Puma 87 for home defense?

[chaim]

OK, I'm aware that most people consider a good 12ga to be the best home defense weapon. I don't disagree, but I'm also a fan of carbines for the purpose. For me, I especially like lever rifle/carbines- they are handy, and I find the lever action to be smooth, fast, comfortable, and (for range time) fun. I also really dislike my HD shotgun (a Benelli Nova), though I did like the Mossberg 500 Persuader I had years ago and would consider trading for that. I have a .45LC Winchester 94 which I bought for home defense but isn't 100% reliable (.45LC isn't always great in lever rifles, the Win 94 action was designed for rifle cartridges and isn't always great with pistol rounds). So, I have been considering a Win 92 clone or a Marlin in either .357mag or .44mag.

Well, I've recently become aware of the Puma 87, a lever action 5 round 12ga shotgun based on the Winchester 1887.

http://www.legacysports.com/products/puma/puma_bhunterm87shot.html


So, does anyone have one? How would it be for home defense?

Is it too big and heavy and lose the benefits (other than the action) of a lever rifle? How big and heavy is it compared to a pump shotgun? How is the recoil out of this design?

In addition to liking the lever action (even if the size doesn't work so well, though I doubt the 22" barrel would be that bad), I like the idea of a nice, innocuous looking, wood stocked home defense gun. I live in MD so this could matter (DAs are quick to charge people even in very good home defense shootings, civil action would be a near guarantee, and the more PC looking the gun the better). Not being seen as a "Rambo wannabe" could be very helpful when the DA is considering charges, and certainly in front of a MD criminal or civil jury.

One big negative is the cost. Anywhere near the $1239 MSRP and I could pretty easily get a nice semi-auto shotgun. A semi would cut the felt recoil which would mean quicker follow up shots. I'm sure I could get a wood stocked semi (I think they are still made, aren't they) so I could get the nice "grandpa's hunting gun" PC look for any possible legal concerns.

 

[TomADC]

I think any mutilple shot shotgun will work for HD, as long as you have used it and are comfortable with it.
How about this one all else fails you could mount the bayonet.

 

[zhyla]

I find lever actions awkward. I'm sure it would work, but you're not going to get a 2nd shot off very quickly. An old wood-stocked pump would serve you better... and send me the $1000 I just saved you.

 

[Milkmaster]

While I love the lever action guns, I do not think they are as dead reliable as a quality, well acquainted, and broken in good pump gun. That would count for a lot with me for HD.

 

[chaim]

I find lever actions awkward. I'm sure it would work, but you're not going to get a 2nd shot off very quickly.

zhyla, is that in general or just with lever action shotguns. If you mean in general, I am a big fan of lever actions. With practice a person can shoot a lever action rifle as fast as many semi-autos. Personally, I am very quick with one and greatly enjoy working with a lever action. If you mean just with shotguns, what makes the lever action different in a shotgun than in a rifle or carbine? Is it a different design that just didn't work or does modifying the action for shotgun shells not work very well?

 

[zhyla]

I'm speaking just from my limited experience w/ lever action carbines.

 

[Dave McCracken]

I've owned and loved some L/A rifles, and there's a nice 94 in 30-30 not too far from me right now.

The old 10 and 12 gauge lever actions had some issues and were not nearly as easy to use as the 97 Winchester and 93 Marlin. The latter was under engineered for smokeless powder and fell by the wayside thereby.

I've shot one of the clone LAs and am not impressed. Clunky feel, bad balance and awkward stroke.

And I like MOST shotguns.....

 

[janobles14]

hey it worked for the terminator!

 

[NG VI]

How on Earth is that Bounty Hunter considered a pistol with the grip shaped in that way? Does that mean that anyone who does the natural thing and uses the "pistol" grip as a stock violates NFA SBR laws?

 

[VA27]

I have one of the Norinco 87's and they are a hoot! I took it to a skeet shoot when I first got it and folks stood in line to shoot it. When we ran out of 12ga shells one guy went home for more!

The 87 action has to be open to load it. Not necessarily bad, just different. As with a pump gun, you must work the action like you are trying to break it for it to function properly. Reliable ejection depends on a vigorous opening stroke. If you have short arms you'll really have to work at it or have the stock shortened some. Again not bad, just different.

I haven't seen one of the Chiappa 87s, but for the price I'd hope that they're quality pieces. I would have no problem using one for SD/HD. Like any other firearm, learn to run the gun.

I've heard, but have no proof, that the 22" barreled gun is two shot only. The catalog doesn't show mag capacity. If it has a full mag, that's the one I'd pick.

 

[Fred Fuller]

JMHO...

If you like lever guns, get yourself a reliable carbine in a caliber you like and use that.

If you want a shotgun, invest the effort to learn how to be fully comfortable with and confident in a reliable pumpgun or semiauto.

Makes no difference to me what a person uses for HD, but it should be as reliable as humans can make it, and it should be the firearm that individual is most confident in their own ability to use- handgun, rifle or shotgun is mostly irrelevant.

YMMV of course-

lpl