosin as I already reload for those and it could be a low recoil way for the kids to shoot their firearms earlier than full power surplus loads would allow. Anyone have and use one of these adapters? I can’t imagine there being much to go wrong nor any risk of damage to the venerable Mosin from measly pistol round.
     
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  15. entropy

    entropy Member

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    Another solution, though getting harder to find, is the 46 gr. Czech training rounds. Loud, but no recoil. The East Germans also made a light round with an AK bullet on top of it as a training round. Again, not the easiest to find. You could of course always load some light loads in PPU or Graf's brass when you find some of that.
    Oh, and you only bought one spam can? :eek:
     
  16. GunnyUSMC

    GunnyUSMC Member

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    I’m sad to say that I only have one case of the Czech training ammo left. I should have bought more back in the day.
    I have about 40 rounds of the East German training ammo. If I remember right the boxes are marketed 7.62 Stuck, ot something like that.
    Bought of these rounds are very hard to find today.
    20335633-C9AF-4DF5-9C6B-A77914ECE639.jpeg
     
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  17. entropy

    entropy Member

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    Yup, 7.62 Stück. You have more of each than I do, Gunny. I have about 20 boxes of the Czech left, and a couple rounds of the E. German 'stuck' away.
     
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  18. fpgt72

    fpgt72 Member

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    Reloading for them is very rewarding.....you saw the comments about the machine work during the war....the ammo had the same "quality control" as....well anything did.

    I have a few cases of surplus left, and I doubt I will ever shoot it.....after I started loading 54R there was no point....not fun to me to shoot and not put the little hole where I want it to go. I don't have as many as others, but every one shot much better with home rolled ammo....or partizan.

    As to the price, it is what it is, long gone are the days of seeing them for under $100 in crates, we will never see that again. If in your area that is the going rate....that is the going rate unless you want to travel around.

    Here I have not seen one for less than $300....Really the only thing I am looking for is an American version, and have yet to find one that is in the shape I want it to be.
     
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  19. boom boom
    • Contributing Member

    boom boom Contributing Member

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    Major issue with low powered pistol cartridge adaptors is that you have to be darn sure that every bullet leaves the barrel or you risk having a ringed barrel or worse if you fire again. Easier to reload reduced loads for the Mosin cartridge itself using powders designed for that purpose. Mosins lend themselves pretty well to firing cast as well which generally results in less recoil and blast as well due to lower powder requirements. Also a slip on recoil pad can help both with length of pull and recoil.
     
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  20. Centurian22

    Centurian22 Member

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    A special thank you to Speedo66, this is the route I went. Kills me to Shell out just over 4 bills for a Mosin after shipping and transfer fee, but at least it’s a Tula, with a laminated stock and not a questionable condition chewed up 42 Izzy for the same price. I’ll post some pics next week when I pick it up. Thanks to all for the help info and discussion that talked me down from the local one I posted about.
     
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  21. Speedo66

    Speedo66 Member

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    My pleasure, glad I could be of assistance. Good luck with your new purchase!

    They’ve generally got good prices on ammo, too.
     
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  22. Chevelle SS

    Chevelle SS Member

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    I still pick them up locally through classified adds, auctions, yard sales, etc for $140 to $200. Heck, I traded an old trailer for one and $40. I think if you keep your eyes peeled you can come up with a better deal.
     
  23. Mullo98

    Mullo98 Member

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    Personally, I wouldn’t bother converting it to fire something other than .54R. I found Tula ammo at my local Walmart here in Mississippi. Fires just fine.
     
  24. I6turbo

    I6turbo Member

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    Speaking of modern-day Mosin values, what are you guys' guesses as to what a very nice 1939 Izhevsk would sell for these days? Would come with the accessories (bayonet, oil can, vintage sling, and tool), nice machine work, from the looks I assume it must have been put away post-war after an arsenal refurb, has good wood and wood finish, outstanding bluing, perfect crown, and barrel with pristine bore and rifling.

    Also available with it could come 400 rounds of 1976 Czech corrosive ammo, and 100 rounds of the 46-grain practice/low-recoil stuff.

    Your thoughts?
     
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  25. Mullo98

    Mullo98 Member

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    I’m not way an expert by any means; so please take what I say with a grain of salt. But I would say about 600 just for the rifle and goodies. Maybe a little above 700 with the ammo. Also is it a hex receiver? Those go for more I believe.
     
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