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Trump 'Seriously' Looking at Banning Suppressors

Discussion in 'Activism' started by SKILCZ, Jun 6, 2019.

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  1. SKILCZ

    SKILCZ Member

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  2. GEM

    GEM Moderator Staff Member

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    Just a hint, so as to avoid a close. Please discuss the issue of such a ban. A general Trump True Believer, Trump Hater, He's not Hillary, SCOTUS is more important that Trump's ban, ARE YOU A DAMN SOCIALIST' etc. rant fest will close this like the other thread.
     
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  3. P5 Guy

    P5 Guy Member

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    Setting up a trust to buy a silencer will run about eight/nine months waiting for word from the BATFE on when you are given permission to have a deadly silenced firearm. Where is the eye-roll emoji.
     
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  4. AlexanderA
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    AlexanderA Member

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    The question is whether the gun world -- in particular, the NRA -- should speak up strongly against a potential suppressor ban now, or stay silent (thereby not drawing attention to the issue) hoping that it fades away.

    There are arguments to be made for either course of action, although the issue fading away quickly is unlikely because (a) the Virginia governor is calling a special session of the legislature to consider it, and (b) Trump will constantly be reminded of his initial statements by the media.

    The worst thing that could happen would be the NRA issuing some wishy-washy statement saying that suppressors should be "looked at" or "reexamined." That would set the stage for a replay of the bump stock ban, only this time involving suppressors.
     
  5. HPCadm17

    HPCadm17 Member

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    If they would only acknowledge the actual witness accounts, they would understand that silencers offer NO TACTICAL ADVANTAGE, except to be less deafening to the shooter and those in close proximity to the weapon being fired, in the absence of hearing protection. The gun is still dang loud enough to be heard through walls, windows, closed doors, etc. Witness accounts confirm this. But Lefties will still push the "silence" lie in order to ban yet another accessory because, you know, louder bullets are less deadly.
     
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  6. AlexanderA
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    AlexanderA Member

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    1.Setting up a trust is not necessary in order to buy a silencer. You can do so as an individual, if state law allows. (In fact, the ATF approval process might go faster for an individual, since fewer "responsible persons" would need to be cleared.)
    2. Before buying a silencer, be sure you really want one. If possible, try shooting a suppressed gun first. You might be surprised to learn that suppressors don't "silence" in the Hollywood sense. It might be hard to justify going through a complicated and time-consuming procedure for something this marginal. Especially if there's a chance it might be banned entirely at some point down the road.
     
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  7. bob97

    bob97 Member

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    IMO, silencers on hunting rifles are much more useful than on pistols due to shape and size of the complete package. Rimfire supressors are absolutely awesome on either.
     
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  8. Mowgli Terry

    Mowgli Terry Member

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    The anti-gun people really buy into the "silencer" nomenclature.
     
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  9. crestoncowboy

    crestoncowboy Member

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    As well as his original statements a few years ago in support of HPA.
     
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  10. AlexanderA
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    AlexanderA Member

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    If hunting is a "sport," it might be questioned whether the use of suppressors on hunting rifles is "sporting." I'll leave it to the experts on hunting ethics to answer that question.

    My only personal experience with a suppressor was owning one attached to a MAC-11 SMG. I wasn't overly impressed by either the gun or the suppressor. It certainly wasn't "silent."
     
  11. Sistema1927

    Sistema1927 Member

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    Sporting? You do know, I hope, that most all deer rifle caliber rounds are supersonic and the animal being hunted will be hit before it hears the report from the rifle.
     
  12. AlexanderA
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    AlexanderA Member

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    Yes, but what about misses, and the sound allowing the herd to escape? I'm not a hunter, and I don't know for sure, but I'm throwing this out as a consideration. It seems on its face that the use of suppressors in hunting is unethical, like spotlighting or hunting over bait. If this was subsistence hunting, and one's livelihood depended on it, it would be different.
     
  13. SharpDog

    SharpDog Member

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    misses ? what are those ? :evil:

    actually I don't have a suppressor because of the hassle and the cost. ear protection is much cheaper, less hassle and less maintenance.

    However, I very much support the right to own and use a suppressor for everyone.

    as far as my personal opinion as to whether it's ethical, well, it's another step on a slippery slope from spear to bow to BP to modern rifle with iron sights to scopes to wind and range doping ... You picks your position on that spectrum and have fun.

    I myself have switched to bow hunting (with a thoroughly modern bow although I enjoy traditional bows as well).
     
  14. P5 Guy

    P5 Guy Member

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    I guess The Donald has bought into the "Loud pipes save lives"
     
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  15. ATLDave

    ATLDave Member

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    The original concern with suppressor use in hunting was around market hunting - professional hunters collecting vast amount of game very efficiently for sale to meat (or other animal product) markets. This is the kind of hunting that has historically driven species to extinction... it has the potential to be ecologically devastating.

    Here's a pile of buffalo skulls from 1870, all the product of market hunters:

    Bison+skulls+pile+to+be+used+for+fertilizer+,+1870.jpg

    Here's an engraving of a punt gun in use - a gun so large that it was fixed to a mount in a small boat (a punt), and used to fire enough shot to kill an entire flock of waterfowl at one blast.

    3MWJkLTRiMmQtYmE5OS05ODAwYWQwZGQwZTIuanBnIn1dXSwiYXVkIjpbInVybjpzZXJ2aWNlOmZpbGUuZG93bmxvYWQiXX0.jpg

    Obviously, hunting on that kind of quasi-industrial scale can strip the landscape of wildlife very fast. The passenger pigeon was hunted to extinction because market hunters were literally filling railroad cars with their carcasses. In 1934, all of this was still within very recent and living memory. Regulating the use of suppressors in hunting makes sense if that's the kind of hunting one is imagining or worried about.

    We don't have anything comparable to that now outside of unrestricted hunting for nuisance/invasive creatures (and the market for their products is generally too soft/small to support true market hunting) in North America. We have lots of federal and state restrictions on hunting itself. Whatever role suppressor restrictions once needed to play in wildlife preservation, it's not clear to me that they are important at all today.
     
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  16. Officers'Wife

    Officers'Wife Member

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    Keep in mind that first and foremost Trump is playing politics. Which is sometimes defined as giving the appearance of doing one thing while actually doing the complete opposite. For the moment he's trying to put out the wildfire caused by the recent shooting while still giving himself a solid basis for the 2020 election.

    Second- quite frankly a lot of his comment to the mainstream remind me of when my children where small... In this case- I'm busy right now but give me a while and I'll think about letting you have ice cream.

    Item last- The US has been allowing these usurpations of the 2nd since the 20's. they are not going to be reversed in a short time. I don't know about the rest you but I voted for the man because I believed he would be a better choice for the country in the long run than Hillary. Right, wrong or indifferent it's necessary to allow him to lead now.
     
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  17. Elkins45

    Elkins45 Member

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    Restricting silencers had little to do with fears of poaching. The original drafts of the NFA added handguns to the list. Presidential advisors figured that was too much of a reach and so silencers were substituted late in the process. Since restricting machine guns was the main goal FDR didn’t push for adding handguns back in. I guess he figured he could always take those later after he had packed the SCOTUS.
     
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  18. Charlie Horse

    Charlie Horse Member

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    I had laugh when I read this because that's EXACTLY what occurred to me. There are far too many people that hear what a politician says and somehow believes this is what they really think or mean. I've started calling this the "Turn Into the Torpedo Effect" after the scene from the Hunt for Red October. If you remember, Sean Connery had the sub turn into the torp, while the American skipper was saying it was crazy. The torp was smashed to bits on the hull, because it didn't have sufficient distance in the water to arm itself. This is played out often in politics. You say that you are considering or open to something that you know CANNOT pass one or both houses, and when they scream at you again, you can say you tried. Not an ideal situation, but can be used to diffuse short term situations until the public forgets and starts worrying about American Idol, Games of Thrones, or the Kardashians again.

    I've wondered if this is what George W. was doing when he talked about reupping the AWB. He knew there was no appetite for it in the Republican caucus, but the usual suspects would be going on and on about it. All he would have had to do is say, "Sure, pass it and send it to me," knowing full well it would never happen, and he takes that slab of red meat off of the table. Now, I don't know that's what he was thinking, but I do wonder because it fits the profile.
     
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  19. LiveLife

    LiveLife Member

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    Well then Trump is playing politics with hunters and fishermen? And I was told actions speak louder than words.

    https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...hing-in-protected-us-wildlife-refuges.852393/
    • Trump administration proposed major expansion of opening up federally protected land for hunting and fishing in the nation's wildlife refuges
    • Plan affects 1.4 million acres on federal public lands including 74 national wildlife refuges
    • Proposal would allow hunting and fishing for the first time at 15 national fish hatcheries.
    • Proposed expansion at sites in 46 states would allow hunting in 382 wildlife refuges while fishing would be allowed at 316 locations.
    • The plan is to finalize the proposal by September after public comment.
     
  20. Rule3

    Rule3 Member

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    Read my post #141 under Bump Stocks
    https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/bump-stocks-not-being-turned-
    in.850394/page-6

    "That legislation by fiat out of fear is the true threat." Much the same as the legislation crammed down our throats in less than 30 days after the Parkland shooting.

    Imagine if a shooter had a scoped rifle with a suppressor? Heck even a bolt action. How much carnage could be inflicted shooting into a concert crowd before anyone knew what was going on? Would optics then be banned, would suppressors be banned?? The list goes on.


    "every time there is a mass shooting they want to take away the guns from people that did not do it"
     
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  21. LiveLife

    LiveLife Member

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    Instead of fear mongering, let's celebrate any pro-gun/2A wins and keep encouraging/pressuring our law makers so they will keep writing/passing pro-gun/2A bills into laws.

    WE ARE ON THE SAME SIDE.

    Use that fervor to write our law makers to defeat/undo anti-gun/2A crowd workings, starting with suppressors.

    Peace.
     
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  22. GEM

    GEM Moderator Staff Member

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    Let's be realistic and not fall in into a Pollyanna - ish love of Trump. There are some gun positive changes in states firmly in the gun side of the debate. However, purple states are passing significant bans in areas that used to be solidly progun. Celebrating is frankly silly.
     
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  23. LiveLife

    LiveLife Member

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    Living in CA, any pro-gun/2A law passage calls for a celebration. Can't help it. Just ask 9mmepiphany. :D

    I did post this.
     
  24. Charlie Horse

    Charlie Horse Member

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    That's the real key. There are very few politicians that are pro or con anything. They are however VERY much in favor of staying in office. Joe Biden has given us an example of this phenomenon this very week. Pressure needs to be applied constantly and in person. As I said in another thread recently, this is why we need to be fixtures in the Executive Committee Meetings of both parties in every county in the US. The more they know that we're actively engaged, bot just voting once in a while, the shorter the leach that they're on.
     
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2019
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  25. IdaD

    IdaD Member

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    In my experience the animals don't react to the sound immediately. They obviously look towards the shot because of the noise but they take a bit to process the threat before leaving, and a lot of times if you're quite distant they'll run a few steps and stop and look back again. A suppressed rifle would be quieter than unsuppressed but I don't think you'd get a wildly different reaction from game, because you'll still be making a loud noise relative to their ability to hear. I don't own any silencers at all but the guns I'd be most interested in having suppressed would be my hunting rifles because I don't wear hearing protection while I hunt big game (I know, an unpopular thing to admit online). I don't have a ton of interest in suppressing my handguns because if I'm shooting one of them without hearing protection that's probably the least of my concerns.
     
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