Thoughts opinions on a Springfield A303 sporter in 308 Norma Mag ?..

[gsbuickman]

Hiya Guy's .

So I'm thinking about picking up this nicely done Springfield A303 sporter w/ a Shillin' barrel that's chambered in 308 Norma Magnum . Granted I don't necessarily need a magnum for anything but I've been pondering picking up a an inexpensive 270 or 7mm mag just because I can.


With that being said I thought this might be a nice alternative and a nice choice to replace the 1891 Chilean 7.65 Mauser sporter that I let go recently, and I also thought it would be nice to have a 308 but I don't want just any run-of-the-mill 308 that everyone already has or had & this might be something out of the ordinary ? .

A friend told me the factory 308 Norma ammo for this is rather expensive so I jumped on AmmoSeek to check it out and they list it from $3.50 - $5 per round so he was correct, luckily this comes with factory ammo, maybe something like 150 rounds or more (waiting for a rnd count now) + brass & dies which would be nice because I can reload for it and at that price I certainly don't want to buy Factory ammo for it. I started researching it and it seems to be a really versatile round and I started to look for some load data for it starting with my 50th Edition Lyman reloading manual but it doesn't have any load data for it at all so I went to my 1987 11th edition Speer manual and Boom, I found a crapload of load data for the 308 Norma in nine different bullet weights and 4 or 5 different bullet types ranging from 100 - 200 grain .308 bullets w/ with atleast a dozen different powder types but I think the 150 grain chart looked the most interesting :



I haven't been reloading long so I wanted to ask y'all's opinion on the 308 Norma as well as some possible pros and cons and if you're wondering I could probably pick this up with only about $200 invested on my end after ,a previous deal so let me know what y'all think, thanks ...

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

For $200, I'd say heck ya!

The 03A3 (not A303, lol) receivers were made of nickel steel and are plenty strong enough for this application. Worst case, once you shoot up the Norma ammo, you can easily get a NOS or another aftermarket .30-06 barrel, rebarrel it and keep shooting or sell it again and break even.

If you've never had a Springfield, they are a joy to shoot, so I say go for it.

 

[boom boom]

The .308 Norma used to be a popular round to rechamber 03a3's and U.S. 1917 rifles in. Most used military barrels with their chambers reamed. Unlike Mausers, the coned and timed barrels of these U.S. military firearms made for a more expensive barrel swap than the venerable 98 Mauser. Don't think that the regular .30-06 boltface had to be altered either for these but I forget it that is so. Thus, a rechambering was more attractive to someone looking to save money rather than rebarrelling these. Still a darn good round that has a bit more umph than the .30-06 and Norma makes good brass. You might also finds some loads in Vihtavuori's loading manuals for these.

Decent summary of cartridge here: https://www.ballisticstudies.com/Knowledgebase/.308+Norma+Magnum.html

 

[gsbuickman]

The .308 Norma used to be a popular round to rechamber 03a3's and U.S. 1917 rifles in. Most used military barrels with their chambers reamed. Unlike Mausers, the coned and timed barrels of these U.S. military firearms made for a more expensive barrel swap than the venerable 98 Mauser. Don't think that the regular .30-06 boltface had to be altered either for these but I forget it that is so. Thus, a rechambering was more attractive to someone looking to save money rather than rebarrelling these. Still a darn good round that has a bit more umph than the .30-06 and Norma makes good brass. You might also finds some loads in Vihtavuori's loading manuals for these.

Decent summary of cartridge here: https://www.ballisticstudies.com/Knowledgebase/.308+Norma+Magnum.html

Thanks for the link, I was actually checking that website out last night . It looks like I have just about all the load data I need from my 11th Edition Speer , but out of curiosity I'll check my other reloading manuals because I have five or six that are pretty old that might turn something interesting up .

 

[pert near]

For $200, I'd say heck ya!

The 03A3 (not A303, lol) receivers were made of nickel steel and are plenty strong enough for this application. Worst case, once you shoot up the Norma ammo, you can easily get a NOS or another aftermarket .30-06 barrel, rebarrel it and keep shooting or sell it again and break even.

If you've never had a Springfield, they are a joy to shoot, so I say go for it.

+1...What are you waiting for? You can't lose on that deal!

 

[gsbuickman]

For $200, I'd say heck ya!

The 03A3 (not A303, lol) receivers were made of nickel steel and are plenty strong enough for this application. Worst case, once you shoot up the Norma ammo, you can easily get a NOS or another aftermarket .30-06 barrel, rebarrel it and keep shooting or sell it again and break even.

If you've never had a Springfield, they are a joy to shoot, so I say go for it.

Thanks . He's actually offering to trade me for my post 64 Winchester 94 lever action 30-30, I know what it's worth buthat I traded it for another rifle & if he has as much Factory ammo and Brass for this as he thinks he does it looks like it might be a really good deal . If I get it it won't be a frequent shooter and I won't be buying Factory ammo for it and shooting it, so I'm mostly looking at it from a reloading perspective and I'm interested in opinions pros and cons and some of the things I might be getting into with this cartridge that I don't know ? ...

 

[Random 8]

The .308NM is a fine round. It is easily downloaded to .30-06 or lower levels, and running full power it's got enough OOMPA for anything in North America with the possible exception of Griz. Got a neat cool factor also, and that one looks well built. I'd trade a lever 30-30 for it all day long.

 

[pert near]

gsbuickman,

If you want to get into the dark science of forming your own cases, according to Col. Nonte's book you can use .300 H&H cases. FL size, trim to 2.56" & fire form. The H&H brass should be a bit easier to find in a pinch. Nonte shows a 180gr bullet with 4831 giving 3095 fps & 150gr bullet with 4350 giving 3200 fps.

A quick check at Midway shows virgin brass for $1.68 each for .308 Norma Mag & virgin .300 H&H brass $1.16 each. Both in stock.

Enjoy your new rifle!

FWIW

 

[Vern Humphrey]

For $200, I'd say heck ya!

The 03A3 (not A303, lol) receivers were made of nickel steel and are plenty strong enough for this application. Worst case, once you shoot up the Norma ammo, you can easily get a NOS or another aftermarket .30-06 barrel, rebarrel it and keep shooting or sell it again and break even.

If you do that, you'll need a new bolt. The .308 Norma has a belted head with a diameter of 0.532", while the .30-06 has a head diameter of only 0.473". To make this conversion to .308 Norma, the gunsmith had to open up the bolt face, and it is no longer suitable for cartridges with a smaller head diameter.

 

[.308 Norma]

I haven't been reloading long so I wanted to ask y'all's opinion on the 308 Norma as well as some possible pros and cons and if you're wondering I could probably pick this up with only about $200 invested on my end so let me know, what y'all think, thanks ...

Well gsbuickman, look at my user name.
As my retirement gift to myself, 9 years ago, I ordered my 308 Norma Magnum from Montana Rifle Company, and I love it. But the truth is, it won't do anything the 300 Win Mag I used to have wouldn't do - including kick just as hard. However, my 308 Norma has a synthetic stock that was built to my specifications, and I think those things kind of help in the recoil department. I actually enjoy shooting my 308 Norma.
But yeah gsbuickman, I sure couldn't afford to feed my beloved 308 Norma if I wasn't a handloader. I am a handloader though, in fact handloading is probably my favorite pass-time. So feeding my centerfire firearms has never been a problem.
But speaking of handloading while comparing the 308 Norma to its ballistic twin, the 300 Win Mag, you might hear about the slightly longer neck of the 308 Norma, which provides a slightly better purchase on the bullets - according to some folks. It's probably true, but I personally don't think it matters. I used to load for the 300 Win Mag I had, never crimped the bullets in place, and the remaining two in the magazine after firing the first round never moved a bit. The soft lead, pointy noses of the bullets remaining in the magazine got smashed when they slammed into the front of the magazine during recoil, but they didn't get pushed deeper into the cases. So, in my opinion, the longer neck of the 308 Norma compared to the 300 Win Mag is neither a pro, nor a con.

Don't think that the regular .30-06 boltface had to be altered either for these but I forget it that is so.

I'm pretty sure that's not so boom boom. I think the size of the 308 Norma Mag's base is the same as the 338 Win Mag's base - at least they use the same size shell holder. Years ago, I had a pre- 64 Model 70, 270 Winchester converted to a 338 Win Mag, and the gunsmith did have to open up the bolt face a bit. It wasn't much of a job though, and it only took him a few minutes.

In summary, heck yeah gsbuickman! I'd buy it even though I don't think it would be all that easy to convert back to 30-06 if you don't like it. Because like I said, I think the bolt face had to be opened up a bit to convert it to a 308 Norma Magnum in the first place. But I could be wrong.

 

[.308 Norma]

If you do that, you'll need a new bolt. The .308 Norma has a belted head with a diameter of 0.532", while the .30-06 has a head diameter of only 0.473". To make this conversion to .308 Norma, the gunsmith had to open up the bolt face, and it is no longer suitable for cartridges with a smaller head diameter.

Sorry Vern, you posted while I was still typing. Thanks for confirming what I said though - even before I said it.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Thanks.

 

[Gordon]

The 03A3 is a wonderful actions, especially after it was massaged into a smooth Sporter. The .308 Norma IMHO is a superior .300 magnum except for factory availability. Sounds like you will have more than enough brass to work with and dies to reload are easily available. If the stock has no cracks , snap it up or trade that post 64 pre better finished 94

 

[boom boom]

You're correct. What I forgot is that the cheap fix people was to use the P14 bolt in the 1917 rifle which works for both the .300 Win Mag conversion in the P14 and the .308 Norma/.338 Win conversion in the 1917. You would have to open the bolt face on the 03a3 as you stated above. The only .308 Norma was in a 1917 U.S. Rifle that I saw in person had either a P14 bolt or a 1917 bolt that had the bolt face opened. Seen several P14's converted to .300 Win Mag and I believe the famous monkey squad at Century did the conversions. I don't collect sporters as such so I passed on them.

 

[gsbuickman]

Thanks guys . The guy that has the 03A3 is a recently retired professional gunsmith that had a big gunshop in Salem. They closed up the shop and packed up and boxed everything up and moved it all over here to Jerome ID . which is about an hour south of me. Anyhoo in all the confusion of packing up and getting everything moved he forgot that he sold the 308 Norma dies which isn't a deal-breaker because they're easily ordered for $20 or so and he has 200 rounds of loaded ammo for it but no brass like he thought he had. 180 rds of that ammo are loaded down professional reloads for better accuracy and less recoil.

 

[Random 8]

Any idea on the stock make? Looks like Richard Microfit "frontier sportster", maple or really light walnut. I put that stock on my wife's rifle in Am Walnut, it is very comfortable shooting. Glass bedding? I'm still going with HELL YES, even though in my case I'd probably never run heavier than 30-06 level loads through her.

 

[LoonWulf]

You best be buying that rifle.....or telling me how to

The .308 Norma is what the .300winchester should have been (and probably would been, if Norma didn't do it first)?.

 

[gsbuickman]

You best be buying that rifle.....or telling me how to

The .308 Norma is what the .300winchester should have been (and probably would been, if Norma didn't do it first)?.[/Quote :

He actually wants $550 for it but we're trying to iron out the details on a trade deal for it. As far as the cartridge goes and the way that I understand it, there were the big three cartridges like the 300 Weatherby, 338 Lapua & the 300 H&H and then Norma came out with the 308 Norma from Sweden and as rifles and shells started to become available for it and since none of the American manufacturers had a cartridge that could compete with it it really started to take off and Norma started to Corner the market here in the US until everybody at Winchester decided to pull their proverbial heads out of they're proverbial azzes & do something because they couldn't stand having a European company Corner the market here in the US. Well, they came out with the 308 Winchester followed up with the 308 win Magnum and took the u.s. market back from the Swedes by flooding the market with cheap affordable ammo they just couldn't compete with.

 

[LoonWulf]

The .308 Win predates the Norma, which is basically a necked down .338 winchester (or necked up .264). The Norma came out in 1960ish, the Winchester short magnums in the late fifties.
Id bet Winchester had the ".300" on the board as a step between the two, with little change, before the Norma hit the market.
Im sure the Norma, and the later 7mm Remingtons kicked Winchester into gear on the .300, and again because it was the MAGNUM race, they had to make it just that much magnumier than the other to similar cartridges.
Course thats mostly from my reading, and some personal supposition. I missed that era by some 25 years....

 

[eastbank]

.338 mag win cases are easy to make into .308 noma mag cases.

 

[someguy2800]

Buy it

 

[Nature Boy]

Yes, buy the dang thing

I love my 03A3. It maintains the original 2 groove .30-06 barrel and sits in a Boyds stock