Titanium Pistol??

[Fake Name]

I was wondering why any firearm manufacturers, such as Glock, doesnt make a handgun with a Titanium slide/barrel.

It would really lighten the gun up for carry but also cause much more muzzle flip when firing. I'm sure it would cost a whole lot more.

Does anyone know why Titanium might not be a good metal for guns, ie heat dissapation charachteristics, friction, etc (other than price)?

 

[unspellable]

titanium parts

Titanium is too soft for a barrel and would quickly wear out. (Note that titanium, revolvers have a steel barrel liner.) The primary requirement for the slide is that it have the correct weight to control opening speed, titanium would be too light. To get the correct weight you would have to bulk it up to the same weight as the steel slide so all you would gain is a bulkier slide.

 

[willbrink]

Several companies make Ti frames (Caspian et al) and other parts (mostly for 1911s) and there are Ti revolvers and other metals such as scandium/alum and such. Ti has places where it's application makes sense and places it does not, as already covered. I have a Ti framed caspian 1911, scandium framed SnW 1911, and a SnE scandium revolver.

 

[Sunray]

Ti is horrendously expensive and requires different machinery to work. A regular mill, etc doesn't work well.

 

[strat81]

http://www.taurususa.com/products/product-details.cfm?model=111PTI&category=Pistol
http://www.smallarmsreview.com/pdf/taurus.pdf
Ask and ye shall receive.

 

[GunTech]

Ti is horrendously expensive and requires different machinery to work. A regular mill, etc doesn't work well.

Not correct. You need to use carbide cutters and very cslow feeds. You also need to start with pickled material as titanium forms a layer fo titanium oxide in oxygen. That material is very tough. Titanium casts extremely well, and doesn't suffer the problems of aluminum in this regard. Most titanium in guns starts off as a casting with machining to bring it to final dimensions.

Titanium is expensive, and requires more expensive tooling (but not machinery). I machine titanium all the time on my 20 year old, secomd hand Jet-16 mill/drill. I use carbide cutters, slow feed rates and lots of coolant.

 

[willbrink]

>Not correct. You need to use carbide cutters and very cslow feeds. You also >need to start with pickled material as titanium forms a layer fo titanium oxide >in oxygen. That material is very tough.

Would you say then that Ti makes for good longevity as Ti frames then? In particular, as 1911 frames? As to your other comments, seems to me after talking with a few smiths that Ti being "hard to work with" is a myth. They all said more or less what you said, as longas you have the right bits/tools, it's no big deal to work with.

PS, why does THR not have a "quote" option for responding to others posts? Am I missing it?

 

[Chipperman]

PS, why does THR not have a "quote" option for responding to others posts? Am I missing it?

Yes you are missing it. In the reply window, it's the little "cartoon bubble". Click on that, then paste the quote inside the brackets.

 

[The Lone Haranguer]

A titanium frame semiauto makes some sense. There might be friction incompatibility problems between a ti frame and a steel slide, I don't know. It should be entirely feasible to cast it (Ruger does castings with ti, although golf club heads are much less complex than a gun frame), reducing or eliminating much of the final machining to shape. Most likely, the biggest problem would be cost - no one would buy it.

 

[willbrink]

"Most likely, the biggest problem would be cost - no one would buy it."

I wouldn't be too sure on that.

Here's my Ti famed 1911

 

[brickeyee]

"I machine titanium all the time on my 20 year old, secomd hand Jet-16 mill/drill. I use carbide cutters, slow feed rates and lots of coolant."

Not the making of a production environment.
In a manufacturing setting it is very hard to work with good yield and speed.

 

[willbrink]

"Not the making of a production environment.
In a manufacturing setting it is very hard to work with good yield and speed."

CNC machines set up for it don't work? Ti frames are not cheap, which I assume is due to material costs and costs/issues of working with Ti, but companies like caspian are doing it in a manufacturing setting with (I assume) plenty of hands on care, thus the cost of having gun frames of Ti. SnW have some impressive CnC etc for their alum/scandium frames and revolvers, though I dont know what it's like to work with compared to Ti.

 

[brickeyee]

"Ti frames are not cheap, which I assume is due to material costs and costs/issues of working with Ti"

Think you answered your own question.
It is slower and harder to work so the cost of parts fabricated is higher.

All I was pointing out is that one person on a lath is not 'production'.

The aerospace industry has been using Ti as needed for many years in a variety of applications, but it is still not a really common material for general aircraft use.
The Soviets have enough of the stuff to make entire submarines hulls from it, while we still use steel.

 

[willbrink]

"Think you answered your own question."

Hmm, well actually my only real question was "Would you say then that Ti makes for good longevity as Ti frames then? In particular, as 1911 frames?"

The rest was really an off shoot of comments made by others. BTW, what adds most to the cost of Ti? Actual material cost of Ti or the issues of working with it? My impression was the former over the latter.