T/C Encore Pistol ???
- Thread starter jbeltz7
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sithanas
Member
I was under the impression that the Encore rifle assembly can't be normally used as a pistol. (That, and isn't it illegal in some fashion?) You're probably better off getting a real contender frame, one that's a standard pistol, and using that. Though now that I think of it, the Contender and the Encore are incompatible when it comes to barrels.
Both rifle and pistol barrels are available for the Encore from T/C. The Contender is an older/different design and parts are not interchangeable.
While cutting a rifle barrel to less then 18" is illegal in most states am not sure this applies when discussing convertible receivers. But all things considered it would probably be best to purchase a factory pistol barrel.
While cutting a rifle barrel to less then 18" is illegal in most states am not sure this applies when discussing convertible receivers. But all things considered it would probably be best to purchase a factory pistol barrel.
MatthewVanitas
Member
When you purchased the firearm, did the dealer check "Rifle" or "Pistol" on the Form 4473?
If he checked Rifle, I'd keep a rifle barrel and stock on it.
If he checked Pistol, put whatever you want on it, but make sure that you don't put a buttstock on the frame unless the barrel on it is 16+".
If he _did_ check Rifle and you want to use it as a pistol, I'll throw out a potential idea. NOTE: I am not a lawyer.
Go to the friendliest gunshop in your area, or a "$15 FFL Fee" kitchen-table dealer. Strip your Encore down to the frame, sell it to him for $10. Buy it back from him for $10, plus his FFL fee. Ensure that he checks "Pistol" on the form 4473 when you buy it. You would then be the legal owner of an Encore pistol, which may also be used with a buttstock and 16+" barrel.
You legal eagles out there: does this work? Or does that serial number need to be officially listed as "built as a pistol receiver" back at the T/C factory?
If this idea does not meet the legal requirements, please let me know and I'll edit my post to put a big "THIS IS NOT A LEGALLY VIABLE IDEA, OFFERED AS NEGATIVE EXAMPLE ONLY" into this post.
-MV
If he checked Rifle, I'd keep a rifle barrel and stock on it.
If he checked Pistol, put whatever you want on it, but make sure that you don't put a buttstock on the frame unless the barrel on it is 16+".
If he _did_ check Rifle and you want to use it as a pistol, I'll throw out a potential idea. NOTE: I am not a lawyer.
Go to the friendliest gunshop in your area, or a "$15 FFL Fee" kitchen-table dealer. Strip your Encore down to the frame, sell it to him for $10. Buy it back from him for $10, plus his FFL fee. Ensure that he checks "Pistol" on the form 4473 when you buy it. You would then be the legal owner of an Encore pistol, which may also be used with a buttstock and 16+" barrel.
You legal eagles out there: does this work? Or does that serial number need to be officially listed as "built as a pistol receiver" back at the T/C factory?
If this idea does not meet the legal requirements, please let me know and I'll edit my post to put a big "THIS IS NOT A LEGALLY VIABLE IDEA, OFFERED AS NEGATIVE EXAMPLE ONLY" into this post.
-MV
What was advertised by T/C is now Illegal
T/C used to advertise buy the pistols (Contender and Encore) and also have your rifle and carbine by switching out the grips for stocks, and installing the proper barrel and fore end. Then the BATF ruled that that constituted that to do such was a major modification, and further, one could not register one as the other (pistol V. long gun).
So, now one needs 4 separate frames, not just 2. The fore ends attach via 2 screws through the fore end. The Encore has 2, threaded holds in the barrel's bottom. Contenders 12 & 14" also have 2 screws. 10" have 1 screw to attach fore end. The Contender barrel has milled barrels and the threaded inserts are placed in those. They can have a tendency to fall out.
By take on T/Cs? They are awesome!!! My favorite, Contender pistol in .22LR MATCH, and Encore pistol in either .444 Marlin or .45-70 Gov't. I have taken MANY game animals big & small with both, and never had to shoot twice. Excellent accuracy and awesome power for a handgun!
Doc2005
T/C used to advertise buy the pistols (Contender and Encore) and also have your rifle and carbine by switching out the grips for stocks, and installing the proper barrel and fore end. Then the BATF ruled that that constituted that to do such was a major modification, and further, one could not register one as the other (pistol V. long gun).
So, now one needs 4 separate frames, not just 2. The fore ends attach via 2 screws through the fore end. The Encore has 2, threaded holds in the barrel's bottom. Contenders 12 & 14" also have 2 screws. 10" have 1 screw to attach fore end. The Contender barrel has milled barrels and the threaded inserts are placed in those. They can have a tendency to fall out.
By take on T/Cs? They are awesome!!! My favorite, Contender pistol in .22LR MATCH, and Encore pistol in either .444 Marlin or .45-70 Gov't. I have taken MANY game animals big & small with both, and never had to shoot twice. Excellent accuracy and awesome power for a handgun!
Doc2005
Surprisingly enough I stole it from a crack dealer. 
Actually to further confuse the legal beagles I purchased it out of the local classified configured as a Muzzle Loader. While I certainly don't confuse the law with common sense, if taken to court (for reasons beyond comprehending) I believe it could be easily shown that a "reasonable person" would assume due to the legal availability of all three barrels no crime was committed.
Has this instance ever been prosecuted??
Interesting discussion.
Actually to further confuse the legal beagles I purchased it out of the local classified configured as a Muzzle Loader. While I certainly don't confuse the law with common sense, if taken to court (for reasons beyond comprehending) I believe it could be easily shown that a "reasonable person" would assume due to the legal availability of all three barrels no crime was committed.
Has this instance ever been prosecuted??
Interesting discussion.
MatthewVanitas
Member
Doc2005:
Whoa, heavy.
Do you have any link or cite for that, Doc? Not to doubt you, but it'd be great to see it in black-and-white.
T/Cs webpage has no big "OWNER ALERT" warning, nothing in the FAQ, etc.
I'm further confused, because it's apparently perfectly legal to turn a 1911 into a carbine with a Mech-Tech upper, and Beretta just came out with the carbine kit for their Neos pistol a few months back.
Is this a recent BATFE ruling, or is there some obscure reason it would apply to single-shot pistols, but not semis?
jbeltz7:
There was some kind of hubbub in California back when I was a toddler. I believe the .45Colt/.410 combo barrels are still illegal in CA if under 18", because they ran afoul of CA's rules on "sawed-off shotguns". You can THR search or Google this to get the exact details.
Thanks for any clarification on this. -MV
Whoa, heavy.
Do you have any link or cite for that, Doc? Not to doubt you, but it'd be great to see it in black-and-white.
T/Cs webpage has no big "OWNER ALERT" warning, nothing in the FAQ, etc.
I'm further confused, because it's apparently perfectly legal to turn a 1911 into a carbine with a Mech-Tech upper, and Beretta just came out with the carbine kit for their Neos pistol a few months back.
Is this a recent BATFE ruling, or is there some obscure reason it would apply to single-shot pistols, but not semis?
jbeltz7:
There was some kind of hubbub in California back when I was a toddler. I believe the .45Colt/.410 combo barrels are still illegal in CA if under 18", because they ran afoul of CA's rules on "sawed-off shotguns". You can THR search or Google this to get the exact details.
Thanks for any clarification on this. -MV
Chuck Perry
Member
When I purchased mine, 20X50 rifle, the dealer made sure to sell it as a pistol so as to avoid future problems when switching bbls. Having done this, I plan to do whatever I want with mine. I don't think the ATF is cracking down too hard on single shots. Yet.
Legionnaire
Contributing Member
Check your state regs. In NY, where every handgun has to be on your permit, the frame has to have been registered as a pistol. Big no-no buying a rifle and then converting it to a pistol. However, no problem going the other way around. But you better keep the original caliber pistol barrel so you can legally get the thing OFF your permit if you eventually sell the frame.
T/C put out an advertisement about this some years back warning their customers. I called T/C Arms, to clarify and they advised me that the BATF had made this change. T/C Arms or the BATF would be your best source for the specific ruling. You can contact T/C Arms at either of the two following numbers:
800-243-4570 -or- 603-332-2333.
I too question how people can switch out their Glock or 1911 receivers into carbines but T/C arms can not?
Doc2005
800-243-4570 -or- 603-332-2333.
I too question how people can switch out their Glock or 1911 receivers into carbines but T/C arms can not?
Doc2005
Sniper X
Member
I have a TC contender with two pistol barrels but am going to buy, when I figgure out what cal I want, a rifle barrel. I heard that if you put a pistol bbl on a rifle stock it is against the bbl length BATF rules. But, I won't do that . I will buy a rifle stock and probably a carbine barrel. Contrary to popular beleife you can change the old to new contender barrels but Im not sure about the interchangeability of the new new model. Mine are .270ren, and .357mag both of which are totally fun to shoot.
The forends attach with two screws like the rifle forend, but the spacing is different.
About the legalities, Doc is right.
T/C's ads now show Rifle/shotgun/muzzle loader as interchangable.
They never advertise the Encore pistol with the others.
However my dealer assures me that my Encore frame was registered as 'all' or 'interchangable' or something to the effect of being registered as a multi-purpose frame. I'm not willing to risk a felony on that though. My Encore pistol will stay a pistol.
Jeffreii
Member
simple:
-Remove sight
-Saw the rifle barrel to desired length
-Replace sight
note:
You would also want to make an 11 degree flare at the end of the barrel for accuracy so the bullet leaves the barrel with equal pressure behind/around it. Also, If under 16" then you have to have a pistol grip not a rifle stock (IMO: infringement of right) attatched to the frame to make it legal. No peashooters allowed!
<SLV>
Member
Here is the definitive answer
It seems that you can buy a "pistol" receiver (registered as such) and use it as a rifle (as long as the barrel is 16"+):
http://www.bellmtcs.com/store/index.php?cid=239
It seems that you can buy a "pistol" receiver (registered as such) and use it as a rifle (as long as the barrel is 16"+):
http://www.bellmtcs.com/store/index.php?cid=239
I have T/C Contander- and G2 frames. .22 Hornet and 9mm Luger 10" barrels .357 Rem Max 14" and .223 Rem 21" barrels. I use them with pistol and carbine stocks. There are no authorities in our shooting plases. They cann´t check out my car or my home.
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