President Trump to address gun violence

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".... I can't say I oppose it either." What low-down, cowardly Democrat do you shill for? Just take all of your dirty, nasty guns -- if you really own any, which is extremely doubtful -- and carry them all down to your local police station and turn them in. That will fix the problem of at least one unstable, mentally impaired person having access to firearms.
 
There has been a change. The assassinations and mass shooting have brought on change. The media is blamed for giving these shooters glory of a sort after after the mass shootings. I don't know how many people can name more than one or two mass shooters. Possibly, they can relate the right shooter to the correct mass shootings.

My feeling is this is a plague world wide. How many days pass without our being told about a mass killing someplace for a cause. I ask the question how do you control between two hundred and seventy five million and three hundred and twenty five million firearms in this country. Divide the number of firearms used in these shooting by the number of firearms in American. See what sort of answer you get percent wise.
 
It doesn't make any sense. Pass UBC and stuff like this will still happen so we'll need more laws. Pass magazine capacity restrictions and stuff like this will still happen. Ban Assault rifles and stuff like this will still happen. 2/3rds of often quoted 30,000 gun deaths per are suicides. You'll have to ban everything up to and including single shot pistols to make any impact on that number. Passing more gun laws isn't going to stop gang violence.

But, but, but we need to do something....! There are a lot of people out there with no interest in guns so making it harder to own guns, banning magazines, banning features on guns will make no difference to them at all. Passing ineffective laws will allow them to feel better for at least a couple of minutes...

A total gun ban would have little effect on the number of suicides. Look at Japan, literally no civilian owned firearms and a suicide rate higher than that in the US. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate
 
".... I can't say I oppose it either." What low-down, cowardly Democrat do you shill for? Just take all of your dirty, nasty guns -- if you really own any, which is extremely doubtful -- and carry them all down to your local police station and turn them in. That will fix the problem of at least one unstable, mentally impaired person having access to firearms.
Who are you quoting?
 
This statement, I am sure will not be sufficient god some in power but it shows that Trump is looking at the acts versus the the guns

FROM THE ARTICLE:
“Mental illness and hatred pulls the trigger, not the gun," Trump said, going on to call for red-flag laws to allow the seizure of firearms from those judged to pose a grave risk to public safety.

This is from this article: https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-shootings-remarks.amp

The statement below sends chills up my back.

FROM THE ARTICLE:
"We must do a better job at identifying and acting on early warning signs," Trump said. "I am directing the Department of Justice to work in partnership with local, state, and federal agencies and social media companies to develop tools to identify mass shooters before they strike."

Imagine you are here on The High Road or another pro gun or shooting forum and you receive an updated “Users Agreement”, or whatever it may be called, telling you that everything you say may be monitored by the government. Or worse, you get into an argument with someone online or have a disagreement only to find your actions have gotten the attention of a Federal or local law enforcement or justice bureaucrat.

It doesn’t take many of the wrong words to make someone look like a threat...

Of course there was backlash to Trump’s speech. What he said didn’t follow “the agenda”.

Exactly. This is ripe for abuse and Trump knows it! Are we to expect those in power at some of these agencies who have clearly been operating above the law to somehow apply it fairly to us? Has Trump lost his mind? He constantly takes hits from the so called swamp and openly talks about how vile certain aspects of the media and the gov is yet wants them to monitor us? In what universe does that make sense? Again this is ripe for abuse? Why should I trust any gov agency to decide what is supposed to be a God-given natural right? No gov agency should be allowed to take away what exists naturally. We are either free or we aren’t.

The most important aspect of this is whatever gun control bills are proposed we all need to hammer on them hard and bombard our reps with emails/letters/calls (whatever you prefer). We've done a really good job of defeating additional gun control bills that they hurl at us one after the other, whatever comes in the near future will have to be dealt with the same way. Even more so by individuals with the chaos going on in the NRA (maybe that chaos won't affect their ILA branch at the moment).

I agree but many of us are growing tired. The BOR is pretty dang clear and cut. Imo, we shouldn’t have to waste precious time constantly defending our rights. We are either free or we aren’t. Constantly begging lawmakers to please not get rid of our rights with the stroke of a pen is not the actions of a free people!

News flash.

The government has been monitoring internet, email, cellphone, social media, texting traffic etc. for a long time, certainly after 9/11 attack.

Can't confirm this but when I worked in IT as support project manager for a pilot program, I got the feeling and notion that many companies, like Microsoft, are required to monitor and forward to DHS any red flags they detect to ensure the safety and security of USA.

Don't worry, if you are typical gun enthusiast and post on THR, you are likely "grouped" with other pro-gun/2A patriots than those posting on social media that they are going to kill people with repeated hateful rant which will immediately trigger a red flag.

You are 100% correct. See my posts above. Why should any of these people be trusted with deciding who gets flagged and who doesn’t? A simple photo of someone at the range losing with their gun is violent and offensive to some people.

This morning Hugh Hewitt said that "red flag" laws would not be abused.

Somebody ought to ask him if he feels the same way about the FISA courts...

Boom! Clearly, they should not be trusted!

Yea right, all politicians can at times abuse laws if it fits their purpose, it's why we have to be careful about passing them in the first place.

Couldn’t have said it better myself! It’s a slipperly slope, death by 1000 cuts and they have shown they are fine playing the long winded game.
 
Naming the problem and calling it a solution is a liberal dilemma . I made the statement once that none of the mass shooters belonged to an organized shooting association. I was corrected. One of the mass shooters was in an NRA sponsored air rifle program. How many of these shooters have run afoul of the mental health systems in their community. I know of times where the police took firearms from MI persons with no court review period. Frankly, this situation with the potential shooters is a screwed up mess.

How much of this monitoring should be a local or state government responsibility? Inviting the Federal Government to deal with this is a setup for a disaster. Also, too many **** house lawyers have contributed to the confusion.

As I was writing this post a notification came up that another person from the El Paso shooting had died.
 
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Partisan politics and video games do not make people suicidal. The suicide rate among non-elderly is up 25% since 1999 (it's up 33% overall). If the portion of the suicidal that are willing to take others with them is up proportionally, then the spike in suicides becomes a security concern. The rational explanation for guns, as opposed to explosives, fire or poisoning, as the choice of weapon for the homicidal-suicidal is that they want to personally witness the death of their victims to experience the empowerment of taking others' lives prior to their own.

I understand that most studies have shown that gun control reduces suicide rates by firearm, but not overall suicide rates. Similarly, high rates of gun possession is not correlated with increased suicide rates, but can be associated with a prevalence of firearms as the method of choice. It's unconvincing that guns make people want to kill themselves, or that not having guns change peoples' mind about wanting to be dead.

There would be tremendous progress if we could just roll back suicide rates to 1999 levels. Even in states like California where suicide rates are lower than national averages, we've still seen a 24.8% increase between 2001 and 2016. We hear a lot about "mental health," but only in vague terms that seem to be nothing more than a deflection from gun control. Enacting gun-control while leaving the alarming rate of growth in suicides unaddressed can only serve the agenda of those who are truly pro-death.
 
Magazines/feeds limited to 5 rounds maximum in ALL FIREARMS. All other magazine will become illegal to own or possess. No grandfathering.

This is my guess. It allows owners to keep there firearms, for now.
That's too extreme and severely harms any home owner or conceal carrier who may need to defend themselves. 5 rds is not a lot, especially when Antifa attacks in groups and most burglaries have multiple home invaders.
 
There are far to many individuals that on a daily basis interrupt the lives of others. The media in their goal for ratings finds the firearms side far to easy to propagate. This falls right into the political agenda. Those in office are people that are typically bright well educated people. What we hear over the media seems a play to reach the masses that are incapable of separating this sensationalism out. <SMH>
 
I don' like the idea of giving up any rights any time for any reason, unless I break the law.
Oh, I agree, but I look at the situation and see that it's either nothing happens, which is only going to motivate the anti gun side and make their reaction when they take power in the future even worse, Congress and Trump have a knee jerk reaction and cave in to them now, or we find some kind of middle ground.

I'd rather see a semi auto ban for those under 25 than an outright semi auto ban for everyone of all ages.

We have a problem in the Pro 2A community where we're obsessed with pitching a perfect game, lose focus on the big picture, and wind up giving a home run to the other side because we were looking for perfection when limiting the other side to singles doesn't get them as far as they think.
 
I understand that most studies have shown that gun control reduces suicide rates by firearm, but not overall suicide rates.

Is suicide a or mental health or gun problem? To me, having worked in the field, suicide by other means is under reported. Ask an old time cop about single car accidents. These numbers suck. I have been in anti-gun meetings where it was stated (I'm not making this up) that having a gun facilitates suicide. Also, the if guns were taken up suicides would end.

I ask how many of the shootings are suicide by cop while going out in a blaze of glory.

Addendum: Doing a forensic autopsy the first thing to look for is an active substance use disorder.
 
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Bravo to our President. I found this to be one of the most sensible approach to gun violence I have heard. Going to the root of the cause. As Our President stated. Mental health and hatred pull the Trigger not the gun. And, I will take some heat for this, but I despise the Disgusting Video games that I have seen. When I first saw my son playing one, with the violence and killing on a stupid game. I took him aside and had a long talk with him. They are ugly, and yes there is a developing culture that has started with the Young.
School systems have to change for starters. No more violence tolerated at all. No more for Bus Drivers to have to pull over to the side and Call the Police. And Please reform the Obama Initiative act of 2013 that blamed teachers for the amount of disproportionate referral rates.
We have got to go after the root cause. And yes, the consequences of the attacker has to be dealt with quickly.

May God Bless America, our Flag, our Troops, our Police and our President.
 
I think that if they are really serious about stopping "gun violence" that they need to enact a total ban on all civilian ownership of firearms and ammunition.

Look how well it has worked for drugs. Additionally, you can also see the resounding success of Prohibition.

Sheesh, some of these folks think that they can wave a magic wand and all the guns will go away. What they don't realize is that the problem resides in the human heart, and not in the gun store. Until governments are able to do what God alone can we will continue to have these problems and there isn't a single law that they can pass to change things.
 
There is pretty solid evidence that the press coverage of the El Paso shooter - apparently a white supremacist - is what triggered the Dayton shooter - an extreme leftist, according to his web accounts.
So, is the press responsible for either or both shootings?
Is politics and politicians the cause?
How about insanity and stupidity?
Maybe all of the above?
 
Oh, I agree, but I look at the situation and see that it's either nothing happens, which is only going to motivate the anti gun side and make their reaction when they take power in the future even worse, Congress and Trump have a knee jerk reaction and cave in to them now, or we find some kind of middle ground.

I'd rather see a semi auto ban for those under 25 than an outright semi auto ban for everyone of all ages.

We have a problem in the Pro 2A community where we're obsessed with pitching a perfect game, lose focus on the big picture, and wind up giving a home run to the other side because we were looking for perfection when limiting the other side to singles doesn't get them as far as they think.
So, you are OK with a little bit of tyranny and infringement? What happens when that doesn't work and they want more?

May your chains set lightly on you.
 
And, I will take some heat for this, but I despise the Disgusting Video games that I have seen. When I first saw my son playing one, with the violence and killing on a stupid game. I took him aside and had a long talk with him.

Nobody should be bothered by your personal distaste for video games.

But there is a mountain of evidence that, no, playing violent video games doesn't increase incident rates of violent behavior.

Like guns, the vast, vast majority of people can be exposed to infinite amounts of video games and never become a murderer.
 
There is pretty solid evidence that the press coverage of the El Paso shooter - apparently a white supremacist - is what triggered the Dayton shooter - an extreme leftist, according to his web accounts.
So, is the press responsible for either or both shootings?
Is politics and politicians the cause?
How about insanity and stupidity?
Maybe all of the above?

The Dayton shooter had been simmering for a long time, so I don't know if "triggered" is the right word, here.

But overall, there is a VERY good reason to suspect that the media coverage of this "mind virus" is the primary means of its propagation.
 
Sheesh, some of these folks think that they can wave a magic wand and all the guns will go away. What they don't realize is that the problem resides in the human heart, and not in the gun store. Until governments are able to do what God alone can we will continue to have these problems and there isn't a single law that they can pass to change things.
MORE sheesh! Expecting politicians (which are the mature form of lawyers) to effectively end a cause of crime and litigation is like expecting carnivores to ban the consumption of meat.
Even if you are an atheist, you'll find that prayer works better... .
 
Look, when somebody is decompensating there concept of realty goes. These people have no impulse control and cannot do a reality check. Most people of the El Paso shooters disposition is usually assigned to the right wing not left.
 
From The Art of the Deal President Trump offered this deal with the Democrats...

"Republicans and Democrats must come together and get strong background checks, perhaps marrying this legislation with desperately needed immigration reform."

Since the Democrat candidates for President on running on both strict gun control laws and open borders he knows that the deal is unacceptable to all of them. In doing so he is attempting to shift the blame back to the Democrats by saying "I am offering to work out a deal with the Democrats but they are not serious about ending the violence caused by guns and illegal immigrates."

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation...-to-stronger-gun-checks-but-offers-no-details
 
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