Retirement Planning

Status
Not open for further replies.
H

hdwhit

Member
Joined
Nov 16, 2015
Messages
5,157
Location
Salem, AR
I wanted to get most of my reloading needs taken care of before I retired when my wife's and my income will drop. I'm nearly there. But during the shortages of the last few years, I was in the mode of "see powder, buy powder" and so I've got something of a mixed bag when it comes to pistol powders.

I don't want to "waste" powder and bullets developing an endless variety of loads, so I want to share with you the powders I have and the cartridges and bullets that will be loading and solicit some recommendations on how best to use my powder.

Please note the bullets have already been purchased, so they are what will be loaded. There may be a "better" weight bullet for a particular cartridge, but I won't be buying it since I have what I have. To paraphrase Secretary Rumsfeld, this is a "come as you are retirement".

Powders and weights available:
  • Hi-Skor 800X - 5,200 grains
  • Bullseye - 26,000 grains
  • Unique - 7,000 grains
  • HP-38 - 17,000 grains
I load on a single stage press and don't mind throwing powder charges to the scale and trickling them up to the proper weight, so powders that don't measure well, like 800X are not a problem if they work well otherwise.​

Cartridges, bullet weight and number to be loaded:
  • 9mm Luger, 115 grain jacketed bullet, 3,700 to be loaded
  • 38 Special, 158 grain jacketed bullet, 700 to be loaded
  • 45 ACP, 200 grain lead semi-wadcutter, 1,200 to be loaded.
So, based on your experience, how would you match the powders I have in the quantities that I have to load the rounds I need to load without having to develop too many new loads for each cartridge. Please explain the reasoning for the choice you recommend so that I can benefit from your experience.

Thanks.
 
If you use published loads, you won't have to "develop" anything. Load up 10 rounds, shoot 'em. If they do what they are supposed to do, load up some more. Your powder stash really isn't much
Less than a pound of 800X
Just under 4 pounds BE
1 pound of Unique
just over 2 pounds of HP-38

Totalling less than a $150 8 pound jug of powder

They will all work with 9/38/45 so you are good to go with about 4.5 to 6 grains per cartridge. That's a little over 10,000 rounds you can load. Hope you have 10-12 boxes of primers.

That's about a year's worth of pistol shooting for me. Not including using the same powders for cast bullet rifle or shotgun shooting.

You are good to go with those powders. I wouldn't try to load it all at once. The good thing about having unloaded powder, primers and lead is that you can pick and choose what to cast and load based on what gun you are shooting more of over time. Sometimes you get on a 9mm kick so you load more 9mm, other times you want to feel like a cowboy so you load 38/357, and other times you want to play GI Joe so you load more 45ACP. You don't want to run out 38 special with nothing left to load because all your powder is now sitting in 45ACP cartridges that you aren't interested in shooting right now.
 
I have never used 800X so I can't say on it but 9mm might be the best bet.
I like HP38 for .45, my go to powder there. (need to try some WST however). Bulleseye also worked well for me in .45
Since you have lots of Bullesye I would split the .45s Between Bullseye and HP38. (almost tempted to say just use up 7000gr of HP38 and load all 1200 with HP38. 5gr*1200=6000gr so a little left out of a lb of HP38)
I would probably use the Unique for the .38s. Jacketed bullet so I would guess you want as much velocity as possible. Bullseye or HP38 might shoot better but you probably don't want to burn up 100 bullets finding out which is best.
That leaves everything leftover for 9mm,

Since Bullseye, HP38,and Unique work well in .38/9mm/.45 I don't think there is a best answer there unless you wanted to figure out which worked best for each cal and gun(s) (in case you have more than one pistol in any of the calibers listed)

I suppose you could use up the 800X in .45 if you wanted heavy loads there.
I did not stay at a Holiday in last night so I may be out to lunch on this and what works well for me might not work well for you.:)

Please let us know what you decide.
 
I use alot of 231/hp38, 9s, .45s, and some goof off charges in small cartridge rifles and lead bullets. It dosent produce the highest velocitys usually but it meters well and is useable for many if not most bullet weights for the "standard" pistol cartridges. Id Probably build generic loads for the 9 and .45 with it.

I know bullseye and unique are popular but i havent worked with them so cant comment.

I dont use 800x in standard .45 loads. What i load it for are extra hot .45 supers. From my research and experience its one of the best powders for that particular application, but its a real pain to work with as you basically have to weigh every charge. Thus i reserve it for the really hot stuff, everything else is 231 or longshot.
 
I don't mean to be harsh but if that's your retirement stash it doesn't sound like much.
If you shoot a box of 100 a month you're only looking at 3 years 1 month supply for your 9 mm, 7 months for the 38 special and a year of 45. Or just a little over 4 1/2 year supply for all you have. Obviously longer if you shoot less and less if you shoot more. Also you'll probably have more free time in retirement so how will that impact your shooting?

I mention it as it's like the news saying the suspect has an arsel of 7 weapons and thousands of rounds of ammo. What they left out was the guy was charged with speeding and was on his way to a three gun match and the massive sounding numbers are his carry pistol, plus his compition guns plus backups. The thousands of rounds are 500 rounds of pistol, 500 rounds of shotgun and 500 rounds of rifle. In other words not much when you think about it logically even though it sounds like a lot.

Personally, I'm nowhere near retirement, but my pistol powder situation is similar in that I have several pounds of different types. I like HP38/win 231 and BE86. I also have some AA #7 that I'm not as fond of. I'm also loading 9mm and getting ready to start 45. Unlike you, I feel I'm nowhere near what I need to get through the next crisis.

So What I try to do is acquire twice what I shoot. So when I was acquiring brass I'd buy a box to shoot and another to stash. Now that I'm only shooting my loads, I buy twice the components I use. So I keep an envelope and put what 2x what I ahoot costs in it. Then I'm going to buy components in bulk as the cash gets high enough to do so. I also pick up a box of 1000 primers whenever I can and I buy 1000 bullets from RMR when I use 500.

You don't mention primers. But you should have about 5000 small pistol primers on hand for your 9mm and 38 spec. For your 45 you don't say how much brass and what type so I'd say you should have at least a box of 1000 of large pistol primers and one of small.

My suggestion is to have fun with what you have and work on adding to your supply. I'd load a few of each powder and see what you like best for each caliber. I'm not familiar with 800x but all of the other powders have loyal followings so you have stuff that should shoot well and as mentioned by others work well with all of your calibers. So the trick will to see what's enjoyable to you. Make those your go to loads. Then stock up on the powder that like best.

As I type this, the though hit me that you might consider adding a shooting line to your budget. Say it's $30 a month. Once you do what I suggest in the previous paragraph you could buy 1000 primers or a pound of powder each month. If you don't spend the full $30 hold it aside, then add it so you can but 1000 bullets.

I know this is long, but I really think you need to do some more planning if you intend to shoot for many years. Don't make it stressful, instead come up with a system that works, follow it and you'll be fine. And again, make it fun.
 
I find that HP-38 works well in everything, but it is not always the best for anything. I have some great .45 ACP loads with HP-38, but then again I also love good old (dirty) Bulleye for .45 ACP.

Just at thought here since I am personally unfamiliar with 800X:

9mm = Unique
.38 = HP-38
.45 ACP = Bullseye
 
You have more than enough powder for the quantity of bullets you have to load.

I agree with the above, you are not off the reservation with those powders and you don't need to do "endless" load development.

Very early in my reloading endeavors I loaded 9mm, 45 ACP, 38/357 all with 4.5 gn of 231/hp-38, kept life simple and I never had to adjust a powder measure. That said I almost never use it now because I have found other powders ai like better for specific tasks, my stock of 231 is old enough it's still in metal cans.

So along the KISS method I would start with 4.3 gn of Bullseye for your 1,200, 200 gn LSWC's in 45 ACP, that will use up 5160 grains.

3.8 gn of Bullseye for the 700 jacketed 158 grain 38's, take 2660 grains.

4.7 gn of Bullseye for the 3700 jacketed 115's in 9mm using 17,390 grains. For a total of 25,210 grains.

So you'll still have 790 grains of Bullseye left and all of the other powders.
 
hdwhit said:
Powders and weights available:
  • Hi-Skor 800X - 5,200 grains
  • Bullseye - 26,000 grains
  • Unique - 7,000 grains
  • HP-38 - 17,000 grains
Cartridges, bullet weight and number to be loaded:
  • 9mm Luger, 115 grain jacketed bullet, 3,700 to be loaded
  • 38 Special, 158 grain jacketed bullet, 700 to be loaded
  • 45 ACP, 200 grain lead semi-wadcutter, 1,200 to be loaded.
Click to expand...
I would use HP-38/Bullseye for 9mm 115 gr jacketed, HP-38/Bullseye for 45ACP 200 gr LSWC and Unique/800X for 38 Spl 158 gr jacketed.

I use 4.8 gr of W231/HP-38 for various 115 gr FMJ at 1.130"-1.135" but 4.6 gr will start to reliably cycle the slide of my Glocks and 4.6-4.7 gr may work for your pistol. 4.3-4.5 gr of Bullseye will cycle my pistols and you can work down to 4.0 gr to see if it will reliably cycle your pistol.

I personally prefer 4.8-5.0 gr of W231/HP-38 for 200 gr LSWC (It's like bread and butter) but many like Bullseye.

Reason why I suggested using Unique/800X for 38 Spl is because they are fluffy powders and will fill the case better.


For my retirement, bulk of my shooting will be done with:

9mm 115 gr FMJ 4.1-4.2 gr Promo - Soft shooting even for M&P Shield 9 and 1" groups at 25 yards with Just Right carbine.

45ACP 200 gr LSWC 4.0 gr Promo - Lighter target load and pleasant to shoot in various 1911s, M&P45 and even PT145 compact with 2" accuracy at 25 yards out of my Sig 1911.

I am on my 4th container of Promo and at $112 for 8 lbs, will have plenty more for retirement - http://www.recobstargetshop.com/browse.cfm/4,342.html
 
Last edited:
hdwhit said:
I wanted to get most of my reloading needs taken care of before I retired when my wife's and my income will drop. I'm nearly there. But during the shortages of the last few years, I was in the mode of "see powder, buy powder" and so I've got something of a mixed bag when it comes to pistol powders.

I don't want to "waste" powder and bullets developing an endless variety of loads, so I want to share with you the powders I have and the cartridges and bullets that will be loading and solicit some recommendations on how best to use my powder.

Please note the bullets have already been purchased, so they are what will be loaded. There may be a "better" weight bullet for a particular cartridge, but I won't be buying it since I have what I have. To paraphrase Secretary Rumsfeld, this is a "come as you are retirement".

Powders and weights available:
  • Hi-Skor 800X - 5,200 grains
  • Bullseye - 26,000 grains
  • Unique - 7,000 grains
  • HP-38 - 17,000 grains
I load on a single stage press and don't mind throwing powder charges to the scale and trickling them up to the proper weight, so powders that don't measure well, like 800X are not a problem if they work well otherwise.​

Cartridges, bullet weight and number to be loaded:
  • 9mm Luger, 115 grain jacketed bullet, 3,700 to be loaded
  • 38 Special, 158 grain jacketed bullet, 700 to be loaded
  • 45 ACP, 200 grain lead semi-wadcutter, 1,200 to be loaded.
So, based on your experience, how would you match the powders I have in the quantities that I have to load the rounds I need to load without having to develop too many new loads for each cartridge. Please explain the reasoning for the choice you recommend so that I can benefit from your experience.

Thanks.
Click to expand...

I use 8lb cannister of Unique for .380, 9mm, .38 Spl, .38 S&W, .40 S&W, .45 ACP, .45 Auto-Rim, midrange 10mm, and midrange .44 Magnum.

Works well in all of them!

Deaf
 
I'd recommend picking up 4-8 lbs. of a versatile medium-speed powder like CFE Pistol or Winchester 572. I think you could use W231/HP38 for everything but the newer powders produce better velocities in most poplular handgun cartridges, including the ones of interest to you. They also accommodate even a wider range of applications.
 
rsrocket1, I expect that will be a lifetime of pistol shooting for me. Or, I should say a "rest of a lifetime".

And, yes, I have plenty of primers. Most of the brass has already been processed up to being primed, packed in plastic boxes and stored in metal ammunition cans.

I anticipate a loss rate of between 30% and 50% "to the weeds" for everything except the 38 Spl, so that means I'll only get between two and three more loadings out of the surviving brass. The primers for that are stored in separate magazines; one in my garage in Texas, one in my garage in Arkansas and one in the storm cellar in Arkansas, so they are all where they should be safe and secure.
 
bds, I like the idea of using the "fluffy" powders on 38 Spl where they will take up more room. The very real possibility of a double charge with 38 scares me enough that I have additional checks in my reloading procedures just for 38 and any suggestion that makes it safer is welcome.
 
ray15, there is sufficient powder already on hand to more than load these catridges, so no more will be bought.
 
jmorris, if its not a recipe I have loaded before, I start with the starting load, load and shoot 10 rounds; 5 for accuracy, 5 through a chronograph. I then step up by an increment suggested by the "distance" between the starting load and the published maximum until I either get a load that functions the gun and is accurate or until I get pressure signs. With a big spread between start and max, that could consume 10 strings or 100 rounds, so I want to avoid doing too much of that.

I do like your idea of making it a "bullseye shop" so to speak, but bds also has a good reason for using the 800X in the 38.

But this is what I hoped for, some reasoning from experienced reloaders to add to my own thoughts and hopefully end up making better choices.

Thank you.
 
hdwhit said:
rsrocket1, I expect that will be a lifetime of pistol shooting for me. Or, I should say a "rest of a lifetime".

And, yes, I have plenty of primers. Most of the brass has already been processed up to being primed, packed in plastic boxes and stored in metal ammunition cans.

I anticipate a loss rate of between 30% and 50% "to the weeds" for everything except the 38 Spl, so that means I'll only get between two and three more loadings out of the surviving brass. The primers for that are stored in separate magazines; one in my garage in Texas, one in my garage in Arkansas and one in the storm cellar in Arkansas, so they are all where they should be safe and secure.
Click to expand...

Wow, where ya shooting that you're losing that much brass? At my club I might lose 1-2%. They keep the weeds and grass down on the pistol ranges. Most trips I come home with more than I shot.
 
ColtPythonElite, thanks for the heads up, but between these, what I already have loaded and the rifle rounds we're not even discussing, I genuinely believe this will last me the rest of my life.

The 38 and 45 are not going to be shot recreationally (beyond the pleasure I always derive from shooting) but simply to maintain my proficiency.

Most of my recreational shooting is done with my rifles and I will have enough 223 and 5.7mm Johnson to shoot out the barrels of those guns. I'll leave it up to my heirs to decide what to do with them (when they literally pry the keys to the gun safes from my cold dead hand).
 
Good question, Cannibul. I do the vast majority of my shooting on an extemporized range on what was historically my family's farm, but which through inheritance and purchase I now own.

The "range" is set up across the anti-erosion berm of a dam. The shooting position is in the auxillary spillway. Since the spillway is vegetated for erosion control, the grass must be left long enough that it inevitably claims a certain percentage of the brass. And since the shooting position is not flat, even putting down a tarp is only partially effective. Plus, the way I was taught to shoot was offhand from standing, kneeling or sitting position firing at the target and then moving, so I don't end up leaving piles that are easy to spot.
 
jmorris, if its not a recipe I have loaded before...
Click to expand...

Well unless one of us suggests a load you have already loaded before, none of this will do you much good.

I do like your idea of making it a "bullseye shop" so to speak,
Click to expand...

Will help if you go senile in your "old" age too, you won't be able to start an "I dumped the wrong powder into a container" thread.
 
hdwhit said:
ray15, there is sufficient powder already on hand to more than load these catridges, so no more will be bought.
Click to expand...
People tend to live longer than they rationalize when deciding what a sufficient retirements savings is. I'm not sure this is any different.
 
Your income will drop, but your time will increase exponentially. And it'll slow down. Retirement isn't all it's cracked up to be. Worse without a huge retirement fund.
Your case numbers add up to 5600. Isn't enough. At 100 rounds per day(being conservative), you'll need something to do before your Thanksgiving, 105 days from now. By 28 Sept. you'll be done loading. I'm sure your wife will find something for you to do.
Oh and I use Bullseye for everything. You have enough to load nearly all your cases twice.
 
hdwhit said:
bds, I like the idea of using the "fluffy" powders on 38 Spl where they will take up more room. The very real possibility of a double charge with 38 scares me enough that I have additional checks in my reloading procedures just for 38 and any suggestion that makes it safer is welcome.
Click to expand...

I load rifle single stage and I also use 5-10 grains of shotgun powder for low recoil cast bullet loads so yes, there is the risk of multiple charging.

What I do is to prep and prime the brass, then in a line, put the brass, powder measure and press. I then grab the brass, charge with powder, seat the bullet and put the loaded cartridge in the box. That way I never have to worry about a double charge. If you charge then immediately seat the bullet in one step you won't have to worry about double or missed charges.
 
OP, we all have different thresholds for what we can afford for our hobbies. We have different points for what, when, and how much we shoot. But, as some here have pointed out, once you are retired, you may find more time for your hobbies. Several friends that are enjoying retirement have found themselves wondering how did they ever have enough time to work.
I'm a bit away from retiring, but I am planning for it. In all my reloading though, I look for powders where I can use in multiple calibers, where possible. An 8 lb jug of Win 231, Bullseye, or some other suitable powder will go far and work well in many handgun calibers.
So, using HP38/W231 you could load all three calibers you mentioned, or use it for 9 and 45, and use the 800x for the 38 as mentioned above.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

H
  • Locked
Boatload O' Bullseye
2
Replies
30
Views
2K
Stumper
Stumper
H
  • Locked
9mm Score - well maybe, sorta
Replies
13
Views
870
mstreddy
mstreddy
J-Bar
  • Locked
Minimum Unique charge in .38 Special?
Replies
21
Views
1K
J-Bar
J-Bar
B
  • Locked
Preferred powder for 45 acp
2 3
Replies
50
Views
5K
hdbiker
H
H
  • Locked
Breaking the Rules in 25 ACP
2
Replies
35
Views
7K
Dudedog
Dudedog
Back
Top