Kel Tec PMR 30

IMHO no. .22 Mag out of a pistol length barrel is equal to .22 LR out of a rifle barrel.

.22 Mag ammo is 5-10X more expensive than .22 LR and more expensive than 9mm.

I'm jonesing for a Ruger Charger.

I was looking at them for awhile and really liked them. however, the sights appear to not be adjustable? ive never handled one but non adjustable sights are a deal breaker for me. I need windage and elevation adjustments.

there is nothing more disappointing than a gun that does not shoot where yu aim it. and you can do nothing about it.


now I could be all wrong about this as ive never seen one in person or researched them much since they first came out.

Maybe look at the Kel Tec CP33 .22lr pistol. This suggestion is based on the previous posts only. Ive never handled a PMR 30.

I've found .22 mag in revolvers to be increasingly unreliable, so in a semi pistol that has to extract and feed that long, skinny case I wouldn't trust my life on one.

The CP33 I intend to buy this year ASAP.

I've got one, and they're right @400$. It would depend upon what you mean by "worth the money".
Pros:
Lightweight
Bright Fiber Optic Sights
Aim well-reasonably accurate
Low recoil
30 round mag
Reasonably easy field strip and reassemble
Solid ambi thumb safety

Cons:
Too large for CC, unless you intend to carry full-size
Occasional mag jams(even with "proper" mag loading technique )
Rare unexplained slide rear lock-up
Not, IMO, dependable enough to trust your life to, in carry situations
Mag release tends to drop mags, at times-
Grip is very long and narrow, for small hands

My takeaway is it's a great plinker, or for pest control. Dependability issues put is squarely in the
"range toy" category, for me.

BTW, don't believe the Youtube gel-pack ballistics tests- this thing doesn't have near the punch of a 5.7.
Not even close. The pistols are night and day, dependability-wise, too. I actually trust and carry a 5.7.

I wouldnt carry one but the op never really said the use. I have a pmr-30 as well as the p-30 from back in the day. Zero improvement after 25 years. I think if the mags were better the p-30 would actually be the better gun. I doubt I bother with their 22. I may look at the Taurus 22. Considering how few are out there compared to other companies, I get a lot of Kel-tecs to fix. Imho.

I don't know about gel. But many years ago I tested a pmr-30 against my Five-Seven with FN factory blue tips. The chrono results were about the same against Remington ballistic tip 22 mag. Obviously there is a hundred 22 mag rounds and at the time exactly one 5.7x28 round available so take that in account. The 5.7 is an exponentially better built gun. I'd trust it to carry as far as reliability but I'd choose any of my 9mm, 10mm, 40, 45, or small 44 mags. But again the op didn't say he wasnt looking for a plinking or small game gun. For that a reliable 22 mag is great. (I'd take a single six for about the same price with 2 cylinders)

I went to buy a PMR 30 9 years ago but held off as I read that many people were experiencing keyhole issues. Kel TEC addressed that issue by replacing the barrels at no cost. in 2011, after Kel Tec started second production, I began a unproductive search for one but none were to be found.
I finally found one in '15 and have been pretty happy with it. Kel Tec provided a list of approved ammo manufacturers that I've strayed from over the years. Armscor is the only brand that I experienced a FTF so I keep mine on a steady diet of CCI, Federal and Hornady.
I had mine on the nightstand for a couple of years but now it's just dedicated to range use. I placed a Burris Fast Fire III on mine and get great accuracy out to 50 yards. When going to the range with friends or family it's easily the most requested firearm to bring.

Keyfer 55 said:

Keltec Lightweight 22 mag pistol is it worth the money???

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From everything that I have read about them, my opinion is that they are worth ~$400.

That said, I do not have one because they fire rimfire ammo and I have a little rule for myself that, aside from .22LR, I must be able to easily reload all cartridge flavors that I add to my stable.

But at 9 bucks for 50 one can buy a lot and 1 50 cal can would hold probably hold 5000. Thats just an educated guess though. I'd buy another keltec if they made a pmr 30 in 17hmr. Just to try it

crestoncowboy said:

But at 9 bucks for 50 one can buy a lot ...

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OUCH! 18¢ per non-reloadable round? Nope, not for me ... any more than the 15¢ (or more) per .22LR round that some were paying not so long ago.

For the same price range I can currently buy quality, factory, reloadable-case, 9x19 ammo.

Enjoy!

That's a decent price too. Maybe not the cheapest but i certainly didnt choose a high priced ammo to skewer my point. I actually said it wasnt worth it to the op. It does store well. Heavy in a 50 cal can though.

5.7 is double that. And while it is reloadable... it's barely so

crestoncowboy said:

5.7 is double that. And while it is reloadable... it's barely so

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I was drawn to the PS90 ... really wanted one ... but reloading 5.7x28?

Several years ago, Trent (I believe it was), started a Thread about his 5.7x28 Reloading Adventures. I was hoping that it would be easily doable but after closely reading about his trials & tribulations I finally decided that, for me, reloading 5.7x28 did not fall in the "easily reloadable" category and I shelved my interest in the PS90.

crestoncowboy said:

I don't know about gel. But many years ago I tested a pmr-30 against my Five-Seven with FN factory blue tips. The chrono results were about the same against Remington ballistic tip 22 mag. Obviously there is a hundred 22 mag rounds and at the time exactly one 5.7x28 round available so take that in account.

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Try shooting trapped animals, and pest control. There is just no comparison.

Real life isn't "chrono this" and "gel that". 5.7x28MM performs, 22WMR is disappointing.

GBExpat said:

OUCH! 18¢ per non-reloadable round? Nope, not for me ... any more than the 15¢ (or more) per .22LR round that some were paying not so long ago.

For the same price range I can currently buy quality, factory, reloadable-case, 9x19 ammo.

Enjoy!

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And that's for the cheapest of .22 Magnum. I buy the expensive short barrel JHP stuff, either Speer or Hornady, and still get failures to fire. There are better things worth spending that money on, I agree.

I bought a PMR30 in 2015 for $399. It instantly became a favorite at the range. I've put about 1500 rounds through it, mostly CCI but many other brands too, with very excellent reliability. I even tried the Armscor ammo that Keltec advised owners not use. My front sight screws loosened and required a touch of loktite, but that's the only problem. Buffers do need replacing periodically... I'm on my third one now. I'd love to have a optic like Alte Schule's photo shows. That would increase the fun factor a bunch. I buy ammo in bulk so it runs a bit over $8 a box. I generally download mags to 25 rounds. Beware the report is loud. Not .22lr loud but 9mm loud. I love my PMR30.

FWIW; Not long ago I added the carbine version, CMR30, to the collection and probably enjoy it even more. It is a total blast

And right now I can get, like new Glocks for 299 and Sig 226 for 399. Both with night sights. So the question of whether or not a pmr 30 is worth 399 may have a different answer in 2 years 4 years whenever. May have been different 4 years ago. But 399 buys a heck of a lot more now than it has in the past.

A local slaughterhouse killed cattle every day for many years with a 22 magnum rifle. A lot of guys around here use a 22 mag to kill hogs too. I'm not going by the chrono or gel. I've seen the terminal performance on animals from crow to deer, and unfortunately, on humans as well, including one of grandparents. The magnum has been around long enough to prove its worth. I dont like the round, but only because accuracy and lackluster trajectory compared to 17 hmr. And it price compared to the 22 lr
In a pistol I prefer the 5.7, as the gun is top notch, and accuracy is great. I stated that early on. But other than bullet construction, and with factory ammo your fairly limited in 5.7, I see little difference. Two non-expanding bullets of the same weight and diameter going the same speed just aren't going to perform much different.

ETA. About the time I bought my pmr for 400 a sig 226 or 220 was 750ish used in VG condition. I know because I drove 2.5 hours to get one for that I found online after looking for a while, and that's where I bought the pmr.

I've had a PMR-30 for about two years, now. I was on a waiting list for a long time, and paid about $440 for mine.

I don't shoot as much as I used to, so have only put maybe 700-800 rounds through it.

• I've had ONE .22 WMR round that didn't fire so far, so reliability of the .22 magnum ammo, at least for me, isn't that much different than some of the cheaper center-fire ammo over the years, and it's proven to be quite a bit more reliable than most of the .22lr I've used.

• The .22 magnum round is MORE costly, but higher costs don't keep me from firing 9mm or .45 when all I'm doing is putting holes in paper, so I don't really understand the complaints about .22 magnum being more costly. (At the range, its about fun and improving skills, not cost effectiveness.)

The PMR-30 itself seems to be pretty reliable. And VERY accurate. And light. And once I learned to load the magazines -- I finally read and followed the manual instructions -- I've had no feed problems. It came from the factory with a surprisingly crisp and light trigger. My PMR-30 would NEVER by my carry weapon of choice, but I'd probably grab it before a different .22, and the Hornady Critical Defense competes very favorably with some .380 ammo in terms of gel performance.

There are some .22 magnum rounds NOT recommended by Kel-Tec. I've been using Winchester and Hornady Critical Defense (which has been designed for shorter barrels) without problems. Except for the Winchester, which I got at a good price, I try to avoid .22 magnum ammo intended for longer barrels; the fireball is big enough when shooting the stuff designed for short barrels.


My wife wanted to shoot some, but had a hard time with recoil and with racking the slide with most guns. She can rack the slide on the PMR-30, and while it's loud, the absence of recoil is a plus for her. She wanted a gun SHE could use if ever I'm away for a while and she felt the need to have a gun she could use in the house, and she's still learning to shoot it.


As someone else noted, you can get a Ruger Single Six with two cylinders in the same price range. A Single Six with both cylinders was the first handgun I ever bought, back in the early 1960s, while stationed in remote Alaska in the USAF. While it is a fine weapon, the Single Six is NOT as much fun or as easy to shoot well as the PRM-30.

Definitely worth the money, whether or not its your cup of tea. .22 mag is only expensive if you buy it expecting it to be as cheap as .22 LR, .22 mag is cheaper than most 9mm and any .25, .32, .45, you name it. The PMR30 is a good reliable pistol, the trigger is genuinely nice, and the fiber optic sights are a nice touch. And the .22 mag isn't as drastically far from 5.7's ballistics as you would normally think, probably a bit more punch than a .22 LR out of a rifle...



But, its still a range toy with an uncomfortably long grip and magazines that are somewhat difficult to load all 30 into(no surprise there...), I just bought it because I wanted a pistol with a 30 round magazine.

ttarp said:

Definitely worth the money, whether or not its your cup of tea. .22 mag is only expensive if you buy it expecting it to be as cheap as .22 LR, .22 mag is cheaper than most 9mm and any .25, .32, .45, you name it. The PMR30 is a good reliable pistol, the trigger is genuinely nice, and the fiber optic sights are a nice touch. And the .22 mag isn't as drastically far from 5.7's ballistics as you would normally think, probably a bit more punch than a .22 LR out of a rifle...



But, its still a range toy with an uncomfortably long grip and magazines that are somewhat difficult to load all 30 into(no surprise there...), I just bought it because I wanted a pistol with a 30 round magazine.

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On ammoseek the price difference between .22 Mag and 9mm is about $0.01 per round.

I can reload 9mm for $5/100. Walmart has a 50 box of 9mm for $8. .22 Mag is more like $12

I paid $350 for mine back around 2012, don't regret the purchase at all. Very fun pistol. Unfortunately, it doesn't play nice with suppressors, but neither do revolvers, and I still enjoy them.

Texas10mm said:

IMHO no. .22 Mag out of a pistol length barrel is equal to .22 LR out of a rifle barrel.

.22 Mag ammo is 5-10X more expensive than .22 LR and more expensive than 9mm.

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.25 ACP, .32 ACP, .380 ACP, .38 Spl and a number of other rounds are also less powerful more expensive than 9mm, people still buy that ammo. Lowest possible cost or best cost/power ratio isn't always the primary driving factor in our decisions. My .25-20 is far more expensive to shoot than 5.56; even without considering brass cost, I'm at $0.30/rd with Hornady 60 gr. bullets, and it has less than half the energy of .223. I still enjoy the heck out of it.

MachIVshooter said:

.25 ACP, .32 ACP, .380 ACP, .38 Spl and a number of other rounds are also less powerful more expensive than 9mm, people still buy that ammo. Lowest possible cost or best cost/power ratio isn't always the primary driving factor in our decisions.

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It's largely the driving factor tho, for every 10 boxes of 9mm I see at the range in the garbage bin, I see one box of .40 or .45. When the ammo costs half as much as comparable calibers, it's got an advantage.

In fact, it's one of the reasons after buying .40's that I've started getting 9mm's. It's nice having both, 9mm is cheap in non-panic times, and .40 is available and the same price whether it's a panic or not.

The .25 and .32's and .380's are available in much smaller guns than the PMR, the .38 is still a great option in revolvers and with better triggers. In revolvers, most .22 Mags are limited to 6 shot cylinders, there are a few 8 or 9 shot ones, sure, but they're not common, however you can get .38 in a 5 or 6 shot revolver, so there's no real capacity increase there, not too mention that .38 is more reliable.

TTv2 said:

It's largely the driving factor tho, for every 10 boxes of 9mm I see at the range in the garbage bin, I see one box of .40 or .45. When the ammo costs half as much as comparable calibers, it's got an advantage.

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It may be a driving factor for you and a lot of folks, but it's not really a driving factor for all of us, as can be seen by the response posted here, thus far.

9mm is not a bad choice for a person who is buying his or her first home/self-defense gun, but the reason many go that route is because someone told them to start there, and it may have been a family member, a friend, or a salesman at the gun shop.

I'm not even sure that the cost of ammo is all that important to many of these folks -- they're just shooting what the gun someone talked them into buying uses. A lot of the boxes you see in the garbage at the range were bought at the range -- where the buyer will pay maybe 2-3 times the Walmart price for a box of 9mm ammo. Anyone who buys his or her ammo at the range -- and many do -- isn't really all that concerned about the cost of ammo.

While shooting .22lr is a lot less expensive than shooting 9mm, I shoot a lot more 9mm than I do .22lr. I also shoot a good bit more .22 WMR, .40, .45 ACP and 45 GAP than I shoot .22.

GBExpat said:

From everything that I have read about them, my opinion is that they are worth ~$400.

That said, I do not have one because they fire rimfire ammo and I have a little rule for myself that, aside from .22LR, I must be able to easily reload all cartridge flavors that I add to my stable.

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Well there are reloading set-ups for 22LR and 22 WMR, the "easily" part i'm not sure of.