how much trouble am I in?

Making a Federal Case out of it

ALL federal property falls under this regulation---
....including the Post Office and National Parks!!

(to think a portion of the Constitution does not apply on Federal property- of all places!!)

You definately need to see what statute number(s) your being charged under. Unless they are planning on charging you with whatever will stick, whatever that may be. Any way you look at it, you need to lawyer-up, buddy.

Are there services available for low/no income folks? Legal Aide or something along that line? (Utter ignorance questions there. DUH...)

Anyhow, I'll be bugging the court system on monday,

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The court system is too late to find out what you got cited for. The only time they let you "explain" anything is while you are making a plea bargain. Judges don't have time to listen to everyones BS reason for running a red light or forgetting to get insurance. You will be a nameless face in the crowd and will probably get no airtime. Good luck, but you really should have found out what you were cited with ahead of time rather than wondering the evening before your court date.

sadly, there are no legal services for this sort of situation.

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What state are you in?

Don't agree or cop to anything until you have spoken with a lawyer who has your best interest at heart (next to making a buck).

If it was me I would ask for a continuance so that you could acquire counsel, at least you can research your options further.

If it was me I would ask for a continuance so that you could acquire counsel, at least you can research your options further.

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It might be too late. Generally you acquire counsel and then are automatically issued a different court date when they are notified you have an attorney.

I could be wrong, but in about every state I'm pretty sure there are groups of lawyers who help people with no/low income, regardless of the charges...failing that, they generally have to supply you with one (generally a public defender, not the greatest often times but better than nothing).

I don't know, obviously, exactly what law you're being charged under, but this is a law I found governing weapons on federal property, I will bold some words I think are important to you if this is the law:

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 44 > § 930 Prev | Next

§ 930. Possession of firearms and dangerous weapons in Federal facilities



(a) Except as provided in subsection (d), whoever knowingly possesses or causes to be present a firearm or other dangerous weapon in a Federal facility (other than a Federal court facility), or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 1 year, or both. (b) Whoever, with intent that a firearm or other dangerous weapon be used in the commission of a crime, knowingly possesses or causes to be present such firearm or dangerous weapon in a Federal facility, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 5 years, or both.
(c) A person who kills any person in the course of a violation of subsection (a) or (b), or in the course of an attack on a Federal facility involving the use of a firearm or other dangerous weapon, or attempts or conspires to do such an act, shall be punished as provided in sections 1111, 1112, 1113, and 1117.
(d) Subsection (a) shall not apply to—
(1) the lawful performance of official duties by an officer, agent, or employee of the United States, a State, or a political subdivision thereof, who is authorized by law to engage in or supervise the prevention, detection, investigation, or prosecution of any violation of law;
(2) the possession of a firearm or other dangerous weapon by a Federal official or a member of the Armed Forces if such possession is authorized by law; or
(3) the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful purposes.
(e)
(1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), whoever knowingly possesses or causes to be present a firearm in a Federal court facility, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title, imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both.
(2) Paragraph (1) shall not apply to conduct which is described in paragraph (1) or (2) of subsection (d).
(f) Nothing in this section limits the power of a court of the United States to punish for contempt or to promulgate rules or orders regulating, restricting, or prohibiting the possession of weapons within any building housing such court or any of its proceedings, or upon any grounds appurtenant to such building.
(g) As used in this section:
(1) The term “Federal facility” means a building or part thereof owned or leased by the Federal Government, where Federal employees are regularly present for the purpose of performing their official duties.
(2) The term “dangerous weapon” means a weapon, device, instrument, material, or substance, animate or inanimate, that is used for, or is readily capable of, causing death or serious bodily injury, except that such term does not include a pocket knife with a blade of less than 21/2 inches in length.
(3) The term “Federal court facility” means the courtroom, judges’ chambers, witness rooms, jury deliberation rooms, attorney conference rooms, prisoner holding cells, offices of the court clerks, the United States attorney, and the United States marshal, probation and parole offices, and adjoining corridors of any court of the United States.
(h) Notice of the provisions of subsections (a) and (b) shall be posted conspicuously at each public entrance to each Federal facility, and notice of subsection (e) shall be posted conspicuously at each public entrance to each Federal court facility, and no person shall be convicted of an offense under subsection (a) or (e) with respect to a Federal facility if such notice is not so posted at such facility, unless such person had actual notice of subsection (a) or (e), as the case may be.

Never try to get specific legal advice off the internet!

Yep, internet legal advice tends to be all over the board, and not very good often times. Like I said, get a lawyer, any lawyer, for help, you need it. Even if you don't lose your gun rights, up to a year in jail or heavy fines are nothing nice either...

I would just sit tight. Try getting an attorney on retainer, which will also give you the opportunity to talk it over with him or her.

Note that the law bans owning/buying a gun if you have been convicted of a crime punishable by "imprisonment for a term EXCEEDING one year." The law AntiqueCollector quotes says "imprisonment for not more than one year." So, even if you are convicted on that charge, you will still be able to own and buy guns.

I don't know what the criteria is on issuing an FFL, but if you are convicted, even if only fined, or placed on probation, write (not call) BATFE and tell them. It may make no difference, but trying to conceal the conviction will only result in more trouble.

Jim

Well, I think the most important parts are actually the "knowingly" part (he says he didn't know he had it with him until it was too late) and the exceptions, in the statement "the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful purposes."

If he can lawfully carry the firearm concealed in his state, it could be argued it was lawful. This has been debated to death though, in the issue of post office carrying, and I'd not want to be a test for this, but it'd be worth a shot at it at this point, if necessary.

The other thing is a technicality, whether or not all the subsections were listed on a sign as required by the law, but I suspect they were, and the best argument here is to show it was not brought in knowingly, was not brought in with the intent to do anything wrong, and under the exceptions listed, was a "lawful" purpose in his state. Though, you are correct that if the gun was in the car in the parking lot, it may not count as federal property depending on the facility and where the parking lot is located (is it shared by other people/buildings than the feds?), besides the obvious fact it's his car.

But I'm not a lawyer, I just read the law some to understand it and almost as a hobby too, and in a case like this, a real lawyer is needed! This may get dismissed in court or brought down to a miniscule fine or such without endangering your firearms rights, but then again, it may not...get a lawyer now.

RogueTek, hit El Tejon with a PM, he's a lawyer and may help. Secondly, if you can't affoerd an attorney they will have to appoint a public defender which is better than nothing.
Thirdly, read what Antiquecollector was nice enough to post. Particularly in a federal facility. While having loaded mag in a federal building is not good it is not a firearrm, and the firearm was in the car in the parking lot not in the facility. Also, was the ticket written by local PD on federal property or feds?

Might check with the NRA if you are a member, though they might also provide legal counsel for others, also check JPFO amd Second Amendment org. for options.

Rogue, even if you think you can't afford a Lawyer....you can't afford NOT to get a good one.

Your future is potentially at risk...I don't mean to scare you but you MUST GET A GREAT LAWYER.

Contact SAF and the NRA for suggestions.

http://www.saf.org/default.asp?p=saf_faq

10. I need a referral to an attorney who can help me maintain my rights; can SAF help?

Since it is impossible for any organization to fund every legal challenge it is asked to support, the Foundation maintains an attorney referral service with a network of attorneys who specialize in firearms cases. This makes it possible for people who seek legal counsel to have access to attorneys in their state who are able and willing to handle firearms-related cases.

Second Amendment Foundation 425-454-7012

I'm not trying to hijack the thread.

When I was going to the San Jose VA clinic, my doc specificaly told me not to bring guns or knives over 3" even into the parking lot. She said they do random searches and don't need a warrant. I about crapped myself because I had hit the range before my group meeting. Maybe the rules change from hospital to hospital?

Never allow a search. Just because they want to search does not mean that they will ever get the search warrant.

Sounds penny ante to me anyway.

You should have told them no.

Do you want to pay a big fine, go to jail, and never get your FFL? No? Then get a lawyer. Those really are your only two probable choices. You will not qualify for a court appointed lawyer, and you will lose if you go pro se. Call your state bar's lawyer referral service first thing Monday morning. You may or may not have commited a crime. But without a lawyer, things will not go your way.

Sadly no. I dont have any specific violation number.

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That's a procedural error on their part, and it may prove to be your salvation. An accused must be informed of the charges in order to defend against them. You can't look up the actual text of the law under which you were charged if they didn't write down the citation.

With the disclaimer that I am not a lawyer, I would be tempted to NOT ask for specifics, but to go into court (if you have to defend yourself) and move for dismissal on the grounds that you cannot answer to charges when you have not been informed as to what law you are supposed to have violated. The worst that can happen is the judge may continue the case to allow the police to look up the citation and revise the charge, which gives you more time to do your homework.

I happen to be going to my VA hospital in the morning. I'll make a point of stopping by the p;oice office to ask for confirmation/clarification.

Well, I think the most important parts are actually the "knowingly" part (he says he didn't know he had it with him until it was too late) and the exceptions, in the statement "the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful purposes."

If he can lawfully carry the firearm concealed in his state, it could be argued it was lawful. This has been debated to death though, in the issue of post office carrying, and I'd not want to be a test for this, but it'd be worth a shot at it at this point, if necessary.

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The argument gets by-passed for the Post Office, though, because another section of the US Code exempts the Postal Service from this Section. But I don't believe the Veterans Administration is exempted, so "other lawful purposes" may be sufficient.

Sorry for the slight hijack, but would you please enlighten me regarding

If he can lawfully carry the firearm concealed in his state, it could be argued it was lawful. This has been debated to death though, in the issue of post office carrying, and I'd not want to be a test for this, but it'd be worth a shot at it at this point, if necessary.

The argument gets by-passed for the Post Office, though, because another section of the US Code exempts the Postal Service from this Section. But I don't believe the Veterans Administration is exempted, so "other lawful purposes" may be sufficient.

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I have never before heard this and would like to read the USC you refer to.

Thanks.

stay safe.

skidmark

Never allow a search. Just because they want to search does not mean that they will ever get the search warrant.

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They don't always need a warrant, as entry onto a federal facility is often considered consent to having your belongings searched while on the property. Many facilities are posted to that effect.

My gut tells me you are going to be okay. But, as others have said, get a competent lawyer. Unless the judge is a real hardcore asshat, he or she should see this as a no malicious intent, lapse of judgement thing.

Good luck, and let us know what happens.

K

I have never before heard this and would like to read the USC you refer to.

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I posted the law above, and bolded the important sections. It gives as an exception "the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful purposes."

Exactly if concealed carry goes under "other lawful purposes" is debated though. I think there's a very strong argument that it does, but of course, the feds don't like people carrying guns so they will argue against it I'm sure.

Exactly if concealed carry goes under "other lawful purposes" is debated though. I think there's a very strong argument that it does, but of course, the feds don't like people carrying guns so they will argue against it I'm sure.

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Lawful purposes tends to refer to demonstrations, training, marksmanship courses or contests, etc. The agencies generally don't interpret it as covering concealed carry.