model of 1905
member
For home defense...
All 2.75 inch
#4 buckshot, 00 buckshot. 1 oz slug. Repeat.
Think it will work for me.
All 2.75 inch
#4 buckshot, 00 buckshot. 1 oz slug. Repeat.
Think it will work for me.
Well here is how I load My Mossberg 930 SPX
- Thread starter model of 1905
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Badger Arms
Member
Why the confusion? The slug has no place there. Way too much penetration and if you actually NEED to use a slug (as in they are beyond buckshot range) then you should be seriously considering how much of a threat they are. You'll also have the time to do a "select slug" drill like the mall-ninjas do when they go to Blackwater or Gunsite... really unbelievable that you'd have to do it in a home defense situation.
Me, you're going to get #3 buck in 20-pellet increments or 00 buck in 12-pellet increments depending on where in the house you corner me. That way, I never have to guess.
Me, you're going to get #3 buck in 20-pellet increments or 00 buck in 12-pellet increments depending on where in the house you corner me. That way, I never have to guess.
Well I think the answer lies in where you live and what type dwelling you live in.
For example; I live in the country with the closet neighbor about 1/2 mile away. That coupled with the plaster and lathe construction of my old house puts together a possible use for a HD slug . As in, I may want the wall penetration capability of the slug.
The difference between #4 & 00 buck on the other hand is less apparent to me as a possible need or desire. On the other hand - I don't see it as a problem .
For example; I live in the country with the closet neighbor about 1/2 mile away. That coupled with the plaster and lathe construction of my old house puts together a possible use for a HD slug . As in, I may want the wall penetration capability of the slug.
The difference between #4 & 00 buck on the other hand is less apparent to me as a possible need or desire. On the other hand - I don't see it as a problem .
Fred Fuller
Moderator Emeritus
Experience has shown that very very few if any people can keep up with how many rounds they've fired in a gunfight. As Robbie Burrrrrrns put it, "The best laid plans o' mice and men gang aft aglee." Or as an ancient military maxim says, "No plan of battle survives first contact with the enemy intact."
In short, this plan may work for you now, in the comfort of your computer chair, but when the chips are down how will it do? I'd suggest without too much fear of contradiction by ultimate reality that this plan will fail if it ever has to be put to use. Whatever you think will happen, won't. When you need to shoot through the sofa to nail the bad guy who has taken cover behind it and is busy gansta'ing rounds over the top, you'll have a birdshot round in the chamber. And so on.
In short- "candy cane" loading is a plan that's almost certainly doomed to fail.
So what do you do instead? World class fighting shotgun trainer Louis Awerbuck ( http://www.yfainc.com/ ) carries a coach gun loaded with slugs in his travels to teach classes all over the US. At home he has a Browning semiauto, also stoked with slugs only. He says he isn't smart enough to keep up with more than one kind of ammunition.
i'm obviously not as smart as Louis, because I try to keep up with two kinds of shotgun ammo. Here we keep tight-patterning 00 buck in the magazines of the 'house guns' and have the Sidesaddles loaded with slugs. Shotguns are the go-to long guns here and may have to be used outside as well as inside. Ranges may stretch out longer than buckshot can handle, or more penetration may be needed than buckshot can manage. Brenneke slugs are the answer there.
Training teaches you what you need to know- and gives you some exposure to pressure, although looking like a fumbling idiot in front of twenty other shooters isn't quite as much pressure as getting shot at. Practice makes sure you 'groove' the skills you learned in training into muscle memory so they can be performed without thinking about them.
Fortunately the odds are that circumstances won't ever arise that will prove either of us wrong...
lpl
In short, this plan may work for you now, in the comfort of your computer chair, but when the chips are down how will it do? I'd suggest without too much fear of contradiction by ultimate reality that this plan will fail if it ever has to be put to use. Whatever you think will happen, won't. When you need to shoot through the sofa to nail the bad guy who has taken cover behind it and is busy gansta'ing rounds over the top, you'll have a birdshot round in the chamber. And so on.
In short- "candy cane" loading is a plan that's almost certainly doomed to fail.
So what do you do instead? World class fighting shotgun trainer Louis Awerbuck ( http://www.yfainc.com/ ) carries a coach gun loaded with slugs in his travels to teach classes all over the US. At home he has a Browning semiauto, also stoked with slugs only. He says he isn't smart enough to keep up with more than one kind of ammunition.
i'm obviously not as smart as Louis, because I try to keep up with two kinds of shotgun ammo. Here we keep tight-patterning 00 buck in the magazines of the 'house guns' and have the Sidesaddles loaded with slugs. Shotguns are the go-to long guns here and may have to be used outside as well as inside. Ranges may stretch out longer than buckshot can handle, or more penetration may be needed than buckshot can manage. Brenneke slugs are the answer there.
Training teaches you what you need to know- and gives you some exposure to pressure, although looking like a fumbling idiot in front of twenty other shooters isn't quite as much pressure as getting shot at. Practice makes sure you 'groove' the skills you learned in training into muscle memory so they can be performed without thinking about them.
Fortunately the odds are that circumstances won't ever arise that will prove either of us wrong...
lpl
4thPointOfContact
Member
- Joined
- Oct 13, 2007
- Messages
- 852
Not a great fan of the barber pole / candystripe loading here either. The middle of a self defense situation is no time to think "Did I fire five shots or only four, what's next up the pipe and do I feel lucky?"
My personal selection is Federal 132-00 reduced recoil buckshot, I can cover the pattern at 25 yards with the diameter of a dollar bill. If I can find the Federal buckshot that stays within the shotcup until it meets the resistance of hitting a target then I'll be golden
My personal selection is Federal 132-00 reduced recoil buckshot, I can cover the pattern at 25 yards with the diameter of a dollar bill. If I can find the Federal buckshot that stays within the shotcup until it meets the resistance of hitting a target then I'll be golden
jlv08
Member
Keep in mind that you will have to articulate to a judge and jury that what you used was for defensive purposes.
No offence but it sounds as though you are readying for Godzilla, Mothra, the Wolfman, Count Dracula,etc.
Slugs would be my last choice and would be employed only in the deer woods or bear country, not in my household due to the fact that I could harm someone two houses over due to penetration issues.
I've had the unpleasant fortune to talk to some police officers that have seen the results of errant shootings and their accounts are very sobering.
Let's be careful out there.
No offence but it sounds as though you are readying for Godzilla, Mothra, the Wolfman, Count Dracula,etc.
Slugs would be my last choice and would be employed only in the deer woods or bear country, not in my household due to the fact that I could harm someone two houses over due to penetration issues.
I've had the unpleasant fortune to talk to some police officers that have seen the results of errant shootings and their accounts are very sobering.
Let's be careful out there.
earlthegoat2
Member
This one is subject to some of the best armchair experts in the business. Play on.
JohnBT
Member
"Keep in mind that you will have to articulate to a judge and jury that what you used was for defensive purposes."
Have to? You can't be forced to testify.
You don't even have to make a statement to the police. That's what lawyers are for.
John
Have to? You can't be forced to testify.
You don't even have to make a statement to the police. That's what lawyers are for.
John
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