why are dillon rifle dies 5x lee?

[evtSmtx]

Are the dillon dies _that_ much better? If so I'd appreciate if anybody can explain why in terms a non-mechanical engineer can grasp? Is the difference likely to matter to somebody who loads maybe 1000 30-06 rounds a year?

 

[fguffey]

http://www.dillonprecision.com/#/co...on_Rifle_Dies__Individual_and_Three_Die_Sets_



http://ads.midwayusa.com/find?userSearchQuery=30/06+rifle+dies+Lee

I will assume the 5X means Dillon is selling their dies for 5 times the amount Midway is selling Lee dies.

F. Guffey

 

[anothernewb]

Label mostly. There are some machining differences, and I would bet a bench rest shooter could tell the difference, but at my level - I can't tell the difference

 

[LiveLife]

As long as the finished dimensions of the cartridges are consistent, regardless what brand dies you used, I don't think the rifle will be able to tell the difference, especially for autoloading rifle.

If you are looking for accuracy with a bolt rifle, I think focus on more consistent reloading practice and component selection will net greater accuracy than brand of dies.

 

[Rule3]

Dillon has a lot of advertising and pretty Models to pay for.

They make top of the line products and you pay for that and their lifetime warranty on everything.

They also have Govt contracts for some awesome Mini Guns!!

That said, I have about 12 sets of LEE dies.

 

[ReloaderFred]

You're probably looking at the carbide sizing die prices. There is no advantage to buying a carbide sizing die for a rifle caliber, unless you're a commercial reloader producing many thousands of rounds per month. They still have to be lubricated.

Dillon doesn't make it's own dies. They're made by jobbers to Dillon's specifications (most of the time). I've got a Dillon die marked "Dillion", and when I questioned a Dillon rep at the SHOT Show about it, he remarked they get them from the jobbers with all kinds of mistakes.

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[LiveLife]

Just FYI,

Most of Lee Precision products are made in the USA by tax paying workers and I believe Lee product sales exceed many other brands sales combined. I think this is one of many reasons why Lee Precision is able to sell their products at lower prices.

Like Ruger outselling all the domestic firearms exceeding the sales of all the other brand firearms brand combined. Yes, it is true for last several years.

Food for thought.

 

[rbernie]

I use Lee dies, and have for the last 30+ years. I like them and find them to be very nice products. Having said that, I now use Dillon carbide sizer dies whenever they are available due to the fact that they resize with less force needed than any other dies that I've tried.

 

[taliv]

dillon dies are reasonable quality, but often have some QC issues. they're not used by benchresters, etc. they do have some minor tweaks relevant to use in a progressive press vs a single stage. carbide is a nice feature, even if it's not "necessary".

as far as the price, my guess is that dillon uses a lot better steel than lee, but mostly you're paying for their customer service.

i use dillon dies in my three dillon 1050s. i use forster or redding dies in single stage press because they have features for loading precision ammo, like bushing neck sizing, micrometer tops, sleeves to align the bullet before you start seating it, etc.

 

[Rule3]

Just FYI,

Most of Lee Precision products are made in the USA by tax paying workers and I believe Lee product sales exceed many other brands sales combined. I think this is one of many reasons why Lee Precision is able to sell their products at lower prices.

Like Ruger outselling all the domestic firearms exceeding the sales of all the other brand firearms brand combined. Yes, it is true for last several years.

Food for thought.

Well stated and I don't think Richard Lee is flying around in Jets and Helicopters.

 

[Chisos]

While I'm partial to Redding, a friend of mine had a commercial loading business and two of his 25 thousand dollar Camdex machines came with Lee dies. He said the dies were never a problem.

 

[jmorris]

The only ones that cost that much more than the Lee are the carbide rifle dies, they are more expensive to produce and the number sold is smaller, thus the price. I like the ones I have but do not have them for every rifle caliber I have by a long shot (they only make them for a few calibers).

Dillon rifle dies (carbide and regular) have the best method of stuck case remover there is by far, #2 would be Lee dies though. The others leave a lot to be desired.

Dillon pistol dies are much closer in price to others, can be taken apart quickly on the press for cleaning, don't loose any adjustments and have a spring on the decaping pin to help with primer "pull back" when sizing/depriming.

Both Dillon rifle and pistol dies have decapping pins that you can change out quickly if you have problems and come with several spares.

Despite the above I own more Lee die sets than the Dillon, RCBS, Hornady, Redding, etc die sets, because they are a great value. I would argue the best value and have good customer service generally an email and photo of problem is all you need.

 

[GT1]

Most of Lee Precision products are made in the USA by tax paying workers and I believe Lee product sales exceed many other brands sales combined.

I would bet that is so, by a long shot. I am sure there are a zillion LMs and Pro 1000s out there turning out untold numbers of rounds. The majority of those owners are making ammo and not posting here. They have no idea that junk doesn't work at all.

 

[Malamute]

I think it was touched upon already, mainly that "most cant tell the difference for their uses" (paraphrased). Lee dies are not as precision made as RCBS and other dies, especially the ones made for more precision use, but are more than adequet for most peoples uses. That isnt to say others are overpriced or wrong because they cost more, they are just aiming at a different price and performance point.

I dont know how precision the Dillon dies are in comparison to others, but as somebody said, they do have some very useful features for use with progressive presses. I came into a Dillon 550 with several sets of Dillon dies, and they truly are nice for use in the progressive compared to other standard type dies. I'd not hesitate to buy more Dillon dies for use in a progressive press.

 

[taliv]

I would bet that is so, by a long shot. I am sure there are a zillion LMs and Pro 1000s out there turning out untold numbers of rounds. The majority of those owners are making ammo and not posting here. They have no idea that junk doesn't work at all.

probably so, but as far as that 'untold number of rounds', I would bet that the average dillon user makes about 1000x as much ammo as the average lee user. so from their perspective, the cost of the dies are spread over a much larger number of rounds, so a 5x delta turns out to not be a huge deal.

 

[X-Ring]

I have had a Lee Ultimate die set for 30/06 ($45) pull the decapping stem out of the die on the first use. Many of my Lee dies quickly tarnish and even rust. Never had any Dillon die ($67) do that.

 

[blue32]

As I learned, being able to drop the crimping insert and clean all the built up lube is a huge plus for Dillon dies. All of my pistol sets have come with separate dies for seating and crimping. While nice and functional, I don't know if I would spring for their carbide .223 dies again.

 

[A Pause for the Coz]

I always thought it was, if they lowered the price on the Dillon dies every one would think they were inferior and not buy them.
Better to price high and have a sale....

 

[ljnowell]

probably so, but as far as that 'untold number of rounds', I would bet that the average dillon user makes about 1000x as much ammo as the average lee user. so from their perspective, the cost of the dies are spread over a much larger number of rounds, so a 5x delta turns out to not be a huge deal.

I wouldn't make that bet if I were you. The "average" Dillon user I know never breaks 5-10k rounds per year. Most would be just fine with a turret press but they bought into the Dillon name because their friends told them to.

 

[mdi]

My opinion is that while Dillon may be slightly better finished, the cost is manly from "Dillon" on the side of the die. Reloading dies are pretty simple tools (unless you get into micro-adjustable seating dies or twin carbide sizing dies or other "specialized use" dies) and are kinda hard to screw up. Lee is an inexpensive, but quality product that I believe relies on high sales to keep prices down (kinda like Snap-On tools, available mostly from independent "sales trucks", versus Craftsman tools that can be found in any Sears and Ace hardware stores). Like mentioned above a conscious reloader can make good safe ammo with nearly all dies available today, but a sloppy semi-conscious reloader won't be able to make safe, shootable ammo even with the most expensive/"best" tools available...

 

[Arkansas Paul]

My opinion is that while Dillon may be slightly better finished, the cost is manly from "Dillon" on the side of the die.

There is no doubt that the name does effect the cost to a degree.
However don't underestimate the lifetime warranty being figured into the cost of a product either.

If they're willing to replace the item for free any time it breaks from now till forever, it's going to cost more than a similar item that is only guaranteed for one year.

Having said all of that, I love my Lee dies and will continue to buy them for future calibers.

 

[maxxhavoc]

Dillon is expensive. For dies, I have not noticed a significant difference between the two.

For seating depth accuracy in rifle rounds, I have found RCBS dies superior to both. The only non-RCBS die I use for rifle anymore is the Lee FCD.

 

[rodregier]

FWIW, I really like the carbide neck button option in the Redding rifle dies.

I even adapted a Redding carbide neck button to an RCBS small base die.
(Had to modify the depriming shaft).

 

[Walkalong]

I even adapted a Redding carbide neck button to an RCBS small base die.
(Had to modify the depriming shaft).

I did that as well. Not small base, but RCBS.

 

[Rule3]

For Dillon, reloading is a hobby or a sideline. They make big money doing this, so they have gazillions of dollars and a big budget. As mentioned above, with their warranty (as with RCBS) you pay for that up front. Yes the make top of the line "stuff"

http://www.dillonaero.com/about_us.html