5.56 and 223rem on the same box?

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I was going through some ammo cans and came across a box of S&B ammo that says

223rem, FMJ/M193, 3,6g, 55gr on the front and on the side of the box its printed. 223rem. 5,56x45. FMJ/M193 55gr. They are in LC cases and have green paint on the bullets. Any idea what's going on here? I know you can shoot 223 in a 5.56 chamber but not the other way around. Should I just pull these and salvage the case or give them away? I only have bolt guns in 223rem.
 
The box has been refilled with LC 62 grain M855 rounds (SS109 bullets). This is 5.56 ammo.

Despite this, the bullets listed on the box (that are no longer in there apparently) were 5.56 (and should not be called 223 Rem).

Are they all green tip? Someone probably obtained a loose-filled 1000 count box of M855 and used the S&B box for storage.
 
CLP said:
The box has been refilled with LC 62 grain M855 rounds (SS109 bullets). This is 5.56 ammo.

Despite this, the bullets listed on the box (that are no longer in there apparently) were 5.56 (and should not be called 223 Rem).

Are they all green tip? Someone probably obtained a loose-filled 1000 count box of M855 and used the S&B box for storage.
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Yep, all green tips. Aren't these banned or something? I remember something a few years ago about these type of bullets not being allowed to be sold.

Everything I listed in the OP on the box is printed by S&B not hand written.
 

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CLP said:
The box has been refilled with LC 62 grain M855 rounds (SS109 bullets). This is 5.56 ammo.

Despite this, the bullets listed on the box (that are no longer in there apparently) were 5.56 (and should not be called 223 Rem).

Are they all green tip? Someone probably obtained a loose-filled 1000 count box of M855 and used the S&B box for storage.
Click to expand...
Yep, all green tips. Aren't these banned or something? I remember something a few years ago about these type of bullets not being allowed to be sold.

Everything I listed in the OP on the box is printed by S&B not hand written.
 

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As far as I know S&B makes their own brass and it's identified as such. LC make ammo for the military so I'm guessing its 5.56 x 45 NATO. The paint usually indicates it's military. I wouldn't shoot it in a .223 bolt rifle if you like your rifle.
 
If I remember correctly I was given this years ago when you couldn't find 223rem or 5.56 ammo and the person who gave this to me deals strictly with AR rifles. I reload so figured pull the bullets, toss the powder and bullets and keep that nice LC brass if it was indeed 5.56. I figured it was but the box markings was the oddest thing id ever seen. I know a guy with an AR so ill probably just give them to him and tell him I want the brass back if all else fails.
 
IMG_5710.JPG

The green tips are 62 gr. M855 5.56 and while the ATF talked about banning them there was such an uproar about it that they ran off with their tail between their legs presumably to try again at a later point.

So yeah, that's 5.56 ammo and no it's not banned or illegal to own in any way.

I don't know what your rifle is set up for, but that's what that ammo is.
 
Not banned, but indoor ranges and many outdoor ranges prohibit them. Indoor ranges because they could potentially defeat the back stop, and outdoor ranges because they're potentially a fire hazard (steel striking stone, spark, dry grass, etc).

And the way they clearly list the original contents (which I think we all agree has been replaced by LC M855) seems to me like a lawsuit just waiting to happen. I don't know what the potential for a kaboom is by shooting 5.56 in a 223 Rem chamber continuously, but it's been discussed ad nauseum.
 
Browning said:
The green tips are 62 gr. M855 5.56 and while the ATF talked about banning them there was such an uproar about it that they ran off with their tail between their legs presumably to try again at a later point.
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Armor piercing they said. Shoots thru schools or something like that. By the ATF's own definition M855 wasn't AP and was specifically exempted. That didn't stop them tho.
 
Browning said:
View attachment 775130

The green tips are 62 gr. M855 5.56 and while the ATF talked about banning them there was such an uproar about it that they ran off with their tail between their legs presumably to try again at a later point.

So yeah, that's 5.56 ammo and no it's not banned or illegal to own in any way.

I don't know what your rifle is set up for, but that's what that ammo is.
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thanks. I have just a basic savage axis rifle but playing with the idea of selling two of them to purchase an AR. varmint rifle. Ill hang onto them and hide them so they don't get mixed in incase I do get an AR.
 
ohihunter2014 said:
If I remember correctly I was given this years ago when you couldn't find 223rem or 5.56 ammo and the person who gave this to me deals strictly with AR rifles. I reload so figured pull the bullets, toss the powder and bullets and keep that nice LC brass if it was indeed 5.56. I figured it was but the box markings was the oddest thing id ever seen. I know a guy with an AR so ill probably just give them to him and tell him I want the brass back if all else fails.
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You can pull them and reload them at 223 pressures. Follow your reloading manual
 
If your rifle can shoot 5.56, those'd be my first choice to destroy any unwanted fruits, vegetables, or appliances with. Shoot it and find something a little less scetchy to stock up on!
 
ohihunter2014 said:
I was going through some ammo cans and came across a box of S&B ammo that says

223rem, FMJ/M193, 3,6g, 55gr on the front and on the side of the box its printed. 223rem. 5,56x45. FMJ/M193 55gr. They are in LC cases and have green paint on the bullets. Any idea what's going on here? I know you can shoot 223 in a 5.56 chamber but not the other way around. Should I just pull these and salvage the case or give them away? I only have bolt guns in 223rem.
Click to expand...

I've come across that a few years ago with a box marked .308 Winchester. The ammo inside was Lake City NATO brass.

Believe it or not.

View attachment 775152
 
CLP said:
That looks like reloaded ammo. Primer pockets look like they've been reamed.
Did you buy that box at a retail store?
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Academy Sports and Outdoors. Several boxes, all the same. They aren't known for selling reloads as far as I know. So it makes me think Armscor did it?

Freedom Munitions, on the other hand, will have a smorgasbord of different brass all in one box of ammo.
 
ohihunter2014 said:
Yep, all green tips. Aren't these banned or something? I remember something a few years ago about these type of bullets not being allowed to be sold.

Everything I listed in the OP on the box is printed by S&B not hand written.[/QUOT
I would say that someone repacked Lake City 62gr ammo into the S&B box. Back when the ATF M855 ammo scare was going on, people were hiding their soon to be illegal ammo.
If your shooting a bolt gun, you shouldn't have any trouble with 556 ammo. It would be like shooting reloads that are around max. I have shot plenty through my Winchester Featherweight whit no flat primers.
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Before the internet they were the same. While the ammo with 5.56 headstamps "CAN" be loaded to higher pressure than that with 223 headstamps they are rarely loaded to levels exceeding 223 max loads and even then I've never once known of a problem. People have been shooting 223/5.56 as well as 308/7.62 interchangeably for years.

I have several hundred rounds of 5.56 through my 223 bolt gun. The worst problem I've ever heard of was the hotter 5.56 ammo not cycling reliably in semi-autos with 223 chambers. The original Ruger Mini-14 was chambered for 223, but there are no current 223 semi-autos to my knowledge.

All commercial ammo in any cartridge is loaded to a wide range of pressure levels, much greater than the difference between 223 and 5.56. Every rifle manufacturer cuts chambers and barrels to different tolerances. It isn't uncommon, and I've seen far, far more examples of rifles in 243, 30-06, 30-30, 270, you name it, running into over pressure issues with certain ammo in certain rifles than the issue with 223 and 5.56.

I'll use 30-06 for example. The original load used in WW-1 was a 150 gr bullet @ 2700 fps. By WW-2 that was upped to 2800 fps and the Garand is designed for that power level. Most commercial hunting loads at the time were the same. Today 2900 fps is typical with loading manuals showing as much as 3100 fps possible. Some factory loads are at that level.

By that standard the 30-06 should have 4 different designations intended for 4 different rifles. But we call all of it 30-06 and with bolt guns it doesn't matter. Most of the commercial and military semi-autos don't run well on the hotter ammo and using it can lead to parts damage.
 
62 Gr Green Tip M855 is not "armor piercing", it is a "penetrator" round. It has a soft steel core to help pierce barriers etc. "Armor piercing" has a hardened core that will not deform on steel so it can pierce it.
 
chicharrones said:
Academy Sports and Outdoors. Several boxes, all the same. They aren't known for selling reloads as far as I know. So it makes me think Armscor did it?

Freedom Munitions, on the other hand, will have a smorgasbord of different brass all in one box of ammo.
Click to expand...

Perhaps Armscor sourced a lot of pulled down brass, removed the primers, reamed the pockets, then loaded up their recipe?

I scored beaucoup LC '54 .30-06 from Jeff Barnett back in the day which he had similarly prepped. Still had the nasty mouth sealer in it though.
 
Uncrimped virgin LC brass can be bought. I have 1,000 pieces out in my shop.

I did a project for LCAAP on the M855, and IIRC the penetrator was hardened steel. It's not very big. Think of something very roughly the size of a match head. There isn't a lot of room inside that copper jacket.

As stated, it is not armor piercing. It's just enough to penetrate a Russian soldier's helmet, not an armored vehicle. BATFE made a serious run at classifying it as armor piercing, and failed spectacularly. For one thing, their legal authority does not extend to rounds for rifles with a bore smaller than .22". The bore of 5.56/223? Just a couple of ten thousandths less that .22", and out of their reach.

I keep a little bit of m855 on hand, just as a momento of the project.
 
denton said:
Uncrimped virgin LC brass can be bought. I have 1,000 pieces out in my shop.
Click to expand...

I have several K myself. But the primer pockets in the picture posted appear as they do after crimped brass is reamed. But I'm just speculating- it just appears that way to me at least.
 
chicharrones said:
I've come across that a few years ago with a box marked .308 Winchester. The ammo inside was Lake City NATO brass.

Believe it or not.

View attachment 775152
Click to expand...

I've heard that the LC plant is open to building ammo on a contract to companies like Federal. It could be that LC built some ammo for Armscor but I doubt it. That's reamed brass.

You can't depend on anything anymore. My but hurts. At least it was re-manufactured in the US, right?
 
CoalTrain49 said:
I've heard that the LC plant is open to building ammo on a contract to companies like Federal. It could be that LC built some ammo for Armscor but I doubt it. That's reamed brass.

You can't depend on anything anymore. My but hurts. At least it was re-manufactured in the US, right?
Click to expand...
Same company that owns Federal also operates LC under contract. Ammo lots that the Army rejects are packaged and sold under the American Eagle brand. Of course, they also intentionally make AE ammo as well.

The picture of the penetrate shown doesn't look much like what I remember. The ones I remember were about 1/8" thick disks, tapered on the edge to fit the jacket.
 
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