Super Inconsistent Groups

Turkeytider said:
I wonder what % of the time problems are blamed on equipment when in reality it`s not being used properly that`s causing the issue?
Click to expand...

There are systemic steps of triage to determine potential root causes, and a simple clearance of "how do you shoot with other rifles in the same conditions?" has already been cleared:

TheClasonater said:
This morning, at the range, my other 308 was under an inch at a 100 in 8 shots, and that was only because I wiffed the last one. This one though, two shots three or four inches high and to the left, next two... three or four inches low and to the right.
Click to expand...
 
Oh, you use a scope.

At age 68 I struggle some with aperture iron sights — only with some guns— with a 200-yard, 10” x 12” gong.

Never owned a scope.

If somebody is there to “spot” for me, it’s the only way to know whether the Misses go low, high, left, right or All of the Above.
Unless every part of the ground visible Around the gong is very dusty, it’s almost impossible to spot the Missed shots by a gong.
 
Ignition Override said:
Oh, you use a scope.

At age 68 I struggle some with aperture iron sights — only with some guns— with a 200-yard, 10” x 12” gong.

Never owned a scope.

If somebody is there to “spot” for me, it’s the only way to know whether the Misses go low, high, left, right or All of the Above.
Unless every part of the ground visible Around the gong is very dusty, it’s almost impossible to spot the Missed shots by a gong.
Click to expand...
Ya rub it in, you must have eaten a lot of carrots. I try but must experiment with target color. Only with garands
 
A walnut stock with a non free floated barrel is a recipe for disaster. I've been there - done that. What you are describing are the exact results of uneven pressure in the barrel channel.
 
Like everyone else scope and everything that is between scope and rifle.

I don't think that rifle comes with irons, so I think you are out of luck there. If it came with a mount from ruger loose that as well.

Storytime.

Years ago I bought a CZ 223 bolt rifle and a bushnell scope from the outlet. It had one of those warranties that if I drive over the thing they will replace it, so I figured ok. It was also air gun rated so I could stick it on my heavy spring air guns....so I did it.

My rifle printed like you describe. Finally and I have no idea why it took so long I pulled the scope and shot it with irons. Improvement right away. After checking mounts and everything else I sent it back in.

Well krud......now I need another scope, I really want glass on this rifle. The outlet mailed it back for me free so I was looking at their super cheap scopes and grabbed a Tasco for like $20.

Fastforward 10 years later and that Tasco is still on the 223 and the "good" scope is on an RWS 48.

On the other hand it is a ruger.
 
TheClasonater said:
This one though, two shots three or four inches high and to the left, next two... three or four inches low and to the right.
Click to expand...

The way the POI is jumping around, I'd guess the scope and/or mounts are your problem. If the mount isn't loose I'd try another scope.
 
Dayum.... wasn't expecting this much traffic. Been a great read so far. I appreciate everyone's attentiveness to my problem. Here's where I'm at:

Was gonna just re torque everything, load up a test batch, and test again. Then, thought, nah, never been through the entire rifle so what the hell.....

First, the rings were tight but the scope screws had started working out, I torqued em down last week!!!

After that, removed the barreled action and no bedding. Upon further inspection, two things jumped out at me. 1.) There is rust where the lugs lock up. Promptly pulled every gun out of the safe to ensure that rusting isn't a problem. I have been extremely OCD about rust because we have recently moved from western CO to Alabama. My safe is literally full of big dessicant packets and a rod. After my pulse slowed when I found no other rust on or in anything else, I checked the action again. Its a scaly rust and has been there for a long time. The rifle was purchased at a pawn shop in Salida CO many moons ago.... I found the receipt in the box of paperwork I got with it. Getting the idea that the family member that I inherited it from purchased it because it was probably a good deal, and that there is a reason it was at a pawn shop. Not saying the rifle was neglected in total, but starting to get a picture in my mind of its life.

Second, the underside of the barrel has a scuff in the bluing where it was contacting the stock. A small rub mark, but there nonetheless.

So ya, got some work ahead of me. Its still a nice looking rifle regardless of the hidden rust, and it will be a nice platform to learn some things on. I've never bedded a rifle before and I really really really like the lines and the feel of it, so it will stay around. The scope though.... it'll get a new one when its time.
 
You have already been told about everything possible to do to it. Personally I would change out the scope first while checking all the mounting screws for tightness and proceed from there because it is the easiest thing to do and if it is the problem anything else you do isn't going to to work until the scope is taken care of.. At least no one told you what I was told on another forum when complaining about the quality and lack of accuracy after all the things I had tried with a Handi-rifle years ago. It was that I just didn't know how to shoot although I had given examples of other rifles that proved I did.
 
The OP is having bullet impacts up to 6 inches apart. I have never seen anything other than a scope cause that kind of wackiness when a decent shooter is at the trigger. Fortunately a scope is super easy to switch out.
 
dranrab said:
The OP is having bullet impacts up to 6 inches apart. I have never seen anything other than a scope cause that kind of wackiness when a decent shooter is at the trigger. Fortunately a scope is super easy to switch out.
Click to expand...
My thinking exactly. Even a terrible bedding job, or a forend that slaps the barrel on every shot, won't be enough to cause that kind of trouble.
 
dranrab said:
The OP is having bullet impacts up to 6 inches apart. I have never seen anything other than a scope cause that kind of wackiness when a decent shooter is at the trigger. Fortunately a scope is super easy to switch out.
Click to expand...
I agree. If it were something to do with the barrel channel the shots would "walk" in some direction, and I've never had an action bedding problem scatter the shots that much.
TheClasonater said:
Hi all- I normally post down in the handloading section, but I have a quandry. I shoot 4-5 rifles consistently that I have handloaded and found accurate loads for. The sixth though, is becoming a point of frustration. It's a 308 and regardless of the bullet, powder, and day, I can't shoot a consistent group. Now, I ain't no precision benchrest thousand yard shooter, just a recreational shooter that enjoys rifles. This morning, at the range, my other 308 was under an inch at a 100 in 8 shots, and that was only because I wiffed the last one. This one though, two shots three or four inches high and to the left, next two... three or four inches low and to the right. That erratic nature happens whether it's 150, 165, or 180 grain boolits. It's been that way for a couple months now, and, although I handload for fun and like shooting, I am starting to see red and don't wanna expend more powder and bullets on this rifle. Where do you all start trouble shooting when you run into this??? What say ye?

For reference: the Rifle is bone Stock with unknown rounds (inherited, but in really great condition)
Ruger Hawkeye Hunter .308
Walnut Stock
Cabela's 4-20 5X scope
Click to expand...
I've been doing some digging in my mounts and parts cans and found something that might solve your problem. I have a new-old stock set of Redfield rings for Ruger that might fit better. They're medium height.

Would you like to try them?
 
dranrab said:
The OP is having bullet impacts up to 6 inches apart. I have never seen anything other than a scope cause that kind of wackiness when a decent shooter is at the trigger. Fortunately a scope is super easy to switch out.
Click to expand...
That would have been a good group with the Handi-rifle I mentioned. Absolutely the most inaccurate rifle I have ever owned. Groups about the size of dinner plates at 100 yards despite everything I did.
 
I too had a handi-rifle that did that! It was a .243win.
I wanted to like that rifle, but 10-12” groups at 100yds doesn’t cut it. I tried different loads, factory ammo, different scopes. Nothing…

I would also “suspect” the barrel. I’ve seen several Rugers “escape” the factory that were stinkers. Even had one myself. It was a 77/22 Carbine in .22Hornet. It had a badly cut chamber. Waay over sized and not concentric with the bore. It shot shotgun patterns.
I now have a 77/22Hornet KBZ (stainless bull bbl, laminated stock) that has bolt issues (2-piece bolt with 0.10” slop) that I correct with a c-shaped piece of wire as a shim). But, with loads it likes is 1”@100yds. My other Rugers (.375R, and 7x57 shoot just fine).

Back in the early’80’s, a gunsmith friend ordered a Ruger M77 for a planned Alaska hunt. The rifle shot terrible. He even sent it back to Ruger who tested it and said it met their standards with factory test ammo (5” @100yds..)
He promptly ordered an E.R.Shaw barrel that he installed. Voila, it shot 5-shots touching on first group…
 
These are all great points! Haven't been in the garage in a couple days. Gonna get her cleaned up and give more attention to the stock.
 
TheClasonater said:
Hi all- I normally post down in the handloading section, but I have a quandry. I shoot 4-5 rifles consistently that I have handloaded and found accurate loads for. The sixth though, is becoming a point of frustration. It's a 308 and regardless of the bullet, powder, and day, I can't shoot a consistent group. Now, I ain't no precision benchrest thousand yard shooter, just a recreational shooter that enjoys rifles. This morning, at the range, my other 308 was under an inch at a 100 in 8 shots, and that was only because I wiffed the last one. This one though, two shots three or four inches high and to the left, next two... three or four inches low and to the right. That erratic nature happens whether it's 150, 165, or 180 grain boolits. It's been that way for a couple months now, and, although I handload for fun and like shooting, I am starting to see red and don't wanna expend more powder and bullets on this rifle. Where do you all start trouble shooting when you run into this??? What say ye?

For reference: the Rifle is bone Stock with unknown rounds (inherited, but in really great condition)
Ruger Hawkeye Hunter .308
Walnut Stock
Cabela's 4-20 5X scope
Click to expand...
Have you considered the scope might be bad?
 
I would purchase an inexpensive bore scope and check the condition of the lands, grooves and degree of buildup of carbon and copper. Your bore may be pitted to the point that it can't hold a group any longer. It might be pristine, but you will not know without looking. I also recommend getting the ad-on kit that has the different caliber mirrors for 22-45 calibers. Obviously, all the other tips and tricks are excellent and may very well produce the results you are looking for.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

W
  • Locked
Odd grouping
Replies
16
Views
819
adelbridge
A
D
  • Locked
PC 9 problems
Replies
7
Views
615
rantingredneck
R
B
  • Locked
Remington 700 New Stock??
Replies
3
Views
277
b7tac
B
J
  • Locked
Size Matters (group size, that is)
Replies
19
Views
935
ReadyontheRight
R
U
  • Locked
Strange grouping with my Ruger Ultralight .257 Rob?
2
Replies
25
Views
2K
ole farmerbuck
O
Back
Top