What causes what?

[Corner Pocket]

Being a relative newcomer to the world of reloading, there is so much to this stuff that continues to fascinate me. All the possible combination of powders, primers, bullets, brass, crimping, and on and on... I've fashioned a few loads that my guns like and that I tend to stay with as I load up a bunch to feed them.

I just got back from the range a moment ago. I shot 100 rounds (.45ACP) that I'd just loaded this morning, and was very pleased with them. These were 200 gr LRNFP, powered by 8.4 gr HS-6. These really shoot well for me. I also shot some "test batches" that I'd loaded as far back as March 5th. Twenty rounds of this... ten rounds of that... fifteen rounds of this... all told, about 125 rounds of "odds and ends."

The last group that I shot were some 200 gr Hornady JHP bullets, powered by 5.8 gr Bullseye. These rounds had significantly more kick than the other loads that I took out there with me this morning. Since these last bullets were also 200 gr, it surprised me that they had more recoil than the others. Is it the larger charge weight of the Bullseye powder that makes such a difference in perceived recoil? Since I'm still a beginner who is hungry to learn, I'd appreciate your thoughts on this. Thanks!

Corner Pocket
'stoked, pumped, and jacked up in Texas!'

 

[ReloaderFred]

Bullseye is a much faster burning powder than HS-6, so the impulse is different, which translates to more felt recoil. You're probably getting a little higher velocity out of the bullseye load, too, but I didn't cross reference to make sure.

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[rcmodel]

Bullseye is a very fast powder, best used in light to mid-range loads.
It is not even a recommended power for the 200 XTP in either the Hornady #4, or #6 manuals.

They do show it for the 185 XTP however.

Speer shows 5.8 grains Bullseye as a Maximum load @ 934 FPS., so your 5.7 load is cooking!

Your 8.4 grains of HS-6 is shown as less then a starting load at about 800 FPS or less.

In general, if you are trying for high velocity in .45 ACP, it is best to use something like Unique or HS-6 rather then Bullseye.

Think of it as smacking a bowling ball with your fist, (Bullseye) as opposed to shoving it with the palm of your hand. (HS-6)

rcmodel

 

[mkl]

Besides the impluse from the faster burning Bullseye, there was another factor.

For 200 grain jacketed bullets, your load of HS-6 was 1/10 grain below the minimum, while your Bullseye load was at the very maximum per my Speer #12 loading manual. Speer does not list HS-6 for a 200 grain lead bullet.

 

[Corner Pocket]

Many thanks for each of these thoughtful responses. This compels me to take another look at my load data, and to see how I arrived at the loads that I'm using...

CP

 

[MCMXI]

I saw an episode of Guns and Ammo a couple of months ago where they loaded a 300 Win Mag (If I remember correctly) case with 70+ grains of Bullseye powder to see what would happen ... one of their torture tests!! When they pulled the trigger, the receiver turned into a grenade with pieces flying all over the place but nothing back at the shooter. My first thought was "isn't natural selection supposed to take care of idiots that do that sort of thing?". It was pretty clear that the idiot would walk away but there would be a lot of dead or injured people either side of him at the range.

 

[ambidextrous1]

Don't sweat the small stuff, Corner Pocket.

If shooting the stuff you load puts a smile on your face: You're where you ought to be.

Any improvements you make from here on will be relatively small - but worth looking into.

Try to resist the temptation to buy 15 different brands of powder "to see how they shoot"; you'll likely conclude that they're "about like what I've been using".

After 15 years of reloading, I have only two pistol powders in my shop - soon to be one, when I finish the cannister of Unique.

 

[Noxx]

Try to resist the temptation to buy 15 different brands of powder "to see how they shoot"; you'll likely conclude that they're "about like what I've been using"

Roger that. After messing about with all manner of powders I've got about 20lbs of Titegroup that I use in all my pistol loads. and a half can of Unique that's probably going to live a long and lonely life on the shelf, or get spread in the garden.

 

[Corner Pocket]

Through a very fortunate set of circumstances, I bought a lot of powder and other reloading supplies from someone I used to work with for an embarrassing low price. He was anxious to get rid of it, was ostensibly strapped for cash, etc. A part of the deal included a large amount of HS-6. So naturally, I wanted to be able to use HS-6 in my calibers of .38 Spec, .357 Mag. and .45 ACP.

I've discovered that there is sometimes a wide diversity as to minimums and maximums when it comes to sources consulted. For the 200 gr Hornady JHP that I loaded up with 5.8 gr of Bullseye, I found for Bullseye:

Speer #13: 5.2 gr start, 5.8 gr max
Modern Reloading (2nd Edition): 5.7 start, 6.0 max
Alliant (maker of Bullseye) loading data: 6.0 max

I cautiously incremented from 5.2 gr up to the 5.8 gr weight, and find that these 5.8 gr work well for me in my gun.

On those lead RNFP that I use 8.4 gr of HS-6 in, I found:
Modern Reloading (2nd Edition): 8.2 start, 8.4 max
Hodgdon load data: 8.2 start, 8.4 gr max

I also have a bunch of Unique that I'll be working with as I go. This is some great fun! Thanks again for your responses.

And hey there, ambidextrous1. What is that one powder that you have found to be "it" in your loading? Inquiring minds want to know.

CP

 

[MCMXI]

Corner Pocket,
My "Modern Reloading - Second Edition" by Richard Lee has the following load data:

200gr lead, HS-6: 8.2 (860fps) to 8.4 (907fps) - 16,300 cup

200gr jacketed, Bullseye: 5.7 (915fps) to 6.0 (960fps) - 19,400 psi



On Edit: Sorry ... you beat me to it!

 

[Canuck-IL]

Also, pay attention to OAL as you swap around the powder loads ...JHPs are usually seated deeper than bullets w a longer bearing surface - reduced case volume = higher pressure.
/Bryan

 

[rcmodel]

Neither Lee's Modern Reloading, or Alliant, are talking about Hornady XTP bullets with a longer bearing surface, or Gold Dot bullets with plated jackets, or any other specific bullets.
Just generic JHP cup & core bullets of several years ago.

If you want Hornady XTP reloading data, that's were I would go to get it.

But, that's just me.

rcmodel

 

[SSN Vet]

"heavy" loads of fast powder = "snappy recoil"