Subsonic .223

[Redemption]

I am interested in knowing if any of you guys have any experience in loading subsonic .223 loads. These will be used in an AR and if at all possible, I would like them to cycle the action.
I have seen links to some Tacticool brand of ammo that claims to be exactly what I am interested in, for the cheap price of 36 bucks for 20. These bullets appear to be 100 grain and frangible of some sort.
I will be shooting the ones I hope to make out of a 16 inch carbine, 1/9 or 1/7 with a can on the end. Naturally I would not want them to start yawing while still in the can.
I have seen a few loads using around 3.5-4.5 grains of titegroup or Unique with a 70 grain bullet. However, none of these are reported to cycle an AR or even come close to doing it.

Please don't ask me "why would you want to" and "get a .22" type of reply's because I have seen past threads on this turn into this without the OP ever getting a useable response.

Again, my fine friends, Do any of you know of a load in .223 that is both subsonic and will cycle the action in an AR 15?

Thank You.

 

[ants]

Well, a search would help you get more information. Like here
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=146269
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=136315
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1354294

Generally, most subsonic ammo doesn't make enough gas to cycle a gas-powered semiauto. Certain manufacturers (like the second link listed above) claim that their ammo will cycle a semi auto if a suppressor is attached (it captures a lot of energy normally lost at the muzzle). But I have no personal experience with it.

The vast majority of us loading subsonic 223 are using pistol powder. Loads are listed by various manufacturers. Solid lead bullets are safest at such low velocities, but several manufacturers list loads for jacketed bullets.

If you think it will be silent, you are mistaken. It still goes bang really loud. The bullet just doesn't carry the sonic crack with it.

 

[Redemption]

Well.... since that was the thread I was speaking of in my first post and you directed me to the Tacticool ammo I also spoke of, you really didn't need to direct me to another thread doing exactly what I asked this one not to do for the finale.

A simple can't be done would have been more polite. But, I know I have seen it at Knob Creek. I forgot knowledge is directly proportional to post count.

 

[Zak Smith]

Not gonna happen. Even in .300 Fireball the gas system is shorter than carbine.

 

[kelbro]

I would think that the gas system would have to be tuned. Good luck with your project.

 

[cougar1717]

I don't think this is possible without a lot of modification. The bullet has to travel slower than 1200fps, probably 1100 to make sure it doesn't go supersonic. To make it cycle, a person would probably need a lightened BCG, buffer, and much lighter recoil spring, unless there was some sort suppressor (mentioned above) to keep enough pressure from escaping to cycle the gun. Interesting concept, I hope it works for you.

 

[Kernel]

A simple .22 LR conversion kit would let the action cycle, allow for subsonic projectiles, and provide reasonable accuracy. All at a reasonable cost. However, you wouldn’t get the satisfaction of seeing .223 cases fly out the ejection port.

 

[ants]

Well.... since that was the thread I was speaking of in my first post and you directed me to the Tacticool ammo I also spoke of, you really didn't need to direct me to another thread doing exactly what I asked this one not to do for the finale.

A simple can't be done would have been more polite. But, I know I have seen it at Knob Creek. I forgot knowledge is directly proportional to post count.

I was polite to you, friend. And I'll certainly remain polite. We can be cordial together.

If you reload, go with your heaviest bullets. They generally produce the most gas for a given velocity. Nonetheless, none of my subsonic ammo cycles my AR rifles.

 

[LiquidTension]

I've been in search of the magical formula for a few years now. I haven't been able to get any subsonics to cycle the action I was using some Unique under a 55gr spitzer but I'm now moving up to a 77gr. The 55gr recipe doesn't fill up enough of the case, and if the rifle is pointed down the primer will flash over the powder. I believe Trailboss is called for in my newest recipe, but I don't have my reloading book at hand.

If you do find a load that works, please post it here. It would make many people very, very happy.

 

[ants]

I never found a subsonic that would cycle, but...

I did find a nice Alliant recipe for magnum pistol powder 2400 and 55g fmj bullets. Check with Alliant but I think the max load was 13.7 grains. It cycles the old AR rifles that are well broken in (but not a new tight carbine). But it runs 2525 fps so it's far from subsonic.

 

[LiquidTension]

Out of curiosity, why would you ever use that recipe? I guess if you really wanted to conserve powder or something it would make sense. On the bright side, it would be subsonic...at 2200 degrees F

 

[ants]

why would you ever use that recipe?

Cheap as you can get it.