Ohio -concealed carry in the car question
- Thread starter Atticus
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Lennyjoe
Member
That might be pushing it.
I know some states require a percentage of the gun (say 40%) to be exposed to qualify as "Open Carry".
Dont know what exacly Ohio's laws say as to what qualifies as "Open Carry"
I know some states require a percentage of the gun (say 40%) to be exposed to qualify as "Open Carry".
Dont know what exacly Ohio's laws say as to what qualifies as "Open Carry"
The law requires that it be carried in a holster- in plain sight (which is yet to be defined) or locked up.
I didn't realize what a pain this stipulation would be. The two CC holsters I own are best worn in the 4 o'clock position. I really don't want anyone to know I'm carrying, and that get's a little difficult if you have to move the holster around and/or remove the weapon from the holster entirely, particularly when you're parked in front of a busy store.
Maybe I can find a T-shirt that has a big arrow pointing down and is printed with- "My concealed carry gun is right here".
I didn't realize what a pain this stipulation would be. The two CC holsters I own are best worn in the 4 o'clock position. I really don't want anyone to know I'm carrying, and that get's a little difficult if you have to move the holster around and/or remove the weapon from the holster entirely, particularly when you're parked in front of a busy store.
Maybe I can find a T-shirt that has a big arrow pointing down and is printed with- "My concealed carry gun is right here".
goalie
Member
Get an 11 dollar Uncle Mike's holster and keep it in the glove box. Then when you get into the car, put it on the seat next to you in that holster.
That will work great when you don't have a passenger, and you won't have to take off the holster you are wearing.
That will work great when you don't have a passenger, and you won't have to take off the holster you are wearing.
Standing Wolf
Member in memoriam
Never—ever!—trust a R.I.N.O.
usp_fan
Member
My leather pancake sits in the exact location as yours and it blends into my jetta's interior. I just picked up a Fobus paddle hoster and find it easier to shift around so more of it showes when I sit in the car. It is easy to move back when I unbuckly and pull the shirt down.
I heard on the news this morning that someone has filed a challenge to this part of the law. Hope they make progress.
usp_fan
I heard on the news this morning that someone has filed a challenge to this part of the law. Hope they make progress.
usp_fan
TheBluesMan
Senior Member
I would say that it doesn't cut it Atticus. Plain sight to me means "Free from obstructions; open; clear; obvious." Of course it doesn't matter what it means to me, it matters what it means to the Attorney General, your local DA, and your friendly neighborhood police officer.
I've been carrying in a cheap Uncle Mikes IWB like goalie mentioned. I move it to SOB and cover it up with my shirt when outside my car. I unclip it and move it to 10 o'clock (cross draw style, OWB) for driving. My seat belt lays under my holster, keeping the grip and the entire holster in plain sight.
I've also carried at 3 o'clock with a paddle holster while driving. Not very comfortable.
This stipulation is a *real* pain.
Wanna know who's carrying at your local grocery store? When a car pulls into the parking lot and the driver does gymnastics in the front seat for 2 minutes before exiting the car - they might be packing.
It is very difficult to be discreet about carrying with the law this way.
I've been carrying in a cheap Uncle Mikes IWB like goalie mentioned. I move it to SOB and cover it up with my shirt when outside my car. I unclip it and move it to 10 o'clock (cross draw style, OWB) for driving. My seat belt lays under my holster, keeping the grip and the entire holster in plain sight.
I've also carried at 3 o'clock with a paddle holster while driving. Not very comfortable.
This stipulation is a *real* pain.
Wanna know who's carrying at your local grocery store? When a car pulls into the parking lot and the driver does gymnastics in the front seat for 2 minutes before exiting the car - they might be packing.
It is very difficult to be discreet about carrying with the law this way.
And the answer is...
...I have no damn clue.
Atticus, you hit the nail on the head when you said that there has not yet been a test case. To me, "in plain view on your person" would mean that it would not be concealed by your clothing or any other holster/bag/etc, but the seat or seatbelt or other interior car parts might obstruct the view of it, depending on the angle of the viewer. However, I am also not very likely to be going out of my way to hem up a CCW holder. YMMV, depending upon who you get on the traffic stop. I can also understand (but not be happy about) an interp of "in plain view" being more strict than that.
One way to help deal with this might be to carry it thus, but if pulled over immediately unbuckle your seat belt, turn so that is is even more visible, and put your hands on the steering wheel. When the cop walks up the first thing you should say is "I have a CCW permit and the gun is on my right hip." That way he can look, see the gun, and decide how to proceed.
Could you still end up being a test case? Yeah. You sure could. I'm not particularly happy about this provision, either. Its dumb.
Also, the idea of a paddle holster that gets tucked into your waist up front has real merit. #1, it is hard to argue that this is not in very plain view. #2 drawing from it (which is always hard using strongside IWB in the car) should be a snap.
Be warned: I don't think that carrying it in a holster laying on the seat beside you will work. I don't have the text of the law on hand, but IIRC it needs to be in plain view on your person, or locked up. Not in a holster laying beside you.
Silly law.
Mike
...I have no damn clue.
Atticus, you hit the nail on the head when you said that there has not yet been a test case. To me, "in plain view on your person" would mean that it would not be concealed by your clothing or any other holster/bag/etc, but the seat or seatbelt or other interior car parts might obstruct the view of it, depending on the angle of the viewer. However, I am also not very likely to be going out of my way to hem up a CCW holder. YMMV, depending upon who you get on the traffic stop. I can also understand (but not be happy about) an interp of "in plain view" being more strict than that.
One way to help deal with this might be to carry it thus, but if pulled over immediately unbuckle your seat belt, turn so that is is even more visible, and put your hands on the steering wheel. When the cop walks up the first thing you should say is "I have a CCW permit and the gun is on my right hip." That way he can look, see the gun, and decide how to proceed.
Could you still end up being a test case? Yeah. You sure could. I'm not particularly happy about this provision, either. Its dumb.
Also, the idea of a paddle holster that gets tucked into your waist up front has real merit. #1, it is hard to argue that this is not in very plain view. #2 drawing from it (which is always hard using strongside IWB in the car) should be a snap.
Be warned: I don't think that carrying it in a holster laying on the seat beside you will work. I don't have the text of the law on hand, but IIRC it needs to be in plain view on your person, or locked up. Not in a holster laying beside you.
Silly law.
Mike
FJC
Member
Is loaded, but stored in a locked glove box acceptable? Or does the statued require it be unloaded with ammo in a separate container if stored in a locked container?
Greybeard
Member
Quote: "I heard on the news this morning that someone has filed a challenge to this part of the law. Hope they make progress."
Amen to that. I was real glad to hear you guys finally got a carry law, but this car provision is RE-DICK-U-LOSE.
FWIW, our original CHL provision in Tejas had some flaws that, in general, took the first couple of years to get identified and corrected.
Amen to that. I was real glad to hear you guys finally got a carry law, but this car provision is RE-DICK-U-LOSE.
FWIW, our original CHL provision in Tejas had some flaws that, in general, took the first couple of years to get identified and corrected.
Yes, thats fine. Loaded and locked in a glove box or locked in a container in plain view is acceptable per the law. What is bad about that is that it is not exactly the quickest means of accessing the gun if you need it. Also, some glove boxes don't lock...what if your car doesn't have one? Is a case that is bolted to the vehicle body (like some of the car vaults) acceptable if it is not in plain view? Again, no caselaw.
It will take a while to get rulings on this. And, needless to say, don't be that guy.
Mike
NoHarmNoFAL
Member
This may sound stupid but I saw a guy at a gunshow show a customer how to use one of those "belly band" holsters as a thigh rig. He said use a small one and just leave it in the car when you get in wrap it around your leg and you are good to go. Not perfect at all, but a solution. This "Open carry in a car" crap has to go. I think they knew this was a ND waiting to happen so that they could use it as a way to say that we are not responsible enough to carry firearms. This whole state is starting to suck more and more. If they pass the AWB in Ohio like they tried a few months back I will leave this blood sucking state. Being a small business owner this state is not business friendly at all, no wander there is higher unemployment here they tax the crap out of you.
:banghead: 
:banghead:
SORRY [Rant OFF]
:banghead: :banghead: SORRY [Rant OFF]
edison
Member
I went back to the Ohioans for Concealed Carry website.
Coronach is correct, the weapon must be on the permit holder's body and in "plain" sight.
Ohio Revised Code 2923.16 (E) and (E)1 state: (E) No person who has been issued a license or temporary emergency license to carry a concealed handgun under section 2923.125 or 2923.1213 of the Revised Code shall do any of the following: (1) Knowingly transport or have a loaded handgun in a motor vehicle unless the loaded handgun either is in a holster and in plain sight on the person's person or it is securely encased by being stored in a closed, locked glove compartment or in a case that is in plain sight and that is locked;
I will await clarification from the AG's office. I see this policy as a jail cell waiting to happen.
edison
Coronach is correct, the weapon must be on the permit holder's body and in "plain" sight.
Ohio Revised Code 2923.16 (E) and (E)1 state: (E) No person who has been issued a license or temporary emergency license to carry a concealed handgun under section 2923.125 or 2923.1213 of the Revised Code shall do any of the following: (1) Knowingly transport or have a loaded handgun in a motor vehicle unless the loaded handgun either is in a holster and in plain sight on the person's person or it is securely encased by being stored in a closed, locked glove compartment or in a case that is in plain sight and that is locked;
I will await clarification from the AG's office. I see this policy as a jail cell waiting to happen.
edison
The best solution I have come up with so far for this stupid portion of our CCW law is to A) carry in a shoulder rig, or B) keep a fobus roto-style paddle holster in the car for my carry piece.
My normal attire when I'm not at work (where I can't carry anyway, grr...) is a t-shirt with an unbuttoned overshirt over that. This makes shoulder carry convenient, and when I get in my truck I either take off the overshirt or just pull it back behind me so the rig is exposed.
If I'm carrying IWB or something like that, my seat belt and arm rest would conceal the gun, so I keep a Fobus rotating paddle holster in the truck. That way I can simply put the gun in the paddle holster and clip it to my left jeans pocket, so the gun is completely exposed and readily available in a cross-draw position.
Sure, I hope that this portion of the law becomes a little easier to deal with in the future, but for the time being, I'm fairly comfortable with my techniques here.
-Parke1
My normal attire when I'm not at work (where I can't carry anyway, grr...) is a t-shirt with an unbuttoned overshirt over that. This makes shoulder carry convenient, and when I get in my truck I either take off the overshirt or just pull it back behind me so the rig is exposed.
If I'm carrying IWB or something like that, my seat belt and arm rest would conceal the gun, so I keep a Fobus rotating paddle holster in the truck. That way I can simply put the gun in the paddle holster and clip it to my left jeans pocket, so the gun is completely exposed and readily available in a cross-draw position.
Sure, I hope that this portion of the law becomes a little easier to deal with in the future, but for the time being, I'm fairly comfortable with my techniques here.
-Parke1
TheBluesMan
Senior Member
I thought of carrying in a holster strapped to my thigh like flatrock suggested, but I have two problems. My 5 y.o and my 10 y.o.
There are many advantages to carrying concealed, not the least of which is discretion. I don't want to have either of my daughters blabbing around school that their dad carries a gun in his car. They don't need to know, but the law makes it so I have to make it obvious to anyone inside or outside of the car.
Having to physically move the firearm from one holster to another isn't just an inconvenience, it is a safety issue. A holstered firearm isn't going to just "go off." Unholstering and reholstering increases the chances of an ND. So which is safer? The one that is against the law; leaving it concealed all the time.
Oh, and I priced changing out my non-locking glove box latch for a locking one from my dealer. $50 - just for the lock and latch. This for a lock that anyone can open with a crowbar in 3 seconds... No thanks...
As annoyed as I am with this law, it is better than what we had before. We need to continue to keep pressure on the legislature to liberalize it.
There are many advantages to carrying concealed, not the least of which is discretion. I don't want to have either of my daughters blabbing around school that their dad carries a gun in his car. They don't need to know, but the law makes it so I have to make it obvious to anyone inside or outside of the car.
Having to physically move the firearm from one holster to another isn't just an inconvenience, it is a safety issue. A holstered firearm isn't going to just "go off." Unholstering and reholstering increases the chances of an ND. So which is safer? The one that is against the law; leaving it concealed all the time.
Oh, and I priced changing out my non-locking glove box latch for a locking one from my dealer. $50 - just for the lock and latch. This for a lock that anyone can open with a crowbar in 3 seconds... No thanks...
As annoyed as I am with this law, it is better than what we had before. We need to continue to keep pressure on the legislature to liberalize it.
Call a junk yard about your glovebox. Odds are they'll have one that will match perfectly. Even if it doesn't have a key, any good parts dept. should code the glovebox cylinder to your car key for a minimal charge.
(can you tell I work in a parts dept?!?)
-Parke1
(can you tell I work in a parts dept?!?)
-Parke1
I guess I have another week or so before the Sherriff's office calls with my CCW. I did find the pistol I want to carry (G26) and bought a cheapo Fobus paddle holster.
I've tried using a modified ankle holster strapped to my thigh. That works ok but I'm still handling a loaded gun in the vehicle.
I decided to just go with the paddle and move it from 3:00 where I carry to 2:00 and tuck my shirt in behind the gun so it's visable.
I agree I don't like removing a gun from the holster. Heck, with the number of times I get in and out I'd wear out the holster or gun finish in a matter of weeks.
As was said, it's just an unsafe practice to keep moving it.
gbourne, I shoot at Salem Rifle/Pistol club. Nice place and people.
I've tried using a modified ankle holster strapped to my thigh. That works ok but I'm still handling a loaded gun in the vehicle.
I decided to just go with the paddle and move it from 3:00 where I carry to 2:00 and tuck my shirt in behind the gun so it's visable.
I agree I don't like removing a gun from the holster. Heck, with the number of times I get in and out I'd wear out the holster or gun finish in a matter of weeks.
As was said, it's just an unsafe practice to keep moving it.
gbourne, I shoot at Salem Rifle/Pistol club. Nice place and people.
"I thought of carrying in a holster strapped to my thigh like flatrock suggested, but I have two problems. My 5 y.o and my 10 y.o."
Bluesman- I have the same issue. I already get enough strange looks and comments from our association of soccer moms and elementary teachers as it is.
I have been playing around with positions again and have found that I can carry the PSP at the 2:00 position without tooo much discomfort. I drive a low riding Camry much of the time now and I have gotten a couple of strange looks from the people next to me in traffic....but oh well...it's THE LAW FOLKS.
Bluesman- I have the same issue. I already get enough strange looks and comments from our association of soccer moms and elementary teachers as it is.
I have been playing around with positions again and have found that I can carry the PSP at the 2:00 position without tooo much discomfort. I drive a low riding Camry much of the time now and I have gotten a couple of strange looks from the people next to me in traffic....but oh well...it's THE LAW FOLKS.
braindead0
Member
It's worse for motorcyclists, I get on my scoot and I've gotta tuck my cover under the gun.... Luckily, people don't notice much cause I distract them with my hair 
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