Wild first shots?

[johnle]

It seems to me that when I begin my day at the range my first 5 shots or so out of my clean barrel are usually very ugly. Afterwards they begin to tighten up and become more of what I'm used to.

This normal?

My barrel is cleaned with a bore snake, outers nitro solvent, and followed up by a swab of breakfree CLP and dry patches.

 

[Urbana John]

I believe it's normal.

Happens to me after I clean the barrel on all my rifles.

UJ

 

[RyanM]

Given that this is the handgun thread, I'm guessing it's you, not the gun. Usually takes me about a magazine worth of rounds to warm up.

Unless you're talking about normally getting 1/2" groups at 10 yards, and always getting 3/4" for your first group, it's not the cleanliness of the barrel.

 

[loop]

I never carry a "clean" gun. The group will tighten around the fifth or sixth round. Fouling is needed to create a seal.

Allow me to ask this, have you ever sighted in a freshly cleaned gun?

Dirty it up a little.

 

[1911Tuner]

Not unusual for a dead clean barrel to shoot a little "out" at first. One of my rifles requires three fouling shots before the group closes up to normal.

I once cleaned my range pistol barrels (.45s) with FP-10 in order to cut the lead fouling out. It worked, and very well...but I also had to run about 30 rounds through each one before they started to shoot again.

I've found a good trick after cleaning and oiling the bore is to run a few patches through the barrel wet with denatured alcohol, and follow with a dry one. Cuts down on the number of fouling rounds required.

Doesn't work with the FP-10 treatment, though...

For the next year, there was zero fouling beyond a light wash that I could remove with a dry .50 caliber brush with one in/out cycle. They're starting to pick up lead just forward of the leade again, so I guess it's time for another treatment...but the dirtying process will have to be repeated. Worth it, though. Cleanup is a snap.

 

[Mad Magyar]

Tuner, explain the causes of the "occasional flyer" that is thrown around in most gun review articles...I've wondered that this is a perfect alibi for the lousy shot....

 

[Sato Ord]

I wouldn't worry too much about the first couple of shots going a bit off. Remember what Heinlein said,

"Get a shot off fast. This upsets him long enough to let you make your second shot perfect."

 

[1911Tuner]

I wouldn't worry too much about the first couple of shots going a bit off. Remember what Heinlein said,

"Get a shot off fast. This upsets him long enough to let you make your second shot perfect."

Otherwise known as a civil litigator's dream come true. Deliberately throwing wild shots is a good way to lose everything that you own when the old lady three blocks away, pushing her grocery cart out of the Piggly Wiggly takes a round through the kneecap.

I'd tend to think that a 230-grain slug amidships would upset him far more than a loud miss, in any event.

 

[Jim Watson]

That was what Bill Jordan said.
On the other hand, Heinlein was in the Navy in the late battleship era. They went with volley fire for "straddles", you know.

We had a guy here who was convinced that loads with PB powder were markedly more accurate than anything else, and he had the Ransom Rest targets to show it. Thing is, he normally cleaned his gun, shot any competing load, then shot the PB he liked. Until one fine day he shot the PB first and Brand X second. With some fouling shots down the barrel, the Brand X shot more accurately.

 

[1911Tuner]

That was what Bill Jordan said.

I think Jordan said:

"A 160-grain slug in the vicinity of his belt buckle would serve to disturb his aim much more than kicking dirt on his shoes" (Or somethin' to that effect.)

 

[Jim Watson]

Yes, but looking up exact quotes is such a drag.

 

[Sato Ord]

Well, since I didn't expect anyone to take the Heinlein quote as gospel, (gods, lighten up folks), I figured that most of us would understand that a wild shot tends to mean that you're still most likely to hit your target, not shoot so wide that you endanger the people down the street, or your own foot. That's one of the reasons we spend so much time throwing lead down the range at all of those godless paper targets.

 

[Sato Ord]

Okay, I was being a bit sarcastic in both posts. I've a rough couple of days.

As for wild first shots, what I meant by the Heinlein quote was if your first shots are fast and still hit the paper on the range you are most likely going to have the other guy ducking for cover in a drastic situation. Better to get a shot off quick that wounds than to take so much time aiming and dissecting the situation that you hesitate and get yourself, or someone you love, killed. So I wouldn't worry too much if the first shot or two won't thread a needle.

There are many factors that can cause such "wild" first shots. I would ask your range controllers to watch you and see if they can spot anything in your technique that could be causing it. It could simply be a matter of having to put a couple of rounds down range to get over the anticipation of the noise and kick. If that is the case a snap cap and some dry fire practice might help.

 

[DragonFire]

I read in one of my hunting books that a good way to test if you were ready for an upcoming hunting season was to dress in your normal hunting clothes and take one shot at a target at some unmeasured distance (like you would while hunting). You either made the shot or you missed. The reasoning was that while hunting you didn't get more than one shot before the target moved, so judging your accuracy after "warming up", or or otherwise adjusting your aim from several shots wasn't right.

This might be relavant to CCW. If your first few shots at the range might be a good indication of what you would do in a real self-defense situation. It doesn't matter that your shots get better after a few shots, or after the barrel is "dirty", if you don't carry it that way. It might be the first couple of shots that determine if you get to take more or not.