USFA 45 Colt groove diameter

[Maj Dad]

I bought a Doug Turnbull USFA SAA 45 Colt & am wondering if anyone knows for sure what the groove diameter is (and cylinder throat, too, as long as I'm asking ). Lacking any suggestion it was 454, I ordered some brass & 452 250 gr RNFPs from Mo Bullets, then started ruminating... I would think a high-end pistol like this would be matched up, but I'll know for sure tomorrow when I pick it up.

I just looked at my Lyman 45 Colt dies (only 25 yrs old - my Lyman 38s are more like 50!) & found that the chrome plating is peeling in a few spots inside the mouth , so I definitely will be ordering a new set (maybe Hornady TiN like all my others, although the Lee carbide sizer got a favorable review in the new Handloader Magazine). I have 2 expander stems for the Lyman, one marked "45P" on the top, the other "45AP" - anyone know about that offhand? Seems like I had problems crushing brass and tried another unit, but I sold the Ruger BH convertible 7 1/2" "200th Year" to a friend & haven't loaded 45 Colt in years. He still snickers when I try to buy it back :banghead:

 

[Slamfire]

When I bought this Rodeo in 2002 I called the factory and asked about it. This is an early, Uberti framed Rodeo. Later production is all American parts.

They told me the barrels were 0.451” + - 0.001. I think my cylinder mouths were 0.453”, but that they were going to change that to 0.452”

I buy commercial cast bullets of .452” and .454” diameter. I shoot both through my Rodeo and my S&W M25-7 and M625-9 45 LC's and the difference on target or over the chronograph is insignificant.

Just load and shoot.

5 1/2" USFA Rodeo

250 LRN (.452") 8.5 grs Unique thrown, R-P cases, CCI300 primers
12-May-02 T = 80°F

Ave Vel = 855
Std Dev = 16
ES = 59.91
High = 885.4
Low = 825.5
Number Shots 12

255 LSWC (.454") 8.5 grs Unique thrown, R-P cases, WLP primers
12-May-02 T = 84°F

Ave Vel = 844
Std Dev = 33
ES = 117.8
High = 907.6
Low = 789.8
Number Shots 12

 

[Maj Dad]

Well, got it & the gun is beautiful, to say the least. Signs of custom fitting abound, the trigger is superb and the cylinder throats are all 452, so I feel pretty sure the groove diameter matches (haven't miked it yet). I'm taking it out this weekend to see if it's just another pretty face... Also got the RCBS carbide die set I settled on, 2 days after ordering from Midway! Incredible customer service

I read on one of the reloading forums (or website, this week) that the USFA was considered a strong action - (I would think) not as strong as the Ruger, but stronger than modern Colts. Any thoughts on that? I have NO plans on magnum-izing this pistol, but if it is indeed strong, then I won't feel overly cautious approaching upper standard 45 colt limits...

 

[CraigC]

USFA builds them right, feed it .452's without fear. Meanwhile, Colt still can't seem to get theirs right.

As far as strength, you will hear lots of grumbling about standard pressure loads but according to Brian Pearce AND USFA, their guns are safe for .44Mag pressures. Pearce has had a .44Spl rechambered and it works well. Although I don't know if there will ever be an outlet for such a piece. I would stick to 21-23,000psi loads for your .45, as suggested by Pearce, Taffin, Scovill, etc..

 

[Slamfire]

I read on one of the reloading forums (or website, this week) that the USFA was considered a strong action - (I would think) not as strong as the Ruger, but stronger than modern Colts. Any thoughts on that? I have NO plans on magnum-izing this pistol, but if it is indeed strong, then I won't feel overly cautious approaching upper standard 45 colt limits...

All modern pistols are made from higher quality steels than vintage and modern alloys are stronger than the plain carbon steels used in vintage pistols.

I know USFA uses 4140 in all the structural parts, because they told me. That does not mean that a Colt SAA, Colt SAA copy or replica is all that strong.

I am staying with a 250 LRN at 850 to 900 fps as I do not want to batter my pistol.

If you want to push things get a Ruger Blackhawk in 45 LC. I do not recommend pushing a SAA or replica.

Beautiful pistol, the case hardening colors are worth killing for!

I don't know if there is a clear polymer coating on the case hardening, but be nice to it. Case is a delicate surface. I would keep it oiled (unless there is a coating) and not rub on it.

 

[CraigC]

Good Lord, they're not made of glass! It's not that delicate and there is a clear lacquer coat on it. It should stand up well to a lifetime of use, given reasonable care. Real case colors wear not unlike bluing.

 

[Maj Dad]

USFA SAA Range Report

Finally got out to the range, and it shoots like the thoroughbred it is. Just shot 40 rds, 250 gr MB RNFP (12 BH Cowboy bullet), 10 w/9.0 gr Unique, 30 w/8.5 gr. Both were accurate (~1" @ 15 yds off the bench), and while recoil was not severe at all, I discovered why some like the squared-off trigger guard of the SBH, and why my SBH 44 mag hasn't bothered me. I have one finger joint with arthritis, and it's the proximal IP joint, 3d finger of my right hand I guess I'll have to use a shooting glove that has some bit of padding or just thick leather to ease the slap. I can minimize by a firm grip, but over a session I start getting a little shaky doing that. Worst case scenario is a 2-handed hold

Love it, to me, worth what I paid (kind of a bucket-list thing), and it will be treated like a thoroughbred, too. Now for a holster worthy to hold it (and not scratch it!!) - any suggestions?

 

[rcmodel]

El Paso Saddlery Tom Threepersons with pigskin lining.

My SAA Colt rides in one and is showing no traces of holster wear.

http://www.epsaddlery.com/pc-65-12-1920-tom-threepersons-2-to-7-12-barrels.aspx

rc

 

[ArchAngelCD]

IMO USFA makes a better SAA revolver than Colt does. If I were to spend the money on only one it would be a USFA revolver over the Colt...

 

[Maj Dad]

I like that holster, rc. I almost bought one for a M19 in the late '70s; probably should have. I like the floral carving, too...

When I decided to buy this USFA version, I considered a Colt, but everything I have read indicates that the USFA is a better pistol. I don't have a current (Custom Shop) Colt to compare, but I can tell you that this is a well made, quality handgun. I am very happy with it.

Thanks to all for your input & comments - as always, they are appreciated.
Cheers,
George J.

 

[CraigC]

The Threepersons is one of my favorites!


Though I also love a good Slim Jim or Mexican loop, like these from C.O.W.S. All three holsters feature my favorite lining, soft pigskin.

 

[Maj Dad]

CraigC,
I thought I had replied but apparently I deleted it the other night - those are really nice looking rigs, and that is what I want for mine. And you're right on with the Mexican loop & slim jim - now I have to decide. On the first one. The others will have to wait just a bit...
Cheers,
George J.

 

[CraigC]

On the first one. The others will have to wait just a bit...

Yep! Then you might as well add El Paso's Austin holster to the list as well.

I also love El Paso's 1849 Californian but don't have a picture of it. Gonna try my hand at making a Slim Jim for my Dragoon here shortly.

 

[rcmodel]

Threepersons rig!!!

Elmer Keith, Skeeter Skelton, Sheriff Jim Wilson, and Brian Peirce knew what they were writing about when it comes to packing a SAA the best way!

I have tried most of them over the years, and it's always back to a Threepersons for me.

rc

 

[Maj Dad]

I think I'm going with the Threepersons rig first, with a river belt, maybe both floral carved. Ya gotta start somewhere...

 

[rcmodel]

Excellent!!

You gonna look right well heeled at the next Texas Style BBQ they have in Carolina!!

rc

 

[CraigC]

Well-heeled indeed!

 

[Maj Dad]

I haven't had good brisket since I left Del Rio in Dec '98 - may have to do it myself, come to think of it. Got a big smoker that I haven't fired up in a couple of months... Y'all have a standing invite