Rifle, 50 vs 54

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I have built, borrowed or bought rifles from .31 through .36, .40, .45, .50, .54, .58, and .72. My own choice for deer on up is .54. Only my opinion but I think it has the best combination of size, weight, and velocity in the bigger sizes. That said, I now shoot .50.
My original Renegade, bought around 1977 from Jerrys in Chicago, would put alternating round balls and maxi balls in the same group at fifty yards using 100 grains of ffg.
 
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Never had a 54 but do have 50. What, if any, advantage is there shooting a projectile that is 0.04 larger? Just curious

OMG, WHERE do I start? :D;)

Well just talkin' round ball..., you have more weight and more diameter in the .530 vs. .490 round ball..., 225 grains vs 175 grains......does that "count"; heck if I can tell....Too Many Variables...

First if the load you use in your fifty will punch a hole through the deer, and my fifty-four does the same....does it matter to the deer how "dead" they are ? ( Not really.)

So "on paper" my heavier ball will have more inertia on impact at 100 yards than will your ball, BUT...., we have to be at 100 yards or perhaps a tiny bit farther for that to matter much if at all....

Beyond round ball...,
IF you bought a 1:48 twist rate .50 caliber rifle, and I have a 1:66 round bottom rifled barrel on my .54..., you can use a conical bullet weighing 250 grains, and thus negate my weight advantage since I'm limited to round ball. Plus that bullet flies a bit better than my round ball and doesn't shed velocity as fast....
So the only advantage I have would be .030 larger diameter bullet. The deer, or the elk (with that weight you can now go for elk) won't know the difference....unless AGAIN we are at maximum range. (Which isn't usually a good idea.)

This ^^^ is of course assuming equal muzzle velocities....,

So if you're using 90 grains of powder for your .490 ball and I'm using 75 grains for my .530..., you may actually penetrate better than mine...at 100 yards...but again we have to pushing the loads to the limit.
With that faster load you get a flatter trajectory for the round ball than I get with mine..., that might be a plus for you with your .490 ball. Same thing for conicals.

THEN we get into alloys. A 1/2" hole is just that..., now do you need the ball to deform OR do you need it to penetrate and come out the other side of your game animal and deformation is a bonus? So what happens if you use a little tin in your casting lead, and a different patch so it loads and shoots well? At long range my soft lead .530 ball might just deform so much it stops inside the animal as it mushrooms, while your harder .490 ball might zip right through, immediately collapsing both lungs. Result, I have some tracking to do while you walk over and collect your deer. Does that matter to you? Does that matter to me?

(OH and don't fall for the "energy transfer" stuff when it comes to black powder..., not going fast enough...., so all you can depend on is the actual hole the bullet makes, and most often with a broadside shot, two holes in the animal drop it quicker than one)

How about over-the-counter stuff? How about hunting buddies?
So you get to your hunting area and realize you left your bullets at home...
Do your buddies shoot .50 or do they all shoot .54s and you're out of luck as they can share bullets but you can't. The reverse applies for me with my .54 if all my friends shoot .50s. ;)
It's 8:30 pm and you realize that you left the bullet bag at the range when you sighted in last Saturday, and you have to go out to Wally World to get bullets. Do they carry .490? Do they carry .530? Maybe they only carry .490 ball so your .50 has that advantage. Does everybody in the area shoot a .490 so they are out but they have a box of .530 ball, so I would be "in luck" but you wouldn't? Do you have a mold so this question is moot??

So as I wrote, LOTS of variables.:thumbup:

Whatever you use, get very good with it..., and it probably won't matter between a .50 and a .54

LD
 
Yeah, I have one in 1:28 so it is kind of defeatist to even be concerned about 50, 54 or 58. Guess no new toy.

A gun with a round ball twist for shooting patched round balls is generally more fun for plinking and can be less expensive to shoot.
Less powder is required for shooting at moderate distances.
Consider any rifle with a 1 in 48" twist or slower, or a cap & ball revolver if you don't already have either one.
 
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Have 1:28 and 1:48. The reference to the 1:28 was for a suggestion made for sabots. My original inquirie was fpr how much difference between 50 and 54.
A gun with a round ball twist for shooting patched round balls is generally more fun for plinking and can be less expensive to shoot.
Less powder is required for shooting at moderate distances.
Consider any rifle with a 1 in 48" twist or slower, or a cap & ball revolver if you don't already have either one.
 
Never had a 54 but do have 50. What, if any, advantage is there shooting a projectile that is 0.04 larger? Just curious.
For plinking and target shooting, no difference except the greater cost for projectiles and powder with the .54 rifle.

If you are hunting and wanted to use patched round balls, I'd rather have the .54 myself but if you are using Minie bullets or (shudder) jacketed sabot bullets the .50 should be fine for most North American game.
 
Agree with Mdauben, I have 3 .50s but also acquired a .54 because if/when I do hunt elk with BP (or deer for that matter) I'd kind of like to do it with a round ball. In that regard the .54 has significantly more punch. Plus I kind of wanted something different to shoot on occasion anyway. But if one were to use a conical or sabot in the .50 I believe it has more than plenty to offer without the increase in bore size.
 
I own a few .50s and one TC new englander .54, I personally love the .54 and the accuracy is outstanding with prb or the Lee reals I cast up for it, mild 70 gr charge is more than enough to flatten whitetail with either and find myself carrying it more than my .50s
 
Must be something to them, I just ordered my 5th .54cal. Gotta call that they had an opening for the rifle building class in Bowling Green this year and was going to get a .58 but Kibler doesn't have any barrels. So a cherry-stocked .54 it is!

Forgot my three .54 pistols. So this'll make eight .54's total. :D
 
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I'm not familiar with BP/muzzleloader hunting, but if I understand right, people are saying .54 has an advantage when shooting slow twist and round balls due to the greater mass of the ball. But when shooting fast twist like 1:32 and sabots, either .50 or .54 will work fine? And aren't there more modern/sabot bullets available in a .50-size sabot? There seems to be fewer modern bullets in .54. But if there's a good one, does it matter?
 
The .54 offers 2 additional caliber options for sabots than the .50.
MMP has .54 sabots that will also fit .50 & .457-.458 caliber bullets.
Plus the .54 can shoot .54 caliber conicals.

However the .50 does offer one additional caliber option that the .54 does not which is .399 - .40. bullets.
And MMP also offers more specialty sabot [outside diameter] sizes for the .50 than the .54.
Those are sabots that are made for bores that are slightly tighter and harder to load.--->>> http://mmpsabots.com

Some of the newer rifles on the market are .45's with a fast 1 in 18" and 1 in 20" twist.
Just like with modern guns, people choose between faster and flatter shooting, or larger and heavier bullets depending on the game and personal preferences.
Another choice is about whether a person would rather load sabots or load a bore size conical.
Loading bore size conicals could wear out a barrel faster than if shooting it in a plastic sabot.

Custom molds are relatively affordable now for those who want to design and mold their own bullets.
 
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These days the .54 is more of a PRB caliber. At that they really shine. Long barrel, slow 1:66 twist, 90 gr. Powder, Hawken design and furniture all add up to an accurate, mean and good looking deer killin' machine. With PRB, one would do well on black bear too. For the traditionalist, it's made to order. For the most part, I've gotten excellent accuracy from slow twist .54s shooting PRB.

If conicals or sabots are going to be the projectile, the .50 is fine. There's more than enough capability to deliver lethal punishment plus the selection of rifles with fast twist barrels is much greater, as is the choice of bullets. If raw power with conicals is your objective, there's no reason to go above .50.
 
Looking over my Hanson sketch book on trade rifles, I noticed that all of the rifles were .52 to .54 bore.
I think that it had been pretty firmly established that you needed something heavier than .50 for large game in the West.
 
I think in the time prb was the go to for average joe. The mini and maxi was more military for max damage,

The patched round ball was the standard and preferred projectile used throughout the muzzle loading era by hunters and plainsmen.
Minie' balls were used only in rifled muskets by the military just before and during the civil war, and by those who acquired a rifled musket as surplus afterwards. Although, even then I would think that civilian hunters, settlers, and sodbusters probably just used a patched round ball in these.
The Maxi ball is a modern invention, with the earliest reference being from Thompson Center for use in their Hawken and Renegade rifles in the 1970s onward.
 
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