The Importance of the Pending Elections [in regards to the future of the 2A]

How important do you think the election is, in regards to the future of the 2A?

  • Critical Importance - The Most Important in history

    Votes: 107 69.5%
  • One of the Most Important, but NOT the single-most important in history

    Votes: 32 20.8%
  • Important, but NOT critically-important

    Votes: 9 5.8%
  • NOT Very Important

    Votes: 3 1.9%
  • NOT Important At All

    Votes: 3 1.9%

  • Total voters
    154
  • Poll closed .
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cdk8

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Jul 20, 2015
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422
A friend and mentor of mine who's about 40 years older than me feels with the upcoming elections that the stakes are higher than they have ever been.

So I am curious...
In regards to the future of the Second Amendment, how important* do you think the upcoming elections are?
(*that is, the potential impact of an election outcome where anti-gun candidates win, with regards to how much they would threaten the future of the 2A, increasing the importance of the overall issue.)


  • Critical Importance & Unprecedented Potential Impact - in regards to the 2A, this will be the most important election in American history
    (i.e., the outcome of the election could result in changes to the 2A that are more extreme than any previous proposed or passed legislation, and an impact that surpasses that of the National Firearms Act)
    --------------------------------------------------
  • One of the Most Important, but NOT the single-most important in history
    (i.e., a potential impact that is as significant as the NFA, but not greater)
    --------------------------------------------------
  • Important, but NOT critically-important
    (i.e., a potential impact that is significant, but less than the NFA & other major historical legislation)
    --------------------------------------------------
  • NOT Very Important
    (i.e., regardless of the outcome, a potential impact that is limited)
    --------------------------------------------------
  • NOT Important At All
    (i.e., regardless of outcome, the potential impact would be contained to a point where it has minimal or no
    effect on the 2A)
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What Redwind said. Not just for the 2nd, for everything. If that harpy gets in office, she can stack up the court with so many liberal leaning judges (with lifetime appointments) that the consequences will last much longer than the 4-8 years she is in office. THAT would be her legacy.
 
The problem is candidates we have too choose from....

Hillery is VERY anti gun.

Trump was up until maybe 3-4 years ago VERY anti gun. If you believe hes really changed at all. I dont.


Ether way I think we are screwed. I guess I have to vote for trump now. I don't like him I don't trust him.
 
I think it's very important, but not necessarily the most critically important election in American history. I think the importance of this election in regards to the 2A issue has a whole heck of a lot more to do with the political climate in this country than it has to do with the candidates.

The second amendment is going to be a major issue in every Presidential election from this year forward. Not that it hasn't been important in the past, but more because the "antis" aren't ever going to give up, and with each year they've only strengthened their resolve. There's more and more media coverage of violence, to the point where we hear stories about it literally every single day, despite the evidence and data proving crime rates are at the lowest point in decades. You really have to go out of your way to get the truth, and the prerequisite for that is the concession that, possibly, everything you're being told is a lie. Many people aren't willing to make that concession.

The 2A is an issue worth shedding blood over. If that was EVER true (and our county was founded on the premise that it is), then it's still true today. I think that's a very rare opinion these days, and will only become less popular as time goes on. For that reason, if nothing else, every election is critically important.
 
#1. With little doubt. SCOTUS vacancies alone make it vital, IMO.

^ This. The SCOTUS picks could have a huge impact on our RKBA rights and other issues for generations to come.

Trump was up until maybe 3-4 years ago VERY anti gun. If you believe hes really changed at all. I dont (sic).

His position piece is about as solidly RKBA as one can wish for in this day and age. Maybe he is sincere, maybe his isn't, but do you honestly see him burning up political capital going against his own party to enact, unpopular, draconian laws? Unlikely.

Now "enjoy" Hillary's, and pay special attention to the groups who have endorsed her on this topic.

Ether (sic) way I think we are screwed.

Read over his SCOTUS list. Then think of the kind of jurists Hillary will appoint. Which one will likely be more hostile to the 2A?
 
Her VP pick is already spouting drivel about "common sense gun laws". I think Perry Mason would call that a "clue" about the direction they're headed.
 
It's not just SCOTUS

As POTUS, she also gets to appoint federal judges to the lower court, which the current POTUS has already done a pretty good job of stacking with judges hostile to gun owners.

If she wins, gun owners will be screwed on more than one court level.
 
For those of you thinking scotus appointments you're a little late. If it wasn't for a previous election heller would have been decided differently already and you would have no individual right for several years now.

I'd say that if Ron Paul had beaten shrub then Gonzalez vs raich, kilo, obamacare and a few others would mean we could be living in a world with federal powers restricted to what's written in the constitution

No this isn't the most important election in history. It's just the most important one since 2012.
 
I won't say much on my political thoughts other than I think our system has been FUBAR for some time.

The last two cycles, especially the first term for Obama, I remember folks saying it would be the apocalypse if he were elected. Two terms later and not much has changed as far as 2A. If anything it's a little better than it was. That's as far as the POTUS is concerned.

Granted, there have been other elected officials that have made moves on our 2A rights, and in reality that's where our focus should be. There's sooooo much more to govt than the POTUS, yet that seems to be what everyone focuses on.


To be honest, if Hillary wins I'd be much more worried about the Russians, China/Korea or Iraq/Iran pulling something on us than 2A rights being tarnished. Course, if Trump wins it could be the same outcome just with more countries.
 
SCOTUS pure and simple...the person taking office will have 1 and at least 1 more to fill before the first term is up...RBG will be going out...possibly one more...that will be 4 justices to seat in 8 years...yeah...this is an important election cycle...
 
The last two cycles, especially the first term for Obama, I remember folks saying it would be the apocalypse if he were elected.
Obama is more of a pragmatist than some folks give him credit for - I think he took to heart Bill Clinton's analysis of why the Democrats lost the Senate (Bill's anti-gun stance / actions).

Much of what Obama did he was dragged into kicking and screaming by the far left anti-2nd Amendment folks.

I think HRC will be MUCH worse for gun owners than Obama - she's an ideologue when it comes to guns, and she has not taken Bill's warnings to heart.
 
Well, let's see. The last time Hillary lived in the White House (and I hope it was the LAST time), the Clinton administration came up with a scheme to change the way guns were distributed and tried to do an end run around Congress by threatening gun manufacturers with law suits, even though they were following existing law.

This was the most unconstitutional practice to come out of a Presidential administration since FDR tried to pack the Supreme Court.

Now let's take a look at what she promises will happen if she's elected:

But I’m going to continue to speak out for comprehensive background checks, closing the gun show loopholes, closing the online loophole, closing the so-called Charleston loophole, reversing the bill that Senator Sanders voted for and I voted against, giving immunity from liability to gun makers and sellers. I think all of that can and should be done and it is, in my view, consistent with the “Constitution.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ary-clinton-on-guns-and-the-second-amendment/

This means background checks for ALL sales, no online sales (whether via an FFL or not), the government can take as long as it wants to run a background check (read "forever"), allowing gun manufacturers to be sued for illegal acts committed with their guns (imagine Chevy being sued because somebody got into an accident while driving drunk in one of their cars).

STEPHANOPOULOS: I said do you believe that their conclusion that an individual’s right to bear arms is a constitutional right?

CLINTON: If it is a constitutional right, then it, like every other constitutional right, is subject to reasonable regulation. [emphasis added] ibid

IF??? It's been settled by the Supreme Court!

What this translates to is she'll do whatever she can get away with.

Add in her support for stopping gun sales to anybody the government puts on a secret "terrorist" list without a shred of due process and her advocacy of nationwide "Australian style" gun confiscation, and yes, I would say this is a critical election.
 
For those of you thinking scotus appointments you're a little late. If it wasn't for a previous election heller would have been decided differently already and you would have no individual right for several years now.

Indeed, those were serious cases (Heller, McDonald) with an enormous impact on 2A case law. However, all decisions can, in part or in whole, be reversed by a subsequent decision.

Beyond that, there are plenty of cases that could result in further restrictions on RKBA. We need to make sure there right judges are on the bench, if and when, those cases make it to SCOTUS.

I'd say that if Ron Paul had beaten shrub then Gonzalez vs raich, kilo, obamacare and a few others would mean we could be living in a world with federal powers restricted to what's written in the constitution

Ron Paul ran in 1988 as the Libertarian candidate and received 0.47% of the votes in the general. He ran as Republican in 2008 and 2012 and didn't even come close to clinching the nomination. A "what if" of a Paul presidency is purely academic, to put it mildly.
 
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Presidential ballot could have been important to RKBA, but won't be this time
--Gun control is almost certainly a low priority for Donald, though this is more blessing than curse for us
--The practical effect of any sweeping doomsday bans Hillary could pass will be minimal in free states as noncompliance spreads even up into state governments, and slave states are already restricted
Down ballot is far more important since both candidates will be requiring congressional resistance to keep their authoritarian natures in check, but naturally no one will pay attention to this crucial function & instead denounce anyone who would oppose bad law so long as it's their party's law
--Shortsighted national security & economic bills will pass, regardless
--More and more criminal acts by officials will leak out, nothing will be prosecuted, regardless
Supreme Court will become more politically-motivated regardless, though it's unlikely either candidate will get conservative justices appointed for a number of reasons
--Bad precedent will continue to pile up, important decisions will be put off
--It's diminished moral authority to interpret the law will continue to erode, faster

So basically the same as most recent elections, just slip-slided a bit further past the event horizon since the last go-around. The United States' mind is clearly going in its autumn years, but we aren't panicking just yet. That will probably start around the time Donald's trade wars start WWIII or Hillary's foreign policy blunders start WWIII.

TCB
 
The last two cycles, especially the first term for Obama, I remember folks saying it would be the apocalypse if he were elected.
It was, though it'd been inevitable for two generations, and here we are now, facing a post apocalyptic wasteland to be ruled by one of two liberal plutocrats (yes ruled, since they have both made it abundantly clear they do not intend to abide by the bounds of their office with their policy proposals and statements). We'll likely bounce back and forth between incompetent cults of personality from here on out, until one of them finally decides they aren't leaving after eight years.

No one thought we'd be sifting through radioactive rubble if Obama was elected, just that it would signal the beginning of the end for enlightenment government. Now that the congress has been irreparably broken due to sustained manufactured gridlock (Reid) to precipitate Executive usurpation, and the courts sufficiently discredited through a number of back-to-back contradictory or inexplicable rulings, we've started down the final stretch. Few more wars, attacks, or economic crises, and we'll be there. It's abundantly clear we've had no intention of stopping ourselves up to this point.

TCB
 
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Significant, yes, as the next POTUS is nominating and seating probably 3 SCOTUS justices.

"Historically significant"--maybe not. Not unless Johnson is elected. Or if there is an Electoral College tie.
 
I'm more concerned with the candidates SCOTUS picks. They will impact our 2A and all other rights for the next 30 or so years. When all of our rights are decided/determined by 1 vote on the Supreme Court, that's going to hurt.
 
It's 2a/SCOTUS all-the-way ! !

Um, let's not be so short sighted (no pun) looking solely at the Trump Presidency. If all goes well, it goes something like this...

Trump, 2 terms, which should be good for 2A re: SCOTUS appointments. Therefore...
Pence runs for POTUS, and potentially another 2 terms, picking up what loose ends are left. Just look farther fellow HighRoaders...past the next sound bite, and definately past Nov 8th!

Again,I agree for 2A issues and others, the largest reason to pull the lever is, THE SUPREME COURT JUSTICE NOMINATIONS AND SUBSEQUENT APPOINTMENTS
 
You have to Vote TRUMP because Hillary will try to kill the 2A at every turn. Trump is now VERY strong on he 2A, he has seen the light. I don't understand why people get criticized for changing positions. Aren't we always talking on the internet about trying to change people's opinion to garner another shooter and 2A supporter? Yet when a politician does it, coming around to OUR side, he is criticized and people say they don't trust it. Just amazing. The man has a carry license, and packs. He and his sons are NRA members and shoot. What the heck more do some of you people need.

I've always been NEVER-Hillary...and now I'm quickly turning into a Trump supporter.

https://www.donaldjtrump.com/positions/second-amendment-rights
PROTECTING OUR SECOND AMENDMENT RIGHTS WILL MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN

Donald J. Trump on the Right to Keep and Bear Arms

The Second Amendment to our Constitution is clear. The right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed upon. Period.

The Second Amendment guarantees a fundamental right that belongs to all law-abiding Americans. The Constitution doesn’t create that right – it ensures that the government can’t take it away. Our Founding Fathers knew, and our Supreme Court has upheld, that the Second Amendment’s purpose is to guarantee our right to defend ourselves and our families. This is about self-defense, plain and simple.

It’s been said that the Second Amendment is America’s first freedom. That’s because the Right to Keep and Bear Arms protects all our other rights. We are the only country in the world that has a Second Amendment. Protecting that freedom is imperative. Here’s how we will do that:

Enforce The Laws On The Books

We need to get serious about prosecuting violent criminals. The Obama administration’s record on that is abysmal. Violent crime in cities like Baltimore, Chicago and many others is out of control. Drug dealers and gang members are given a slap on the wrist and turned loose on the street. This needs to stop.

Several years ago there was a tremendous program in Richmond, Virginia called Project Exile. It said that if a violent felon uses a gun to commit a crime, you will be prosecuted in federal court and go to prison for five years – no parole or early release. Obama’s former Attorney General, Eric Holder, called that a “cookie cutter” program. That’s ridiculous. I call that program a success. Murders committed with guns in Richmond decreased by over 60% when Project Exile was in place – in the first two years of the program alone, 350 armed felons were taken off the street.

Why does that matter to law-abiding gun owners? Because they’re the ones who anti-gun politicians and the media blame when criminals misuse guns. We need to bring back and expand programs like Project Exile and get gang members and drug dealers off the street. When we do, crime will go down and our cities and communities will be safer places to live.

Here’s another important way to fight crime – empower law-abiding gun owners to defend themselves. Law enforcement is great, they do a tremendous job, but they can’t be everywhere all of the time. Our personal protection is ultimately up to us. That’s why I’m a gun owner, that’s why I have a concealed carry permit, and that’s why tens of millions of Americans have concealed carry permits as well. It’s just common sense. To make America great again, we’re going to go after criminals and put the law back on the side of the law-abiding.

Fix Our Broken Mental Health System

Let’s be clear about this. Our mental health system is broken. It needs to be fixed. Too many politicians have ignored this problem for too long.

All of the tragic mass murders that occurred in the past several years have something in common – there were red flags that were ignored. We can’t allow that to continue. We need to expand treatment programs, because most people with mental health problems aren’t violent, they just need help. But for those who are violent, a danger to themselves or others, we need to get them off the street before they can terrorize our communities. This is just common sense.

And why does this matter to law-abiding gun owners? Once again, because they get blamed by anti-gun politicians, gun control groups and the media for the acts of deranged madmen. When one of these tragedies occurs, we can count on two things: one, that opponents of gun rights will immediately exploit it to push their political agenda; and two, that none of their so-called “solutions” would have prevented the tragedy in the first place. They’ve even admitted it.

We need real solutions to address real problems. Not grandstanding or political agendas.

Defend The Rights of Law-Abiding Gun Owners

GUN AND MAGAZINE BANS. Gun and magazine bans are a total failure. That’s been proven every time it’s been tried. Opponents of gun rights try to come up with scary sounding phrases like “assault weapons”, “military-style weapons” and “high capacity magazines” to confuse people. What they’re really talking about are popular semi-automatic rifles and standard magazines that are owned by tens of millions of Americans. Law-abiding people should be allowed to own the firearm of their choice. The government has no business dictating what types of firearms good, honest people are allowed to own.

BACKGROUND CHECKS. There has been a national background check system in place since 1998. Every time a person buys a gun from a federally licensed gun dealer – which is the overwhelming majority of all gun purchases – they go through a federal background check. Study after study has shown that very few criminals are stupid enough to try and pass a background check – they get their guns from friends/family members or by stealing them. So the overwhelming majority of people who go through background checks are law-abiding gun owners. When the system was created, gun owners were promised that it would be instant, accurate and fair. Unfortunately, that isn’t the case today. Too many states are failing to put criminal and mental health records into the system – and it should go without saying that a system’s only going to be as effective as the records that are put into it. What we need to do is fix the system we have and make it work as intended. What we don’t need to do is expand a broken system.

NATIONAL RIGHT TO CARRY. The right of self-defense doesn’t stop at the end of your driveway. That’s why I have a concealed carry permit and why tens of millions of Americans do too. That permit should be valid in all 50 states. A driver’s license works in every state, so it’s common sense that a concealed carry permit should work in every state. If we can do that for driving – which is a privilege, not a right – then surely we can do that for concealed carry, which is a right, not a privilege.

MILITARY BASES AND RECRUITING CENTERS. Banning our military from carrying firearms on bases and at recruiting centers is ridiculous. We train our military how to safely and responsibly use firearms, but our current policies leave them defenseless. To make America great again, we need a strong military. To have a strong military, we need to allow them to defend themselves.
 
What the heck more do some of you people need.

The obvious answer to this is: A record of voting pro-2A. Which obviously can't apply here. So it's harder to judge. Not that there would ever be any comparison between two big government options being put forth
 
The obvious answer to this is: A record of voting pro-2A. Which obviously can't apply here. So it's harder to judge. Not that there would ever be any comparison between two big government options being put forth
SO you need something you can not possibly get, since he's never been a politician. Meanwhile, Hillary has a solid record of voting ANTI-2A...Trump could not possibly do any worse. Read his position. He has a NY carry permit and carries...obviously he's come around and seen the light.

And for those of you who are going to sit home on election day and feel self righteous as you watch Hillary be sworn in, and watch our liberties get squashed over the next 4-8 years. You may feel proud, but the country will suffer for your stupidity, arrogance, and misplaced pride. People did that with Romney, and look what the last 4 years got us. Keep doing the same thing and expecting different results...
 
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