Second Amendment Stance of 2016 Presidential Candidates

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I'd also hardly say Fiorina is 'saying all the right things.' From what I can tell, she answered a questionnaire for the NRA properly (and I suspect said questionnaire isn't nearly as aggressively pro-rights as we here would expect) and doesn't think an arbitrary list should be used to debar Americans their rights (which is a moot opinion because A) it would never hold up in court, B) she clearly wants the list disbanded entirely), which I think is a more generic civil rights opinion than one specific to firearms. Though it does dovetail nicely. Given her Californian background, I feel it is much more important that we lack any sort of voting record to gage her by. I could trust her words if she hailed from Arkansas or even Colorado (still hardly a guarantee), but she's from California. Much like Christie and his extremely selective record on pardoning prisoners of gun control injustice, I just can't trust people who have been able to stand living in these dens of statism their whole lives. Being raised and living under different/incompatible belief systems with ours was the reason the presidency was restricted to natural born Americans in the first place, and we all know how frequently the gun control city-states are seen as far-off foreign lands.

Honestly? No one is saying the right things. Haven't heard these guys calling for the disemboweling of the ATF organization, nor for meaningful reforms of the NFA/GCA status quo, nor even plain denouncements of the purely oppressive state of affairs in places like NYC, NJ, and CA where they won't win electors anyway. Just a declaration they won't make anything worse. And considering how bad things have gotten over the last century for gun owners, that's pretty weak tea, even if we are finally starting to turn the tide back (with absolutely no help whatsoever from any elected president, mind you).
1. Here is Fiorina's taped message to the NRA convention:
https://www.facebook.com/CarlyFiorina/videos/10155701310515206/
She mentions having been born in Texas and that when she and her husband lived in California (I assume because her position at HP required it, given that their HQ is in California) he managed to get a concealed carry permit here -- to give you an idea of how difficult that is, the range officer at my local range, who is also a certified law enforcement instructor, was not only denied a permit, but they first sat on his application for nine months. In the tape she goes on to say that Mr. Fiorina also has a permit in their current state, Virginia.

2. Bearingarms published an article on the 2016 GOP candidates' gun stances, apparently originally from the UK Telegraph (http://bearingarms.com/ranking-candidates-guns/), which included the handy table shown below:
 

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Once again, whatever her husband did/does only has tangential bearing on her personal beliefs & motivations. That's like one or two steps back from "I support the 2nd, but..." bona fides. Especially when you lack a voting or advocacy record.

Like the folks claiming Trump is a gunnie because his sons are & he hasn't disowned them.

I'm not going off of what pundits say each candidate stands for, I'm going off of news articles & quotes that I can find which specifically articulate her position. If Carly's not a gun-person, that's fine and dandy, but it's an important point for a now-single-issue voter like myself, because non-gun people tend to be anti-gun whether they wish to be or not in practice, because it's easy to trade on a group that isn't yourself when a good-sounding idea pops up. I already addressed the difficult nature of gun laws in some areas, but even in California that should have no bearing on one's ability to procure a firearm (and again, it requires some measure of diligence or revulsion to manage to avoid picking up a firearm at any point during your adult life in America).

I think it's far more telling she makes sure to qualify all her gun experience as being her husband's, to tell the truth. Why not "our" guns, for instance?

TCB
 
Old lady new shooter, that was a cool chart. Bears repeating. Huck and Santorum are certainly big on the armament and so is Gilmore!

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she makes sure to qualify all her gun experience as being her husband's, to tell the truth. Why not "our" guns, for instance?

She didn't discuss experience, only ownership. At one point she did say something to the effect that she could defend her home and family. As for being very clear that the owner of the guns is her husband, maybe that's because the form you have to fill out to buy a gun doesn't have an option for "Mr and Mrs" and she doesn't want to be accused of violating any laws?

Has your research turned up any anti-gun statements she ever made in the past?
 
Huck and Santorum are certainly big on the armament and so is Gilmore!

IIRC Santorum and Gilmore are both far down in the polls and don't have much chance at the nomination, but Huckabee is still hanging in, however I don't remember seeing his name mentioned in this thread as a 2A supporter.
 
"At one point she did say something to the effect that she could defend her home and family"
Now see, that's significant in demonstrating a proper, mature attitude towards the civilian right to keep and bear arms. :cool: I can't find the quote easily, so I'd love to hear if you remember where/when she said that so I can dig up the exact one for everyone's perusal :)

"IIRC Santorum and Gilmore are both far down in the polls and don't have much chance at the nomination, but Huckabee is still hanging in, however I don't remember seeing his name mentioned in this thread as a 2A supporter."
Regardless of poll standing, it seems pretty clear that gun issues are on a low rung as far as their many policy priorities, same as most everyone else. I guess it's a question of how many more pressing priorities each candidate has that's the real differentiator. One approach would be to guess at how long it would take each person to win/lose at each of their pet issues before they would even get to gun control, since that seems to be how it has played out recently.

TCB
 
old lady new shooter said:
IIRC Santorum and Gilmore are both far down in the polls and don't have much chance at the nomination, but Huckabee is still hanging in, however I don't remember seeing his name mentioned in this thread as a 2A supporter.

I am not a Huck supporter, but he most certainly is strong gun rights advocate.
 
"At one point she did say something to the effect that she could defend her home and family"
Now see, that's significant in demonstrating a proper, mature attitude towards the civilian right to keep and bear arms. :cool: I can't find the quote easily, so I'd love to hear if you remember where/when she said that so I can dig up the exact one for everyone's perusal :)

<...>

TCB

Her statement about defending her home and family was in the video I mentioned earlier, https://www.facebook.com/CarlyFiorina/videos/10155701310515206/
The exact quote was "While I've never had to protect my home or my family from an intruder, I'm glad I can if I ever have to."
 
Gun Owners of America endorse Ted Cruz

Their endorsement lists several of his positions.

Gun Owners of America is proud to endorse Senator Ted Cruz for the office of President of the United States.

While there are many candidates in the race, Ted Cruz is the only one who has completed and returned the GOA presidential survey on the Second Amendment.
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Ted Cruz has promised gun owners that he will repeal anti-gun Executive Orders that circumvent Congress and veto anti-gun legislation if it reaches his desk.

As a U.S. Senator, Ted Cruz has demonstrated a willingness to fight for our Second Amendment rights. He is working with GOA on legislation to repeal the Obama Administration’s gun ban that is (and will) affect millions of military veterans and senior citizens.

He has opposed efforts to reward millions of illegal aliens with citizenship and voting rights, given that the majority of them are anti-gunners who have ignored and flouted our laws.

He has cosponsored legislation to allow concealed carry reciprocity for law-abiding gun owners. This legislation (S. 498) is of special importance to GOA members and activists. It is one of our chief priorities in Congress.


Full article here
https://www.gunowners.org/alert982015.htm
 
That first point is very important. I will be asking Mr. Cruz for clarification on the barrel and other import bans. Most non gun guys don't even know how many EOs are already in play.
 
Most non gun guys don't even know how many EOs are already in play.

Yeah, we constantly hear about Obama's "executive orders". Very few, if any "executive orders" pertain to gun control: i can't find one. Reason: "Executive orders" are not required.

The executive branch has wide latitude in the enforcement, interpretation, and implementation of federal law. The "sporting purposes" clause of the GCA 1968
is tailor made for gun control.

http://www.archives.gov/federal-register/executive-orders/obama.html

Issa and others attempted to make something stick to Attorney General Holder and failed miserably. The Fast and Furious "investigation" was a political extravaganza. The opposition in congress never insisted on changing the definition of "sporting purposes" nor did they ever call for reform of the BATFE.

BTW: Obama repealed the prohibition on carry of firearms in national parks put in place during the Reagan administration. He also signed legislation allowing guns in baggage on Amtrak trains. Both were riders to other legislation.
 
He also tried to ban the military from selling its brass to civilians, precipitating the first of many shortages, as I recall...
 
Does anyone know which candidates shoot when there's no cameras around - or which have been specific when it comes to their gun-related activities? Since a person can own a gun just to say they do, it would be nice to know which ones are more than just technical gun owners.
 
Good question DHJenkins, hopefully others will know more than me and hopefully their will be something to know.

All I can think of is that I do remember when Rick Perry shot a coyote several years ago with a LCP, but I think I remember someone telling me he had dropped out, not sure about that though.
 
I don't think we gain anything by using gun ownership or shooting activity as a litmus test for RKBA support. Remember Kerry and his "duck hunting"?
 
I found this to be an interesting summary of quotes from Senator Rand Paul on 2A issues. It is a little dated but still shows a longer record than some of the othe candidates.

Don't let the liberals tread on the Second Amendment

We are the party that adheres to the Constitution. We will not let the liberals tread on the Second Amendment! We will fight to defend the entire Bill of Rights. We will stand up against excessive government power wherever we see it. We cannot and will not allow any President to act as if he were a king. We will not let any President use executive orders to impinge on the Second Amendment. Source: Tea Party Response to 2013 State of the Union Address , Feb 12, 2013

Patriot Act violates your gun rights

[Speech at the Knob Creek Machine Gun Shootout, April 4, 2009]: Unless you want a government that can enter your house at will, check to see if you have trigger locks, measure the length of your guns and rapidity of their ability to fire, you must oppose violations of the Fourth Amendment like the PATRIOT Act. Source: The Tea Party Goes to Washington, by Rand Paul, p.125 , Feb 22, 2011

2nd amendment is only as good as the fourth amendment

How many supposed pro-gun politicians voted for the Patriot Act which gives the government the right to search your home without a warrant, when you're not home, leave listening devices, and use any and all information to create a prosecution on any charge regardless of their original reason for the search? Gun rights advocates need to know that the 2nd amendment is only as good as the fourth amendment. If we are not free from unreasonable and warrantless searches, no one's guns are safe. Source: 2010 Senate campaign website, www.randpaul2010.com, "issues" , Sep 1, 2010

Supports 2nd amendment; vote against restricting handguns

How many politicians claim they are supporters of the 2nd amendment and then vote to restrict handguns? We need to send people to Washington that not only understand the 2nd amendment but the entire Bill of Rights. Source: 2010 Senate campaign website, www.randpaul2010.com, "Issues" , Jul 19, 2010

Voted NO on banning high-capacity magazines of over 10 bullets.

Congressional Summary:
The term 'large capacity ammunition feeding device' means a magazine or similar device that has an overall capacity of more than 10 rounds of ammunition. It shall be unlawful for a person to import, sell, manufacture, or possess a large capacity ammunition feeding device. Shall not apply to the possession of any large capacity ammunition feeding device otherwise lawfully possessed before 2013. Shall not apply to qualified or retired law enforcement officers. Proponent's Argument for voting Yes: Sen. BLUMENTHAL: This amendment would ban high-capacity magazines which are used to kill more people more quickly and, in fact, have been used in more than half the mass shootings since 1982. I ask my colleagues to listen to law enforcement, their police, prosecutors who are outgunned by criminals who use these high-capacity magazines. I ask that my colleagues also listen to the families of those killed by people who used a high-capacity magazine. Opponent's Argument for voting No: Sen. GRASSLEY. I oppose the amendment. In 2004, which is the last time we had the large-capacity magazine ban, a Department of Justice study found no evidence banning such magazines has led to a reduction in gun violence. The study also concluded it is not clear how often the outcomes of the gun attack depend on the ability of offenders to fire more than 10 shots without reloading. Secondly, there is no evidence banning these magazines has reduced the deaths from gun crimes. In fact, when the previous ban was in effect, a higher percentage of gun crime victims were killed or wounded than before it was adopted. Additionally, tens of millions of these magazines have been lawfully owned in this country for decades. They are in common use, not unusually dangerous, and used by law-abiding citizens in self-defense, as in the case of law enforcement. Reference: Safe Communities, Safe Schools Act; Bill S.Amdt. 714 to S. 649 ; vote number 13-SV103 on Apr 17, 2013

Opposes restrictions on the right to bear arms.

Paul opposes the CC survey question on right to bear arms
The Christian Coalition voter guide [is] one of the most powerful tools Christians have ever had to impact our society during elections. This simple tool has helped educate tens of millions of citizens across this nation as to where candidates for public office stand on key faith and family issues. The CC survey summarizes candidate stances on the following topic: "Further restrictions on the right to keep and bear arms" Source: Christian Coalition Survey 10-CC-q10 on Aug 11, 2010

Rated AQ by the NRA, indicating a pro-gun rights voting record. Paul scores AQ by NRA on pro-gun rights policies. Source: NRA website 10-NRA on Aug 11, 2010

Oppose the United Nations' Arms Trade Treaty.

Paul signed Letter to Pres. Obama from 50 Senators
Dear President Obama:
We write to express our concern and regret at your decision to sign the United Nations' Arms Trade Treaty. For the following reasons, we cannot give our advice and consent to this treaty: The treaty violates a 2009 red line laid down by your own administration: "the rule of consensus decision-making." In April 2013, after the treaty failed to achieve consensus, it was adopted by majority vote in the UN General Assembly. The treaty allows amendments by a 3/4 majority vote. When amended, it will become a source of political and legal pressure on the US to comply in practice with amendments it was unwilling to accept. The treaty includes only a weak, non-binding reference to the lawful ownership and use of firearms, and recognizes none of these activities, much less individual self-defense, as fundamental individual rights. It encourages governments to collect the identities of individual end users of imported firearms at the national level, which would constitute the core of a national gun registry. The State Department has acknowledged that the treaty is "ambiguous." By becoming party to the treaty, the US would therefore be accepting commitments that are inherently unclear. The criteria at the heart of the treaty are vague and easily politicized. They will steadily subject the US to the influence of internationally-defined norms, a process that would impinge on our national sovereignty. The treaty criteria as established could hinder the US in fulfilling its strategic, legal, and moral commitments to provide arms to key allies such as Taiwan and Israel. We urge you to notify the treaty depository that the US does not intend to ratify the Arms Trade Treaty, and is therefore not bound by its obligations. As members of the Senate, we pledge to oppose the ratification of this treaty, and we give notice that we do not regard the US as bound to uphold its object and purpose. Source: Letter to Obama from 50 Senators 13-UNATT on Sep 25, 2013

Endorsed Liberty Candidate: no point in keeping guns you can't access.

Paul is endorsed by Congressional endorsement list
A Liberty Candidate will Defend the Great American Principles of Individual Liberty and Constitutional Government, [such as the views of] Rand Paul, Senate 2010 candidate from Kentucky, on Personal Liberty: "The Federal Government must return to its constitutionally enumerated powers and restore our inalienable rights. America can prosper, preserve personal liberty, and repel national security threats without intruding into the personal lives of its citizens." Source: 2010 Congressional endorsement list 2010-LC-GC on Sep 1, 2010
 
Bernie Sanders - Go.

Tell what you all think of him. If there is a thread. Please post a link and shut this down. I searched bernie sanders and not much came up. Being that he maybe the Democrat running and thought a thread would be worth while.

I thought that was without saying, his stance on 2nd Amendment and gun control. Its nice to have facts when talking about politics. I know my liberal leaning friends and family seem to like him. Which raises red flags for me :).
 
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Sanders would be worse than a third term of Obama. Assault Weapon bans, UBC, and magazine capacity bans over 10 rounds are his gun platforms. These were laws he tried to get pushed in Vermont but didn't get much of anywhere. Vermont has 6x more firearms than people but the lowest gun crime and the least gun laws. But he tried to change that for HIS agenda. Now he wants to do it nationally as President.

http://feelthebern.org/bernie-sanders-on-gun-policy/
 
It would seem he's is a fair weather friend to gun rights at best, supporting them when his constituents demanded it of him. He talks about circumspection. I have not heard him bash the NRA wholesale as others have. H. Clinton has painted him all-but a dupe of the NRA for being D- rated! His presence has somewhat made Clinton regard gun control as a plank issue for her campaign, and the NRA as her favorite strawman whipping boy. He certainly doesn't come off as a disrespectful moron only wanting to howl down the NRA, as HC has. Bottom line, he's D- rated by NRA. I am a single issue voter: I vote the RKBA and then my wallet and so on.
 
"Let's begin by understanding that Bernie Sanders has a D-minus voting rating from the NRA. Back in 1988, when I first ran for Congress, I supported a ban on assault weapons." - Bernie Sanders

"I voted against the NRA, and I voted to ban certain types of semiautomatic weapons." - Bernie Sanders

" I voted very strongly for instant background checks. I want to see them made stronger" - Bernie Sanders

" I am pro-gun, and pro-hunting. But I don't believe that hunters need assault weapons and AK-47s to kill deer. I voted for the ban on assault weapons, which brought the wrath of the NRS down on me." -Bernie Sanders
 
We need to stay focused on the original question of the stance of the candidates and avoid the drift.
 
Let's begin by understanding that the NRA's rating of any candidate means squat because the NRA's agenda is first and foremost about perpetuating the NRA and not about protecting the god-given rights of its members or of citizens in general. I would give more weight to a rating from Larry Pratt and GOA than I would from the NRA (and I am an NRA life member). But bottom line, the only thing that matters is the actual records of the candidates.

I don't have much use for any candidate who won't stand up and state, unequivocally, "free people don't need government permission to keep and bear arms", which I believe pretty much rules out the entire current field.
 
Rumor has it that no gun bills will be put on Kasich's desk until and unless he ends his presidential campaign.

One pro-gun bill was passed out of committee early in June and the Ohio House speaker still has not scheduled a floor vote.
 
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