A spare reload if needed

[trackskippy]

I think a lot of the problem here is, a lot of people seem to have one scenario in their head of what a gunfight is going to be, at least according to "the stats", and its going to be close, with one, incompetent opponent, with only a few rounds fired, and they are going to win. Thats it. So a 5 shot J frame is all you'll ever need, and you only have to load three rounds in it.

Many, if not most people seem to be plugged into that 3-3-3 thing and that's what it sounds like most people might practice for, assuming they are practicing in any kind of realistic manner at all. That, and it also fits nicely with the guns they seem to choose to carry, so everything is easy peasy.

Then you have those of us who feel that if its worth carrying a gun for, then why wouldn't you carry the gun you shoot best with, and plan for, and practice for, the worst, as opposed to the easiest, so you at least you're being a bit more realistic with yourself, and have some sort of decent chance, with "anything" you might get, not just that one scenario you always win in your head.

But, that takes some regular work and effort on your part, and easy peasy tends to go out the window.

Truthfully, I don't think most people are the least bit realistic about their actual skills and the thought of your average Joe getting into a gunfight anywhere in public to me, is as scary, if not more so, than the bad guys we seem to be so worried about.

 

[trackskippy]

Just got a mental image of you tapping, racking or dropping mag and inserting a
new one while the bad guy is beating you over the head with a feather duster.

This is something else that always kind of bugs me about these kinds of threads. The gun is "always" the, and only answer and if it quits, oh my Todd! , what'll I do, Im done.

Doesnt anyone have any kind of practical hand to hand skills anymore? I might be old and getting decrepit, but I still know where to hit and/or manhandle people, that doesn't take a whole lot of effort, and that empty or disabled gun is an impact weapon in its own right.

RIP Toby Keith, but his one old song is still somewhat relevant too.

 

[.38 Special]

I think a lot of the problem here is, a lot of people seem to have one scenario in their head of what a gunfight is going to be, at least according to "the stats", and its going to be close, with one, incompetent opponent, with only a few rounds fired, and they are going to win. Thats it. So a 5 shot J frame is all you'll ever need, and you only have to load three rounds in it.

Many, if not most people seem to be plugged into that 3-3-3 thing and that's what it sounds like most people might practice for, assuming they are practicing in any kind of realistic manner at all. That, and it also fits nicely with the guns they seem to choose to carry, so everything is easy peasy.

Then you have those of us who feel that if its worth carrying a gun for, then why wouldn't you carry the gun you shoot best with, and plan for, and practice for, the worst, as opposed to the easiest, so you at least you're being a bit more realistic with yourself, and have some sort of decent chance, with "anything" you might get, not just that one scenario you always win in your head.

But, that takes some regular work and effort on your part, and easy peasy tends to go out the window.

Truthfully, I don't think most people are the least bit realistic about their actual skills and the thought of your average Joe getting into a gunfight anywhere in public to me, is as scary, if not more so, than the bad guys we seem to be so worried about.

Of course, the converse is people who imagine multiple trained opponents, which they skillfully take down with sustained, accurate fire and multiple reloads.

Luckily, we no longer have to use our imaginations. Thanks to hosting sites like YouTube, we now have access to countless hours of video footage of real fights. There really is no excuse not to prepare for reality these days, and it's awfully hard to find instances of lone CCW men getting into extended gunfights with multiple assailants.

Again, though, if a fellow feels like preparing for such a thing, then more power to him. It's just that trying to convince other people to prepare for it requires some real contortions.

 

[JeffG]

Malfunction drill: what’s after tap/rack/reassess? *click! Strip out the mag, Rack several times. Lock it back, insert fresh mag. Chamber fresh round, Reassess, back in the fight. I like a spare mag.

 

[Eutycus]

I mentioned lawyers a while back. Can any of you see the day in the future where a family member of a shooting victim will sue you for not having an extra few rounds? Like "If you had another bullet or two my so and so would still be alive".Its dumb enough to be true someday.

 

[halfmoonclip]

Lately, down to 6+1 BodyGuard, but there is a spare mag in my other pocket. I make mag covers of thin leather, to keep out the pocket lint.
Retrieving a spare from a pocket, and pulling off the cover with my teeth, doesn't look much like a tactical reload, but it beats no reload.
A few years back, a P365 and spare mag were my carry, and if things get hinky again this summer, I'll go back to it.
Up here on our mountain, we're shielded from some of the craziness....some, but not all.
Moon

 

[trackskippy]

Of course, the converse is people who imagine multiple trained opponents, which they skillfully take down with sustained, accurate fire and multiple reloads.

Luckily, we no longer have to use our imaginations. Thanks to hosting sites like YouTube, we now have access to countless hours of video footage of real fights. There really is no excuse not to prepare for reality these days, and it's awfully hard to find instances of lone CCW men getting into extended gunfights with multiple assailants.

Again, though, if a fellow feels like preparing for such a thing, then more power to him. It's just that trying to convince other people to prepare for it requires some real contortions.

As you said earlier, we should all carry and do what we think is best for us, and I agree, for the most part, but in the same vein, I believe we need to be hard on and realistic with ourselves about the things we choose and why, and what our skills are with them. The worst person to deceive here is ourselves.

YouTube does have a lot of good stuff, and if you're paying attention, a lot of it is varied and not just the 3-3-3 thing. Getting caught up in any of them would suck, and even more so if you arent at least somewhat prepared, both mentally and skill-wise.

I like and agree with that boy who's always saying, "wait your turn".

Unfortunately for us, we don't get to choose what we get, it just is what it is. Hopefully, we don't get anything, that's the goal, but that "one thing", no matter what it is, is likely to be interesting, to say the least.

Thats where all our "Zen" studies come in. Hopefully, we kept an open mind, and were paying attention, and didn't get lost on that "one hand clapping" thing.

 

[Old Dog]

Even if we take the “3 yards, 3 shots, 3 seconds on average” statistic

There is NO such statistic. This has become just another internet trope, endlessly repeated and which, if anything, makes many less likely to prepare for the worst event that could affect them. I do get a kick out of all those folks whose disaster preparation is viewing YouTube videos, though.

Are you prepared with only enough water, food, propone, gas for your generator and toilet paper for a three-day power outage, or are you prepared for the aftermath of a major hurricane, earthquake or tsunami that will cut off your city from railway lines, interstates, all supply lines for three weeks or three months?

I personally have never prepared for the "average" gun fight. I've prepared for the worst, even though should the worst occur, I'll probably be unlikely to survive (but in the immortal words of the legendary Porter Waggoner, "I'll go down swinging.") I frankly don't care what anyone is doing to prepare, unless they're planning on bugging out from their McMansion to my compound during the apocalypse.

The fact is there are many reports, mostly from larger cities, where the criminals (mostly teen gangbangers) have fired entire magazines at their intended targets. And reloaded. I am familiar with one locally a few years back where one shooter (never caught, BTW) fired 41 rounds from his Glock 19 at his target in the parking lot of an AM/PM Mini mart. At some crime scenes, well over 100 shell casings have been recovered. Most of you never hear nor read of these incidents unless you're privy to the official reports. Most of these incidents you'll not find videos of on YouTube. If it's a "mass shooter" situation, the media isn't breaking down the "average" number of shots fired by each shooter, even those supposedly "defending" themselves, and the actual number of shots fired will rarely be accurately reported.

The FBI doesn't review UCR input and extrapolate data to determine "average" distance of citizen from assailant, "average" number of shots fired or "average" time period from initial contact to final shot(s) fired. No law enforcement agency records this sort of "statistics." Incident reports are written and submitted up the chain for review, data submitted electronically through a state or national reporting system.

 

[Sarge7402]

No.

With my 17, Ive got three revolver reloads already in the gun, and I don't have to stop and fiddle anywhere in the middle.

Better practice reloading one handed with your weak hand. Should be an eye opener

 

[Sarge7402]

View attachment 1207280
Peeps

Can't help it if I can't spell

 

[.38 Special]

Are you prepared with only enough water, food, propone, gas for your generator and toilet paper for a three-day power outage, or are you prepared for the aftermath of a major hurricane, earthquake or tsunami that will cut off your city from railway lines, interstates, all supply lines for three weeks or three months?

I worry about EMP. I'm prepared for a year, and feel as though three years would be better.

And that hits right at the heart of the "reload" debate: no matter what you've done, there's somebody who's done more of it, and also a scenario which will defeat your preparations.

 

[Kleanbore]

There is NO such statistic. This has become just another internet trope, endlessly repeated and which, if anything, makes many less likely to prepare for the worst event that could affect them.....The FBI doesn't review UCR input and extrapolate data to determine "average" distance of citizen from assailant, "average" number of shots fired or "average" time period from initial contact to final shot(s) fired. No law enforcement agency records this sort of "statistics."

Right!

 

[tubeshooter]

Nothing wrong with carrying a reload or more if you want.

If things feel extra squirrely and the world seems super-scary, sometimes I'll carry that LCP along with. I think I can bring a ready-to-go micro .380 to bear at least as fast as I could reload most anything else.


Fortunately 99% of the time things don't feel that squirrely for me. Living in such a world would be rather trying anyway.

 

[armoredman]

Missed one - balance. Got

Wouldn't or couldn't an attorney for the "victim" that you shot make it look like you went looking for a fight? On the stand a lawyer is almost certainly question the reasoning for you carrying so many rounds. A few rounds could be construed as self defense, but alot of rounds could be interpreted YOU were out to "kill". An attorney can twist your wording to make you look like a bloodthirsty killer.

Ask them why police officers carry 2 or 3 spare mags - are they "out to kill"? And if not why do they carry so much ammo when they have a radio to call for armed backup, something you as a civilian don't have.

 

[Risky buisness]

Spare mag:
capacity
statistics
location
malfunction

THIS.....RIGHT HERE ^. It doesn't matter how safe your area, the round count isn't real important and I don't care about reported statistics.

 

[WisBorn]

I'm more likely to carry a New York reload than a spare magazine.

I will carry an additional reload of a different type of ammo. Hardcast and hollow points for an example.

 

[.308 Norma]

Living in such a world would be rather trying anyway.

Ha! At my age, just living in this world is "trying" enough sometimes.

 

[Eutycus]

Missed one - balance. Got

Ask them why police officers carry 2 or 3 spare mags - are they "out to kill"? And if not why do they carry so much ammo when they have a radio to call for armed backup, something you as a civilian don't have.

I don't know the details of some of these cases where families of "victims of police brutality" have been awarded millions. But I would bet cops were grilled on the stand with similar questions.To answer that they were just following regulations from their police department didn't help matters much for the cities that now have to furnish those millions, did it? Like I said , I don't know, do you? But I am quessing there were similar questions asked. Besides I don't think this thread is about cops.To have on one's person (if that person is a civilian) some extra magazines is not following anyone's regulations. That would be strictly voluntary.

 

[Old Dog]

To have on one's person (if that person is a civilian) some extra magazines is not following anyone's regulations. That would be strictly voluntary.

Look, this has come up often in the past two or three decades. Mas Ayoob has written (and spoken) about many, many civil and criminal trials in which he's testified as an expert witness for defendants. I can't recall any case he's ever talked about in which the amount of spare ammo the defendant had on their person at the time of the shooting was brought up as a factor to prove intent.

I could be wrong, however.

Many other aspects have been called into question by prosecutors or attorneys for plaintiffs, and would be far more worrisome for someone going to court over a self-defense shooting. The little things, such as the caliber ("power") of the gun (10mm featured prominently in an AZ case), the number of shots the defendants fired (i.e., were additional shots after the first one necessary), where the shot impacted on the body of the victim/deceased (i.e., shot in the back), was the victim/deceased in fact a threat to commit death or serious bodily injury to the defendants), the type of bullet the defendant used in his/her gun (i.e., "more deadly" hollow-points, "cop-killer" bullets, "armor-piercing," etc.)

 

[Eutycus]

This thread has been about something that might happen.I've given my opinion several times. I think carrying extra ammo is "fine and dandy" for those who want to and sometimes I actually do.But to me, it's not one of those things that has to be carried out daily.There is no checklist. I actually forgot my gun at home once. Speedloaders and extra ammo are not an everyday thing (to me).Sometimes I do, sometimes I don't. In fact I am leaving in a few minutes to go get some tacos, without my speedloader.

 

[Kleanbore]

Fortunately 99% of the time things don't feel that squirrely for me.

What might that have to do with reality?

 

[The Night Rider]

I don't know the details of some of these cases where families of "victims of police brutality" have been awarded millions. But I would bet cops were grilled on the stand with similar questions.To answer that they were just following regulations from their police department didn't help matters much for the cities that now have to furnish those millions, did it? Like I said , I don't know, do you? But I am quessing there were similar questions asked. Besides I don't think this thread is about cops.To have on one's person (if that person is a civilian) some extra magazines is not following anyone's regulations. That would be strictly voluntary.

I would bet that most police officers are issued a gun, so many magazines and so many rounds and told "This is what you will carry."

If they have no option you can't hold them accountable for it. You might as well bust them for wearing a blue shirt

 

[tubeshooter]

What might that have to do with reality?

Hey - maybe not a whole heck of a lot !!

Got any more pedantic one-liners?

 

[Targa]

I had to Google pedantic..

Am I being over the top paranoid by carrying an extra reload on me?

I don’t think you are. I don’t carry an extra magazine but thats just me.

 

[Rexster]

A magazine is a point of failure, whether the magazine fails, the engagement/release system fails, the holster causes an unintended release of the magazine, or, the shooter causes the failure. Watch enough police body cam videos, and will become apparent how many times police officers will accidentally bump a mag release button, during the draw.

I generally do carry a spare magazine, when I carry an auto-loading pistol. The auto I normally carry is a Glock G17, which holds more in the magazine than my 6-shot K-snub, plus two strips with four rounds, each, that I frequently carry, yet I feel that something is missing, when I do not have that spare magazine, along with the Glock, because the second magazine is about more than just ammo capacity.