need history on what was used during the fur trade?

Status
Not open for further replies.

midland man

Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2014
Messages
2,377
Location
coalgate oklahoma
as I want to hunt with what they used back in the fur trade using either a trade musket in 20 guage as I am looking at some I like as I want to experience hunting with the weapons our ancestors used and also was there 32 caliber or 36 caliber rifles used back then as well? thanks guys!
 
I think trade guns and .36 .40 .45 .50 and .54 rifles.
I havent heard much about originals in .32.
The smaller bores were popular east of the Mississippi.
Hawken made big bores popular out west.
I believe the Corps of Discovery had .54 cal rifles.
Just my .02
 
I think the beginning started with 20 guage and greater muskets for large animals and maybe smaller ones for beaver . As rifling became the norm the caliber steadily shrunk to the .54, then .50 and finally in Cartridges .45 at the end
. All ways exceptions and hold overs tho.
 
That's the latter half of the history......in the other half of the country. The Fur Trade in North America began long before that.
 
I don't believe there is a standard for the fur trade, most likely trappers used what they had available at the time and location. Most likely a smooth bore was used for the versatility. As the trade went west the bore size increased as game encountered was bigger and more likely to hurt you. Research the time and location you are interested in and make your choice accordingly.
 
Fur traders used pretty much anything made in the previous 100 years from every part of America and Europe. Fur trade lasted about 250 years and people from all over the world took part in it. They used whatever gun they had or could buy. And don't forget about the Russian fur trade along the west coast.
 
Here is a thread I started here on this subject. I also started the same thread on TFL and got a different set of responses. Frankly they used what ever they could get their hands on. And no, it wasn't Hawken rifles. Maybe a few but more Kentucky/Pennsylvania rifles in bore sizes all over the map. And they had large bore rifles back east. In the beginning there were Moose, Bear, Elk and Bison in the eastern woods. They had large bores to hunt them with. The Germans were already using large bores in the old country and brought their guns guns and ideas with them when they set up shop in the east.

When the bison and moose and a lot of the deer were shot out then the smaller bores became popular. And when those eastern hunters went west they took the guns they already owned. No need to buy a new gun. And I am guessing many of those long barreled Kentucky rifles ended up getting their barrels cut back for better use on horse back.

My post here. https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/guns-of-the-mountain-men.841019/

The same thread on TFL. https://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=597926

Lots of good reading from guys that know know a lot more than I do.
 
About any accurate reproduction from around 1750 and newer will be an accurate gun for whatever time period you have in mind. An some of the best you can get on a budget are the Pedersoli's. No matter if the are rifles or smooth bores. Spend a little more and look at TVM. I have been tempted by them many times. I can resist anything but temptation.:uhoh:

You just need to figure out what time period you are interested in. And its all interesting.:thumbup:
 
There are several famous fur trade era trapper/ explorers who were said to carry Hawken rifles.
Joe Meek, Will Sublette, Kit Carson, Hugh Glass, Jim Bridger, Medina, Armored Farmer........
20161201_114659.jpg
I admit that it was certainly a small percentage of trappers who had Hawken rifles, yet their popularity and fame is undeniable.

Google "museum of the fur trade"
 
There are several famous fur trade era trapper/ explorers who were said to carry Hawken rifles.
Joe Meek, Will Sublette, Kit Carson, Hugh Glass, Jim Bridger, Medina, Armored Farmer........
View attachment 813516
I admit that it was certainly a small percentage of trappers who had Hawken rifles, yet their popularity and fame is undeniable.

Google "museum of the fur trade"
Not so sure that last one is a famous fur trade era trapper; I thought we were the same age, and I only feel 175 years old. ;)
 
I fully appreciate that THR is primarily a gun forum, BUT, I find it darn near impossible to believe that the fur boys were not copying the native ways and using bows and arrows when possible.

There is something special about building something yourself, using it yourself, and sustaining yourself with it. That’s why I enjoy reloading, fly tying, and the occasional carpentry project. I’m nowhere near the point of making a bow from a piece of wood, but that’s because I work, and can keep working under electric lighting. The fur traders had daylight, and campfire light to work with....they had time at night to carefully and skillfully craft bows, spears, and likely even atlatl. They likely also traded with natives who would teach them or trade traditional goods to them.

Now, back to your scheduled programming about wonderfully antiquated thunder sticks.
 
I fully appreciate that THR is primarily a gun forum, BUT, I find it darn near impossible to believe that the fur boys were not copying the native ways and using bows and arrows when possible.

There is something special about building something yourself, using it yourself, and sustaining yourself with it. That’s why I enjoy reloading, fly tying, and the occasional carpentry project. I’m nowhere near the point of making a bow from a piece of wood, but that’s because I work, and can keep working under electric lighting. The fur traders had daylight, and campfire light to work with....they had time at night to carefully and skillfully craft bows, spears, and likely even atlatl. They likely also traded with natives who would teach them or trade traditional goods to them.

Now, back to your scheduled programming about wonderfully antiquated thunder sticks.

Very few fur traders were so romantic, nor did they have "free time" after dark for such trifles, as they had gear to mend, spare mocassins to make (the average trapper wore out several pair of soft-sole mocs a week) food prep, running lead, patching clothes & making more... they did not have either the time nor the inclination for such fooferal as bows-n-arras unless they were free trappers and associated with a tribe. After all, they had their gun.

regarding the fire-arms:

I agree, , get "Firearms of the American West 1803-1865' by Garavaglia and Worman.

another one of the best books, Firearms of the Fur Trade by James A. Hanson:
https://www.furtrade.org/store/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=124


Firearms of the Mountain Men:
https://user.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/museum/guns/guns.html


Indian Trade Guns by Ned Eddins
http://thefurtrapper.com/home/indian-trade-guns/

Mountain Man's Rifle:
https://frontierpartisans.com/5123/the-mountain-mans-rifle/

typical fur trade era musket
http://www.militaryheritage.com/musket28.htm


amusing trivia:
http://thefurtrapper.com/home/fur-trade-trivia/

yhs
shunka
 
Just a thought when I think of the fur trade its primarily small mammals caught in traps, and outfits like the Hudson Bay Company, or individuals operating in the North West mountains. In this sense clubs would have been used to dispatch the trapped animal. One assumes the trapper would have a rifle for defense or maybe not.

The term "fur trade" spans such a period of time beginning in the 1600's thru the 1800's, from the early colonist trading with the Indians for pelts, to the French, Dutch and English setting up companies to the western mountain and the buffalo hunters, that one type or caliber of long gun would be very subjective. I think one would have to pick and research a specific time frame, early, middle or late history of the demand for pelts and hides.
 
well guys what I was looking for was around the time flintlocks were used so maybe 1750-1840 right before percussion guns came out? thanks for ya'lls help!
 
as I want to hunt with what they used back in the fur trade using either a trade musket in 20 guage as I am looking at some I like as I want to experience hunting with the weapons our ancestors used and also was there 32 caliber or 36 caliber rifles used back then as well? thanks guys!

I would check with the guys at the Muzzleloading Forum. They will certainly be able to guide you in the right direction.

https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top