The wages of stupid: homeowner shot in Greenville, SC

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edwardware

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Here's an excellent summary of the situation by the GCSO, with 911 and radio audio, and body cam footage:


Looks like a good shooting, entirely justified based on the information the deputy had at the time. Fortunately the homeowner is merely shot for this stupidity, not killed.

From a tactics POV: if your assessment of the situation says you need a gun in your hand, you shouldn't be pointing it towards the man in the window with the big flashlight. Get some cover and call the police.

And from a Strategic POV: if you have a silent alarm you should be aware of this as a failure mode; thumb-fingering the pad can send suspicious armed men to your home in the middle of the night because you summoned them!

Also, those big sidelite windows by the front door are kind of a thoughtless architectural choice. . .
 
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edwardware said:
Here's an excellent summary of the situation by the GCSO, with 911 and radio audio, and body cam footage:


Looks like a good shooting, entirely justified based on the information the deputy had at the time. Fortunately the homeowner is merely shot for this stupidity, not killed.

From a tactics POV: if your assessment of the situation says you need a gun in your hand, you shouldn't be pointing it towards the man in the window with the big flashlight. Get some cover and call the police.

And from a Strategic POV: if you have a silent alarm you should be aware of this as a failure mode; thumb-fingering the pad can send suspicious armed men to your home in the middle of the night because you summoned them!

Also, those big sidelite windows by the front door are kind of a thoughtless architectural choice. . .
Click to expand...


For me, I have no windows you can look in at the ground level. If I don't hear the word POLICE I will certainly be pointing a weapon. If the door comes crashing in I and my large dogs will be attacking full force. I assume the authorities will identify themselves before crashing my door. My door area is a complex area so rushing in will be a problem.
 
The home owner triggered a cell phone app that sent an alarm! Can't blame the Police for responding to a home owner initiated alarm.

It is a good thing the home owner did not have the codes to a Nuclear missile launch on his cell phone. He would never have known he started WW3.
 
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Slamfire said:
The home owner triggered a cell phone app that sent an alarm! Can't blame the Police for responding to a home owner initiated alarm.

It is a good thing the home owner did not have the codes to a Nuclear missile launch on his cell phone. He would never have known he started WW3.
Click to expand...

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That is an insightful video, edwardware. Thanks for sharing. I feel pretty bad for everybody involved. I kept thinking about what must have been going through that deputy's head. I could hear how emotionally charged the situation was - on both sides. A relevant lesson for all of us who carry guns. There's nothing like a huge adrenaline dump to see how much of that training really stuck.
 
edwardware said:
Here's an excellent summary of the situation by the GCSO, with 911 and radio audio, and body cam footage:


Looks like a good shooting, entirely justified based on the information the deputy had at the time. Fortunately the homeowner is merely shot for this stupidity, not killed. . . .
Click to expand...


Slamfire said:
The home owner triggered a cell phone app that sent an alarm! Can't blame the Police for responding to a home owner initiated alarm.

It is a good thing the home owner did not have the codes to a Nuclear missile launch on his cell phone. He would never have known he started WW3.
Click to expand...
We are given enough details as to why the GCSO sent a deputy, especially considering prior attempted phone calls with no answers, and why the deputy acted as he did.
However it would have been helpful to know who/why someone had such an emergency call app and why didn't he/she answer the the attempted calls to check the intial notice to the emergency company. This app is mentioned at approximately 9:20.
 
Several ''I am learning sumthn'' takeaways here. Least ways for me (YMMV)...

EXCELLENT option by the local law agency to provide an info vid. While kinda police-speak, it does give actual bonafide info which may be helpful to the local community as to what happened. And (obviously) everyone else i.e. here.

An exterior household camera (even non recording or monitored) would have ended all this, the homeowner could have pulled up the cam, oh...it's the police-- whattsup officer.

I do not know what type app or alerter thingie the homeowner accidentally triggered, but I would prefer the 2 step type 1)alarm is triggered 2) apps screen says --R U sure, Sir/Ma'am? hit button 2nd time. We're talking split seconds here

Smartphones have a setting whereas after a specified time i.e. 10/pm the phone will not ring through, unless the caller is on a favorites list. FOR GOD SAKES if you're phone is setup like this, -mine is- to avoid telemarketers etc- MAKE SURE your emergency numbers are selected as favorites i.e. local police, close family friends, ALARM COMPANY. I even went so far as to call the local LEO and ask, what # will be incoming in case of emergency contact, make SURE I have correct#. I even select some horrible revolting extra loud alarm so as not to miss it. Whatever happened with this fellow couldn't hear phone, I do not know. Just FYI


Just a horrible situation whereas no one really did anything ''wrong'', yet harm was done anyway. I am certain the officer isn't happy just because it was a justified shoot. I hope this man recovers fully from his wounds with only 2 lil holes to ever know about it.
 
The number of false alarms that Police have to respond to is just staggering:

False Alarm Ordinance Imposes Fines on Repeat Offenders

https://nopdnews.com/post/march-2017/false-alarm-ordinance-imposes-fines-on-repeat-offe/

Last year 98.9 percent of all alarm calls in New Orleans were false alarms. NOPD officers responded to nearly 40,100 dispatched automatic alarm calls across the city, which averages to 110 calls per day. Of the 40,100 dispatched calls, 39,643 were false alarms. Officers can spend anywhere from 20 minutes to as long as an hour responding and clearing alarm calls. After being dispatched to the scene, police must clear the building and wait for a business representative to arrive. Police are often called to the same address multiple times in one night due to faulty alarm systems.

3 Ways to Stop False Alarms

https://www.eyewitnesssurveillance.com/3-ways-stop-false-alarms-prevent-penalty-fees/

False alarms distract law enforcement from true crimes, wasting the authorities’ time and resources. The Suffolk County police department, for example, responded to 97,000 false alarms in 2015 alone. Those alarms wasted more than 32,000 patrol hours. 98% of the San Jose Police Department’s burglar alarm calls were false alarms, throwing away $662,000 worth of policework.

OPPORTUNITIES FOR POLICE COST SAVINGSWITHOUT SACRIFICING SERVICE QUALITY:REDUCING FALSE ALARMS

https://www.urban.org/sites/default...g-service-quality-reducing-false-alarms_0.pdf

And as the video shows, if you can't keep your bugger hook off the screen of your idiot device, you might get shot when you send a false alarm.
 
Messed up situation all around.

I actually don’t think either party did anything wrong until the homeowner actually pointed the revolver at him.

If someone starts banging on my door at 11:49 pm I’m going to the door with a gun in my hand. It’s just not going to get pointed at anything except the deck unless someone does something hostile and I also don’t have large windows without shutters, curtains or tinting where someone on the porch can view me inside my home.

Once he pointed it at him all bets are off.
 
wyze cam on Amazon would have RESOLVED b4 expanding gases propelled bullet down barrel

Brace yourself....no R Lobster today... $26.00 AND extra easy to setup like, 12 seconds
 
The failure is with the alarm company, there should be a way to distinguish between a medical and criminal emergency.

homeowner stated he uses a C-pap they can be loud and allows one deep sleep, both could explain why he didn’t answer phone and was “out of it” when he did wake up.

Tragic yes but I believe the issue was with the tactics, does a medical emergency require drawn firearm by LEO?
 
I’ll be honest, I’m not real big into S&T.
That said, I can’t imagine intentionally pointing a gun at some until/unless I KNOW they are a threat, maybe I’m the only one.
Seems to me that solves this issue.
 
As a retired LEO who answered so many of "those calls" that I could not possibly know the number,I saw that the LEO responded as the majority of trained officers would = and SHOULD.
IF you see a man approach your house with a flashlight and he is not in any manner a threat when your IN YOUR HOUSE = do not display any weapon in any manner.
The home owner is lucky to be alive,and he learned a VERY,VERY painful lesson.
And hell yes to the idiotic design of those side windows.
My house is a brick ranch,and I bought it due to the windows being at least 8 FEET above ground level.
And then I hardened it and alarmed & camere'd it !.
Great lesson for any here who have design issues with their house.
 


I mean if you overlook the fact that the Sheriff's Department's initial report of what happened bear's absolutely no resemblance to the truth...
 
edwardware said:
Here's an excellent summary of the situation by the GCSO, with 911 and radio audio, and body cam footage:


Looks like a good shooting, entirely justified based on the information the deputy had at the time. Fortunately the homeowner is merely shot for this stupidity, not killed.

From a tactics POV: if your assessment of the situation says you need a gun in your hand, you shouldn't be pointing it towards the man in the window with the big flashlight. Get some cover and call the police.

And from a Strategic POV: if you have a silent alarm you should be aware of this as a failure mode; thumb-fingering the pad can send suspicious armed men to your home in the middle of the night because you summoned them!

Also, those big sidelite windows by the front door are kind of a thoughtless architectural choice. . .
Click to expand...


Note how the audio is blanked out until after the shots are fired. Kinda makes ya wonder.

I believe the wife activated the alarm app on her phone, probably accidently.

A case of two wrongs don't make a right. The deputy could have just sidestepped and been out of the guy's view, and thus line of fire. Cover and concealment, the house was there to supply both.
 
entropy said:
Note how the audio is blanked out until after the shots are fired. Kinda makes ya wonder.

I believe the wife activated the alarm app on her phone, probably accidently.

A case of two wrongs don't make a right. The deputy could have just sidestepped and been out of the guy's view, and thus line of fire. Cover and concealment, the house was there to supply both.
Click to expand...
Appears to me he DID sidestep the window-while shooting. The door was never jerked open like Lt. Flood said. Whoops. Don't know how this is going to come out, but I'm sure the deputy is sweating. But at least everyone is alive.
 
he will be judged by what he knew at the time not what keyboard commandos learned afterwards.
 
From a military perspective (I do have some training in door-kicking) his reaction was perfect-from an LE perspective (I wasn't one, Dad was)-not so much. He seems to have been in the "active-shooter" mindset, which did not apply in this case. I still would like to hear what was blanked out on the audio, might provide some insight into this.
 
Zero tactical reason for the officer to shine his flashlight through the window. Most of the light produced by a light that bright will be reflected back and will eliminate any sort of ID for the officer. And it scared the home owner. Possibly could have prevented this. Can't tell from the video but it would have helped the situation if the flashing lights were on. At night, if you see those lights through the window, probably not a good idea to be waving a gun around.

I had a police officer bang on my door at 7AM, which is even earlier when you work nights and get home at 6AM. I always answer the door with my weapon holstered or behind my back. PID on a police officer, I put the weapon safely away.
 
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