rolling block caliber?

[rusty from italy]

Looking for old irons in a arms shop i find a rolling block made by Remington, non so common in Europe were all the rolling block you find was made in Sweden or Belgium and so on, for 19°century european army!
The question is the correct caliber, the clerck in the shop doesn't know it, it isn't marked on the barrel or the action, a 45/70 round enter the chamber but have too much room around, the barrel is near a .45 quickly measured with a caliper from the muzzle, it's in great condition and with a good price, but if i don't know wich caliber it can be it's unfirable
Which was the most common caliber adopted by Remington at the time?
ciao
Rusty

 

[7.62 Nato]

I've seen these in .43 Spanish .

http://www.leverguns.com/articles/taylor/Rolling_Block/rollingblock.htm

http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php?topic=7971.0

 

[arcticap]

One thread mentions that it could be .43 Egyptian:

http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,4196.html

In addition to .43 Spanish:

http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,3868.html

Can you rebarrel a 43 egyptian rolling block to 45-70 cal?

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070803115441AAePKMl

.43 Egyptian

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=12465

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=70632

http://www.remingtonsociety.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2171

 

[Al LaVodka]

Possibly 50/70?
Al

 

[rusty from italy]

Measured the barrel is much more like a .45 than a .43, i have find that more rolling block was in various .44 with bottleneck brass, watching the chamber look like a bottleneck.
The action is different from all the Rolling block i have seen, the side of the action is not flat but rounded, on the tang is clear to read Remington and some other, the forend is long like a military version with two barrel band, it is a centerfire, many i have seen are rimfire or converted later to centerfire.
It's a strange pieces and a price good of 650€ (good for us in europe, where a mauser K98 in medium condition is priced 500€) make it an interesting affair!
Buffalo arms have old and obsolete brass, i think the best would be slug the chamber and the barrel with cerrosafe, my doubt is on the availability of the dies, make custom dies is too expensive for me!
Rusty

 

[zimmerstutzen]

There were so many possible cartridges that it could have been. There were 4 different Spanish cartridges alone. 43 Spanish carbine, 43 Spanish 433 Bullet, a 43 Spanish (439 bullet also known as the 11.15mmx58R) and the 43 Reformado which had a 454 Bullet, also known as the 11.5x57R. The Reformado was a peculiar bell shaped cartridge with an odd brass covered bullet. There were 50-70, 12mm's of various sizes, 43 Egyptian, I understand that an occaisional Rem Roller shows up in 43 Mauser (11mm) Many were made in 44WCF, Some were reported to have been made for the US states in 43 Peabody, although that may just be a misnomer of the smaller 43 Spanish. Remington came up with the 44-77, the 45-100 Remington, even the 58 Berdan was chambered in some Remington Rollers.

The 43 Egyptian was made for Egypt but was also used by France in the Franco-Prussian War. There was the 11.7x51R Danish, (actually about 4 diff Rem Danish cartridges) a 12.17x44R Norwegian, 12.8 x 45R Papal and a host of other odd cartridges. The list of official Remington cartridges is one thing, but many rollers were reworked by various countries' arsenals into their own cartridges. The Remington Rollers ended up all over the world sometimes sold second and third hand to developing countries. In the 1880's US Naval forces landed in Korea and were armed with Rem Rollers and facing enemy troops armed also with rem rollers.

 

[rusty from italy]

Thanks for all, actually is a "loose battle" i don't want buy the rifle without know the exact caliber, and it's impossible to know it without slug the chamber with cerosafe or sulphur!
It's in the rack shop from more than one year, it will stay more time
If i have the possibility i'll take some picture of the action, very strange with slightly rounded side, i suspect it was a gunsmithing job for a sporterization of a military rifle.
Rusty

 

[Al LaVodka]

Rusty;
Buon giorno.

Have the shop let you slug it (twice). I'm sure they will. When you figure it out, which will be fun, I think they will even let you dictate the price. If altered it may be less "valuable" but more shootable too. I think this is a great adventure!

Al

 

[zimmerstutzen]

At one time I had over 50 remington rolling block rifles. I am now down to approximately 10. One thing is that the more they are studied, the less certain things become. Yes there are just perhaps a dozen variations in the actions, but the odd journeys that many have taken in 140 years have left more questions than answers.

 

[rusty from italy]

I think this is a great adventure!

I agree with you, but at this time i can't spend money in a rifle, may be in a couple of mounth i am ok for a series of new aquisition regards shooting iron i put it in my wish list!!
I like great adventure, if it wasn't so i had avoid black powder and muzzleloader, but if they are too great may be i don't see the end
ciao
Rusty

 

[desidog]

It's in the rack shop from more than one year, it will stay more time

I'd definitely give them a lower bid than the sticker price. Citing your (or, rather, their) uncertainty of the chamber, and the possibility of it being re-worked, if you have cash-in-hand they might want to move it along. Offer 400 - and flash the cash - and then come back here and post some pictures! Good luck.