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REI trying to bully Vista Outdoors (aka Savage Arms)

Discussion in 'Activism' started by D.B. Cooper, Mar 3, 2018.

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  1. D.B. Cooper

    D.B. Cooper Member

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    I opened this thread Mar 2, 2018. Today is April 14, 2019. I just received in the mail a card from REI that says: "You've been kinda off the grid lately...We haven't heard from you lately..." and it includes a coupon for $30 off my next purchase of $150. It's signed by the local store manager. I guess they do notice. LOL
     
  2. BigSteve57

    BigSteve57 Member

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    Somehow this thread escaped my notice. Thanks for the reminder on this.
     
  3. edwardware

    edwardware Member

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    Good, now you know where to direct your note politely explaining why you've taken your business elsewhere.
     
  4. rpenmanparker

    rpenmanparker Member

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    Naturally nobody here takes the REI statement at face value, that they want firearms manufacturers to be part of a solution to the violence and not necessarily an infringement of gun rights. There was not a single word about taking away gun rights. Sure that could be the result, but it was not stated as a goal. If you can’t get behind a position like REI’s, what hope is there for a meeting of the minds?

    That BS about gun advocates being the majority will destroy us. You can believe it if you want and disregard what you consider the lying polls, but it will not avail you. Too many folks want a fix and not just business as usual. The only hope for long term protection of gun rights in the USA is dialogue and understanding, two things that the NRA works to undermine every second of every day. If you could solve the issue by working together with the other side, what would you need the NRA for, eh?
     
  5. <*(((><
    • Contributing Member

    <*(((>< Luke

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    Companies like REI, Dick's, CITI bank, etc. are being disingenuous with their fake outrage over "gun violence." They use their politics to believe they can rally customers to them in the fervor of a whipped up frenzy by the sold out media of today's world. Activism in this country is at a fever pitch at every level from personal, businesses, organizations, and political like nothing seen before. In today's world people are self-loathing in the fact that they are Americans; American's who are founded on the principles set forth in the founding documents of this GREAT country. They don't want change in the sense of going through the correct channels of change set forth by our Constitution. They want to strip us of our rights endowed by our Creator without prejudice.

    There is a right way of changing or abolishing the 2nd Amendment and the 1st for that matter; they choose to try evoke change by circumventing the established method of changing such determined founding principles. They support legislation that continues to dilute the Constitution and Bill of Rights that made this country great. I'm appalled that Americans who've enjoyed living in the greatest nation ever established on this Earth; are so willing to throw away the established principles of government and rights that so much blood was spilt to secure.

    So no, I DO NOT TAKE REI's statement at face value, they are anti-American in their beliefs as they are not calling for a convention of states to abolish the 2nd Amendment they are calling for a circumvention of our founding documents through feigned statement of "do something about gun violence". How can firearm manufacturers be a part of the solution of a HEART problem within humans. There is wickedness in this world and to point fingers at manufacturers of inanimate objects is delusional. And firearm owners who think that the wickedness of man will suddenly stop with coming up with a "solution to the gun violence," then there is too much naivety for any discussion of substance. I'll leave you all and REI with this: "Cain killed Able with a Rock". Man has been killing each other from the beginning of time, and the world has seen what happens when freedoms start to get eroded from a citizenry.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2019
  6. George Dickel

    George Dickel Member

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    You're going to have to explain how gun manufacturers can stop violence. I've heard some reports about rising knife violence in England where it is becoming a major problem, so how is a gun manufacturer going to affect that? Back in the late 80s' or early 90"s a read a report on violence in Mexico. It is extremely difficult to legally purchase a firearm there, nearly impossible for the average individual. The country had more knife homicides than we did from all forms of homicide. How is that related to firearms? Using that flawed logic lets put pressure on baseball bat, knife, golf club, crowbar, motor vehicle, pressure cooker, and screwdriver manufactures to help solve the violence problem. Violence is violence whether by gun, knife, bludgeon, axe or bare hands, gun manufacturers have no ability to correct human behavior. Sensible gun control rhetoric from the left means one thing, banning of all firearms. They used to be quite open about their stance but have had to hide that goal in the garbage of "sensible gun control" because talk of total banning was not going anywhere. Their goal is banning guns, period, don't be so gullible as to believe their propaganda.
     
    George P, Tilos and Bottom Gun like this.
  7. LiveLife

    LiveLife Member

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    I bet and they can suck it.

    tenor.gif

    Gun owners as a collective have been boycotting anti-gun/anti-2A corporations/companies for decades and especially more in recent years after their public announcements/PRs. With potentially tens of millions of gun owners boycotting, buying power moving away to their competition could be significant.

    I am sure by now they have enough year-to-year sales data to show the effects of gun owners boycotting.

    Think about it. EVERYDAY, people become new gun owners all across the country. YES, EVERYDAY! Guns are not consumable items; so when people become new gun owners, they tend to keep guns for life and stay gun owners for life. And based on my short life experience of 53 years, many of these new gun owners become pro-gun/pro-2A, which means number of gun owners and their families boycotting could grow over time, as once gun owners start boycott on a corporation/company, they tend to not change their mind.

    Just look at gun owners' response to revelation that Benchmade has been destroying guns and donating to anti-gun lawmakers for years - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/benchmade-is-in-trouble.847943/page-3#post-11068755

    And when Benchmade tried to do damage control, they made the situation worse - https://www.alloutdoor.com/2019/03/04/benchmade-attempts-damage-control-gun-talk-radio/

    Benchmade is now dead to many gun owners, including me. I will join other gun owners and take my buying power to Benchmade's competition. Will this affect Benchmade's bottom line? You bet.

    Gun owners' collective response to Benchmade's decisions to support anti-gun/anti-2A activities and agenda should send a clear message to other corporations/companies. If they do not want to face wrath of gun owners' full on boycott, they should think twice before making anti-gun/anti-2A announcements/PRs.
     
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  8. rpenmanparker

    rpenmanparker Member

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    The Constitution is not changed by a convention of states. And nothing you don’t like can ever be true or real. How is that?
     
  9. rpenmanparker

    rpenmanparker Member

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    I don't know exactly how they will stop violence. I guess by trying real hard. Just like everything else gets done. If you own a gun, you have a responsibility (you know, the things which accompany rights) to work as hard as you can to make sure that guns are not used for offensive violence. What have you done in that regard lately?
     
  10. George Dickel

    George Dickel Member

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    Come on man, "by trying real hard"!! There are hundreds of gun laws on the books and it still hasn't stopped the violence but you expect a moderately sized company to do what the government at all levels and religious organizations haven't been able to accomplish. Just make a wild guess at what a manufacturing company can do to stop the violence, saying you don't know exactly how to stop violence is a cop out, you must have some kind of idea. Maybe a pamphlet in the gun box that says "be a good person and don't kill with this firearm".
     
  11. <*(((><
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    <*(((>< Luke

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    Really? A national convention of states would have the ability to open up the Constitution for changes to Amendments. Under Article V, Amendments can originate in the states with a 2/3 vote can establish convention and call for changes/additions/deletions of Amendments and can be established with a 3/4 states vote overseen by the Supreme Court.

    https://www.usconstitution.net/constamrat.html
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2019
  12. rpenmanparker

    rpenmanparker Member

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    I stand corrected. But it ain't gonna happen.
     
  13. rpenmanparker

    rpenmanparker Member

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    The point is not that "trying real hard" is going to magically work. But rather that folks are working on it...together. The defensiveness, suspicion, paranoia, hatred, etc., etc. expressed here is never going to fix anything. Mark my words, the stonewalling will backfire. If you are not going to be part of the solution, you are going to be the whole problem...at least as far as the other side is concerned. The NRA is leading you into a trap and you won't see it.
     
  14. Kp321

    Kp321 Member

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    I did a lot of business at REI all the years I was a Scoutmaster so got the credit card they sponsored. 1% back in store credit for all purchases in addition to the 10% on store purchases. I ended up running my gun shop on their credit card and equipping my troop on their dime. My name was on the card, not the shop name so they didn't pick up on what was going on.
    I still shop there, just to the limit of my rebate.
     
  15. jmr40

    jmr40 Member

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    REI's response.

    This was written more than a year ago. Sometimes pro gun folks are as knee-jerk as anti-gun folks. They never said they were no longer selling these products. They said they were placing a hold on future orders while they evaluate the situation. It appears they have evaluated the situation because all of these products are still listed on their website. Maybe consumer complaints worked, maybe they made the decision to keep selling these products regardless.

    At any rate they made very little, if any effort to influence 2A in this country. Actually Walmart has done far more damage than REI. They have changed ammo sales policies and this has a far greater negative effect than REI has had on gun owners. Why the outrage with REI who at the end of the day did nothing, while Walmart gets a pass.
     
  16. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    jmr40,

    Vista Outdoor brands Bell, Giro, Blackburn all are represented on the REI site, but I can't find Camelbak at REI except for one model in their Outlet (i.e. dumping ground). Can you help me out and point me to other Camelbak products they carry. They sure seem to reevaluated their position, but leaving Camelbak out makes one wonder if they just got a better deal from the other hydration companies or somehow they split hairs and dropped any crossover products from Vista.
     
  17. D.B. Cooper

    D.B. Cooper Member

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    What do you think was the goal of their "evaluation?" They wanted to pressure Vista into discontinuing manufacture of "MSR" firearms. (I actually dislike that term.) They wanted Vista to join them in a dialogue. To what end? (It's pretty obvious.) They essentially said "stop making guns or we won't sell your camping gear." They were trying to apply financial pressure to limit access to firearms-pure and simple.
     
  18. D.B. Cooper

    D.B. Cooper Member

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    First off, no one wants this resolved. If the Supreme Court ruled tomorrow in definitive, overwhelming support of the 2nd Amendment, Wayne Lapierre would have to get a real job, as would a bunch of his opponents.

    Second, how can their be "dialog and understanding" with a section of the country that wants us subdued? Stonewalling will backfire? Most likely, but the only thing that "dialog" has gotten us is a steady erosion of our rights. Do you realize that I've been hearing about this fight literally my entire life? For over forty years, dialog has gotten us nothing. When I was born, you could still buy full auto firearms. When my father was born, you could order a firearm in the mail from a newspaper ad. What will be left when my son reaches adulthood? The only gains I can think of (the shift to the idea of the 2nd Amendment as an individual right in the early 80s) came through legislation (shall issue carry laws) or supreme court cases (Heller), not through "dialog." Dialog has availed us nothing. All "dialog" has gotten us is "take the guns first, due process later," and red flag laws, along with "approved firearm" lists and magazine bans. Perhaps we should be grateful that, through meaningful dialog, those lists aren't shorter, or all semi-autos aren't completely banned. Yeah. What a victory.

    The left is mounting economic pressure to drive the firearms industry completely underground. Banks and credit card companies are refusing to process lawful purchases of guns and ammo. The very LEAST we can do is to apply our own economic pressure. (I have no hope in success in this endeavor, but it's the right thing to do.)
     
    Gridley likes this.
  19. Jessesky

    Jessesky Member

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    It’s true, the left is accustomed to social media. The squeaky wheel gets the grease. We are used to being peacefully quiet going about our private business. But the danger is on our doorstep
     
  20. rpenmanparker

    rpenmanparker Member

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    Can’t read. Please reverse font color.
     
  21. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    I think we can now see REI decided to back off their position WRT Vista. Whether it was due to pressure from 2A advocates telling them to stay out of politics or simple pragmatism the end result is the same. They reconsidered their stance.

    As such we don't need this thread any longer, but a discussion could be opened in Activism Discussion.
     
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