SHOT Day 4- Taurus/Rossi

[JShirley]

I dragged Derek, groaning, over to the Taurus booth. And, lo and behold, I was impressed by many things I saw.

The obvious buzz items, the Judges, were in evidence. Taurus will be offering a Magnum Judge, that can fire a full 3" .410 shell. The Raging Judge,
based on their Raging Bull platform, will take full-sized .410 cartridges, as well as .454 Casull rounds. It also holds an extra round in its cylinder, with its additional latch at the front for strength.

Taurus' PT22 will now be available in a DAO polymer frame. The trigger pull is actually nicer than I remember my old PT22 being.

Taurus Slim PT709 9mm.

Taurus TCP .380.

 

[Justin]

The Taurus reps said not to call it a Mare's Leg.

Ok, so it's not practical. But maybe cool can sometimes take precedence.

"Ranch Hands" in .44 Magnum and .45 Colt. Also available in .38/.357 Mag. And I think this might still be a bit practical. -John

These are almost identical externally to the Trail Judge-12" barrel 2.5" .410 (not pictured).

I like the idea of a 12" barreled .410 much more than a 3" one.

 

[Derek Zeanah]

Okay, this I found VERY cool: this is a .22LR/.22Mag Tracker. Comes in 7 and 4" barrel lengths. Cylinder change takes about an easy 4 seconds.

What is also extremely neat: Rossi is making a carbine version of this. Want.

 

[Derek Zeanah]

"Tuffy" Circuit Judge- with a synthetic stock that is even short for me- (but I can work better with it than a too-long stock) fiber optic sights...

and tac rail at the front of the forearm. I'm disappointed that the rail is plastic, not metal, but do like the rail in general. Can see this being used as a varmint gun with a light.

I like the carbine/shotgun concept much better than the pistol/short-barreled shotgun concept. Light, handy, and even with old, slow black-powder strength .45 Colt, still effective against deer-sized game at close range. If the "jump" doesn't make .45 Colt inaccurate from this carbine, I definitely want one. The 9-round, interchangeable cylinder .22/.22 Mag Circuit Judge is mostly similar, but with a longer stock. I'll get one if I can put the .45/.410 stock on it.

Showing the hammer spur for cocking with a mounted scope.

Even with the longer wooden stock, this one feels surprisingly good when shouldered.

 

[Derek Zeanah]

Rossi's new Wizard carbines and single-shot pistols. This is a sturdy, switch-barrel system. Liking.

 

[Derek Zeanah]

A lever-driven (and therefore, single-action) Judge.


The level throw is short enough to take some getting used to. Notice the "hump" profile on this one.

 

[zstephens13]

So that Ranch Hand in .45 LC will also take .410 shotgun shells? I didn't notice that in the specifications on the website when I looked at them a few weeks ago.

 

[jerkface11]

Is that a lever action revolver rifle???

 

[armoredman]

There is a rumor that the Raging Judge 28 gauge and 410 Ranch Hand pistols are now declared NFA - was there a hint of that during the SHOT show?
I would love to see the Circuit Judge in 20 gauge.

 

[JShirley]

various

All of the revolving .410 Judge carbines take 3" shells.

Rossi will also be offering the Rio Grande, a lever action with 20" barrel, in .410 or .45-70.

zstephens, I want back and checked my materials, and I was mistaken. According to my literature, the lever-action .410 is just a .410, as the .45 Colt is just a Colt.

I did not see the 28 gauge Judge handgun in the booth Friday.

There have been some questions and concerns about cylinder gap blast when firing a revolving longarm. These do not seem to have any type of cylinder shield, so I am a little concerned about the potential for injury when firing a higher-pressure version like the .44 magnum. Wear eye protection, kids.

In general, I do not care for the Judge concept from a short-barreled revolver. I like the idea a lot more when 9 or more inches of barrel is attached. I see a .22 Magnum Circuit Judge in my future, if I can swap out the stock (and assuming it's an accurate piece). All of the Circuit Judges feel good, with their 18.5" barrels. I've never seen testing result for a 28 gauge. I would like to see them, or test the piece myself.

A lot of innovation here, from Taurus and Rossi. I am also advised that Taurus has opened a Florida plant, and are increasing the percentage of their guns made in the U.S. While I think the handgun Judge is primarily a gimmick, Taurus has obviously found an appreciative market. Based on handling alone, I love the Circuit Judges. If they hold up under use, and are accurate, I believe the Circuit Judges might sell even better than the handgun Judge versions.

 

[Derek Zeanah]

My understanding was a bit different re: manufacture. Taurus has traditionally manufactured it's guns in Brazil, but they have increased capacity at their Miami plant by 50% in the previous year.

So Taurus is moving toward much more US manufacture.

 

[Geneseo1911]

So, why on earth is a .410 ranch hand an AOW, when the Judge isn't? Who makes these stoopid laws?! Is it possible the announcement Monday will ban the Judge, in spite of the rifled barrel? That would at least be consistent.

 

[JShirley]

I hadn't heard that the Trail Judge was an AOW, but that doesn't mean it isn't so.

The Trail Judge is not rifled, whereas the revolving Judges are.

J

 

[Geneseo1911]

The Trail Judge is not rifled, whereas the revolving Judges are.

If that is the case, than a AOW classification actually makes sense (on the basis of the letter of the law, not rational sense), but I was under the impression that the Trail Judge was in fact rifled:

What makes this a really cool gun is that while the barrel is less than 18 inches long, the gun is not considered a short-barreled shotgun or an “AOW” (Any Other Weapon) by BATFE. This is because the barrel is fully rifled, legally making this gun a pistol.

sourced:HERE

Looks like the BATFE have killed two of the guns on display at SHOT, the Taurus 28 Gauge Raging Judge and a really neat little gun, the Rossi Trail Judge. I talked a little bit about the Trail Judge in my coverage of SHOT over at Shooting Illustrated.

sourced:HERE

 

[JShirley]

Well, I'm wrong. The literature does say the Trail Judge is rifled.

BATF's ruling could be based on this being a shotgun, and not made to fire any other cartridges, as the revolving Judges do.

 

[Geneseo1911]

aha-I didn't know that; I was assuming it would do .45 colt as well, but I suppose that would be hard to do reliably in that action.

 

[JShirley]

For once, I'd have to say I'd agree with the ATF's ruling. Out of a .410 solely designed to fire shotgun ammunition, the rifling serves as a legal fiction.

This is a shotgun, primarily designed to fire shot.

Do I think the law is stupid? Well, yeah. But ATF's interpretation, if they have indeed ruled the Trail Judge a AOW, is reasonable.

 

[Derek Zeanah]

Is that a lever action revolver rifle???

Yes, yes it is.

For Australian export, I believe.

 

[LiveLife]

Any mention of the G2 line/release date?

 

[Andy Griffith]

The Trail Judge was taken off display because the sample was only labeled for, and only feeds .410. It was not labeled as a .45 Colt- which it has to be.
I believe someone kinda had an oversight...I bet the engineering fellers may have gotten ahead of the regulations. Easy fix- and this thing will be on it's way again.


Now, if they can just get a federal pistol cartridge variance for the .577 Snider (or is it Snyder?) or .577 Webley. Hey, Webley chambered it, so it's a legitimate pistol cartridge- I want a Judge 28-bad!!! I've already found a 12" rifled barrel blank I can can whip up into something a bit more practical...with choke tubes.

Hey, where did my posts go?

I noticed you didn't get pictures of the 28ga Judge shotgun or the .22 combo carbine? What's the skinny? I think I've got to have one of the 28ga Rossi's to match my 1100.


They stated the 24/7 G2's are about 30 days out in full size...60 days on compacts.

Lastly, did anyone notice the .357 polymer DT's have a Colt action??!? The cylinder release pulls backwards and the cylinder rotated the opposite direction. I wonder if the "DT" is there to put it in mind of a "detective?" (Detective Special?) Very, very interesting- glad one company is trying new stuff.

 

[JShirley]

Ah, thanks for clearing that up.

And I should have checked more carefully, instead of assuming common sense would make sense, here.

 

[DilboFlaggins]

Did anyone at SHOT get a look at rossi's rio grand in .410?

Is that .410 and/or 45-70?

or is one model chambered in only .410 and another in only 45-70?

what about chokes? and the bore, sooth or rifled?

 

[Bubbles]

Uh oh - Taurus 28 ga Judge has problems:
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2011/01/25/big-gun-short-lived-taurus-28-gauge-revolver/

 

[JShirley]

The Rio Grande comes in two separate calibers, .410 and .45-70. Both have 20" barrels. Also comes in .30-30.

Sorry, didn't handle it.

Yeah, as I said, the 28 gauge Judge revolver wasn't in the booth when we went by. The revolving full-length shotgun was.