Concealed Carry Revolvers
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jogar80
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I think a Judge as mentioned earlier, would fit your purposes perfectly.
Does anyone else agree about the Judge?
It does cover alot of bases. I just aquired one w/ a 3" chamber and 3"brl very cheap, so I took a chance.
A tad big for CC, and will it stop a black bear?
Judge clearly not one for hunting deer, unless they are w/i 10 yards.
Recommendations of how to cc that?
How much smaller/easier to cc would a 4"brl sp101 357 be? That seems like the best bet to cover all needs.
Would a 3" brl sp101 357 be remotely reasonable for deer, or any better than Judge for that?
Judge still could put alot of lead out w/ 3"410 shot and 45LC, and certainly good as close quarters personal defense against... anything really.
It does cover alot of bases. I just aquired one w/ a 3" chamber and 3"brl very cheap, so I took a chance.
A tad big for CC, and will it stop a black bear?
Judge clearly not one for hunting deer, unless they are w/i 10 yards.
Recommendations of how to cc that?
How much smaller/easier to cc would a 4"brl sp101 357 be? That seems like the best bet to cover all needs.
Would a 3" brl sp101 357 be remotely reasonable for deer, or any better than Judge for that?
Judge still could put alot of lead out w/ 3"410 shot and 45LC, and certainly good as close quarters personal defense against... anything really.
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sixgunner455
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You already have a .44 Magnum. Hunt deer and bears with that, not with a CC .38 or .357. If you want your CC .357 to be a good trail gun, get the 3" SP101. You could certainly shoot a deer with it, and it would certainly kill it within reasonable range. I have killed a deer with a small little pocket 9mm, after all, but it wasn't hunting. It was a head shot to put down a crippled deer at about 10-15'.
But when you go out deliberately to hunt, carry a hunting revolver. It's much easier to make a clean kill that way.
I don't like the Judge. I have friends that have them and love them. I just can't get around all that cylinder length if I'm going to have it loaded with .45 Colt - what a waste of steel. And I can't really consider .410 to be a very good defense load, as I've seen it's non-performance as a rabbit hunting shotgun.
I usually pocket carry a S&W 642 for personal defense in the small town I live in. In the mountains, where we have small black bears and lions, I belt carry a S&W 13-3, 3", loaded with heavy, wide-flat nosed .357 loads going over 1100fps. I use the same gun as my hunting backup revolver - which is for putting down crippled game at close range without blowing up a head. When I go to the city, I usually carry a full-sized 9mm with a big magazine and a spare on the belt, if the weather allows it, or if it's really hot, just run that same 642.
Use the right tool for the job. You've got framing hammers, ball peen hammers, sledge hammers, big screwdrivers, little screwdrivers, files, chisels, knives, saws of various descriptions, wrenches and sockets and so forth because each does the job it's designed for better than any other tool can be made to try to do that job.
In the same way, no one gun is going to be able to do all the jobs that you seem to require. You want a CC personal defense pistol. You want a trail pistol for close-in defense against black bears. You want a deer hunting pistol.
I see that as needing at least two, and preferably three: a pocket revolver, a light belt gun, and a heavier belt gun. You could get away with having two - the pocket revolver and whichever belt gun you decide to go with.
Which .44 Magnum do you have? Your trail gun issues may be already fixed, just with that. Certainly, unless it's a weird snubby .44, your hunting needs should be.
But when you go out deliberately to hunt, carry a hunting revolver. It's much easier to make a clean kill that way.
I don't like the Judge. I have friends that have them and love them. I just can't get around all that cylinder length if I'm going to have it loaded with .45 Colt - what a waste of steel. And I can't really consider .410 to be a very good defense load, as I've seen it's non-performance as a rabbit hunting shotgun.
I usually pocket carry a S&W 642 for personal defense in the small town I live in. In the mountains, where we have small black bears and lions, I belt carry a S&W 13-3, 3", loaded with heavy, wide-flat nosed .357 loads going over 1100fps. I use the same gun as my hunting backup revolver - which is for putting down crippled game at close range without blowing up a head. When I go to the city, I usually carry a full-sized 9mm with a big magazine and a spare on the belt, if the weather allows it, or if it's really hot, just run that same 642.
Use the right tool for the job. You've got framing hammers, ball peen hammers, sledge hammers, big screwdrivers, little screwdrivers, files, chisels, knives, saws of various descriptions, wrenches and sockets and so forth because each does the job it's designed for better than any other tool can be made to try to do that job.
In the same way, no one gun is going to be able to do all the jobs that you seem to require. You want a CC personal defense pistol. You want a trail pistol for close-in defense against black bears. You want a deer hunting pistol.
I see that as needing at least two, and preferably three: a pocket revolver, a light belt gun, and a heavier belt gun. You could get away with having two - the pocket revolver and whichever belt gun you decide to go with.
Which .44 Magnum do you have? Your trail gun issues may be already fixed, just with that. Certainly, unless it's a weird snubby .44, your hunting needs should be.
Stainz
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Generally man and bear guns are not in the same category especially when talking concealed carry unless you want to carry a large gun concealed. If you are serious about being able to put down both man and beast I personally suggest a caliber that begins with four, like .44 or .45. Realistically two legged critters are probably your biggest concern and for that any .357 will do. Snake shot is available in most calibers.
IMO, the SP101 is easier to shoot in .357 than a S&W of the same caliber in a J-frame.
IMO, the SP101 is easier to shoot in .357 than a S&W of the same caliber in a J-frame.
I get the point about multiple guns, but need to economize, and I still have a wife who is not "gun-ho", so I'm really trying to get the best fit w/ 1.
Leaning towards sp 101 357. How much of a pain would that be to CC w/ a 4" barrel?
That would fit all needs.
Others include CA Bulldog, or SW 642 in 44sp (and I would like to hear more about those, but I seriously doubt I could take a deer over 20 yrds w/ those)
My go to hunting pistol is the SBH in 44Mag., 7.5" brl w/ scope.
I only carry that when I am specifically pistol hunting.
The idea of the trail gun w/ CC potential is for when camping near blackbear, and bow hunting, or to add challenge when rifle hunting, and get a shot under 50yrds, that I could try w/ iron sights.
Ideally, a 3" brl sp 101 357 would work, and would be great CC, but I don't know if you could reasonably take a deer with that. ???
Advice?
Leaning towards sp 101 357. How much of a pain would that be to CC w/ a 4" barrel?
That would fit all needs.
Others include CA Bulldog, or SW 642 in 44sp (and I would like to hear more about those, but I seriously doubt I could take a deer over 20 yrds w/ those)
My go to hunting pistol is the SBH in 44Mag., 7.5" brl w/ scope.
I only carry that when I am specifically pistol hunting.
The idea of the trail gun w/ CC potential is for when camping near blackbear, and bow hunting, or to add challenge when rifle hunting, and get a shot under 50yrds, that I could try w/ iron sights.
Ideally, a 3" brl sp 101 357 would work, and would be great CC, but I don't know if you could reasonably take a deer with that. ???
Advice?
788Ham
Member
Huntolive,
Read post #55, I think this answers all your questions. I have an SP 101, .357 3" barrel for CCW, I also have a 6" 629 if I want to chase bears, different revolvers, different uses! For CCW uses, the SP 101 will take care of everything you'll need, plenty of power. On my 101, I've gotten Hogue grips installed, easier shooting the stiff .357 rounds, trigger guard doesn't bite like the original grips allowed it to. I don't feel for CCW carrying, you'd need much more than this, unless total devastation is what you're after.
Read post #55, I think this answers all your questions. I have an SP 101, .357 3" barrel for CCW, I also have a 6" 629 if I want to chase bears, different revolvers, different uses! For CCW uses, the SP 101 will take care of everything you'll need, plenty of power. On my 101, I've gotten Hogue grips installed, easier shooting the stiff .357 rounds, trigger guard doesn't bite like the original grips allowed it to. I don't feel for CCW carrying, you'd need much more than this, unless total devastation is what you're after.
I really feel like most of your questions have been asked and answered several times already. Remember that there are very few solid "yes" or "no" questions in the gun world. There are lots of things guns can do in a pinch. It doesn't mean they are good at it. If I had to, I could use a .243 bolt gun for HD. Would it kill an intruder? You'd bet. But does that make it a good HD gun? I would say no. but as always, there are shades of grey.
You really need to shoot some of these guns and get a feel for what YOU are comfortable using them for. I would also recommend researching ballistics charts, looking at test results, etc...
For me, personally, I would not want to try hunting deer with a 3" SP101. If I were hunting deer I'd want a 4"-6" bbl and adjustable sights. But you need to go see what works for you rather than basing your opinions on the opinions of strangers on the internet. I applaud you for asking questions. It's a great way to learn. But if you have the opportunity, try getting first hand experience.
Barrels aren't so much of an issue... the grip usually gives the gun away.
Just for fun I occasionally CC my Colt Police Positive with a 4" barrel and it tucks away nicely and comfortably (oddly, the most comfortable holster I've found for that gun is a cheap nylon I modified for IWB carry. Just have to live with the snaps). I just have to be mindful of he grip printing.
If bears really are a issue, I'd stay at home if a SP101 .357 is all you plan to carry.
R.W.Dale
Member
When I'm carrying in a more developed setting my gun of choice is a 2" 9mm Taurus revolver
When things are more rural I carry a 5" j frame Smith in the same holster.
Surprisingly if the cover garment is up to it the 5" gun carries and conceals better since the barrel against my hip tends to push the grip closer to my body.
Up close DA snap or point shooting I'm actually more accurate with the snubby since the long barrel on the Smith tends to droop when shooting fast (yeah I need to practice) but out to 25 and even 50 yds there's no comparison in accuracy with the longer barrel and adjustable sights.
When things are more rural I carry a 5" j frame Smith in the same holster.
Surprisingly if the cover garment is up to it the 5" gun carries and conceals better since the barrel against my hip tends to push the grip closer to my body.
Up close DA snap or point shooting I'm actually more accurate with the snubby since the long barrel on the Smith tends to droop when shooting fast (yeah I need to practice) but out to 25 and even 50 yds there's no comparison in accuracy with the longer barrel and adjustable sights.
Cocked & Locked
Member
Exactly!
4895
Member
SP101 has handled loads of 22.0 grains of H110 and 125 grain XTP's and 125 grain Rem SJHP with style. I wouldn't recommend them for bear country, but it beats poking them with a stick.
Taurus makes a .44 special 5 shot airweight pistol. Model 445 I think, and you can find them starting about $360.
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/75407-1.html
A .44 special is nothing to sneeze at and I think would easily take down a black bear and not punish your hand in the process. Mine has less recoil than a SP101 with a heavier bullet and larger meplat.
A bit hard to conceal, but carries great IWB or cargo pocket.
Personally, I carry a Ruger GP100 4" stainless .357 magnum with snake shot and 140 grain Sierra JHC bullets and a max load of 296 in a when scouting, camping, hunting, hiking, etc. If I am concerned about bears, I carry a .44 mag.
I load the .357 Speer shot capsules with (3) #1 buckshot pellets. They fit perfectly and weigh the proper grains for load data. It shoots a 20 oz water bottle right in the center at 15 feet pretty tight. That is some snake shot!
Of course there is the JUDGE; .410 slug has some pop behind it as well.
Just remember, if you shoot a bear on accident, you better drag him into the kids tent and put a candy bar in his mouth!
Taurus makes a .44 special 5 shot airweight pistol. Model 445 I think, and you can find them starting about $360.
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/75407-1.html
A .44 special is nothing to sneeze at and I think would easily take down a black bear and not punish your hand in the process. Mine has less recoil than a SP101 with a heavier bullet and larger meplat.
A bit hard to conceal, but carries great IWB or cargo pocket.
Personally, I carry a Ruger GP100 4" stainless .357 magnum with snake shot and 140 grain Sierra JHC bullets and a max load of 296 in a when scouting, camping, hunting, hiking, etc. If I am concerned about bears, I carry a .44 mag.
I load the .357 Speer shot capsules with (3) #1 buckshot pellets. They fit perfectly and weigh the proper grains for load data. It shoots a 20 oz water bottle right in the center at 15 feet pretty tight. That is some snake shot!
Of course there is the JUDGE; .410 slug has some pop behind it as well.
Just remember, if you shoot a bear on accident, you better drag him into the kids tent and put a candy bar in his mouth!
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ArchAngelCD
Member.
I see there are a lot of SP101 fans in this thread, I'm not one of them. I like the Six-Series Ruger revolvers but not the SP101.
I am going to go in a slightly different direction, the S&W Night Guard revolvers. The M386NG is a 7 round .357 Magnum L frame and a slightly larger revolver is the 8 round .357 Magnum N frame M327NG. I think either will make a good carry revolver...
I am going to go in a slightly different direction, the S&W Night Guard revolvers. The M386NG is a 7 round .357 Magnum L frame and a slightly larger revolver is the 8 round .357 Magnum N frame M327NG. I think either will make a good carry revolver...
Thanks All!
I will go handle some of these guns.
Re: power, does the 44 special really have much more stoping power then 357 Mag?
Obviously the 44Mag does, but I thought a higher end 357 Mag load had as much force as a 44sp.
sp 101 357 is reportedly able to handle virtually any 357 Mag load.yes/no?
It seems hard to believe that this gun is not capable of stoping black bear, I am NOT talking Grizzleys, nor would I hunt any bear with it. If the 44sp snubby is that much better, then it would seem 45LC would be equally good. Right?
Reason I ask so much about the Sp101 4"brl and CC is that it has a good adjustable sight (while the 3" has a pretty crappy sight), better velocity and seems ok for deer as a challenge with open sights. Normally, pistol hunting, I would take the SBH 44mag scoped, but it would be great to have the option. I am not confident the 3" sp101 gives me that, so if it is not much harder to cc the 4"brl, I guess I would go with that.
Sure, it would be great to buy a Ruger LCR, and 2 other guns, but that's years down the road. Sincere thanks!
I will go handle some of these guns.
Re: power, does the 44 special really have much more stoping power then 357 Mag?
Obviously the 44Mag does, but I thought a higher end 357 Mag load had as much force as a 44sp.
sp 101 357 is reportedly able to handle virtually any 357 Mag load.yes/no?
It seems hard to believe that this gun is not capable of stoping black bear, I am NOT talking Grizzleys, nor would I hunt any bear with it. If the 44sp snubby is that much better, then it would seem 45LC would be equally good. Right?
Reason I ask so much about the Sp101 4"brl and CC is that it has a good adjustable sight (while the 3" has a pretty crappy sight), better velocity and seems ok for deer as a challenge with open sights. Normally, pistol hunting, I would take the SBH 44mag scoped, but it would be great to have the option. I am not confident the 3" sp101 gives me that, so if it is not much harder to cc the 4"brl, I guess I would go with that.
Sure, it would be great to buy a Ruger LCR, and 2 other guns, but that's years down the road. Sincere thanks!
Ballistics is a grey territory. Shot placement above all else, blah blah blah. In the end, no. They will both stop a person if you do your part.
It's the caliber that is marginal for black bear. Not the gun.
it does not have a crappy sight at all. It's a fixed sight. It's optimized for a different purpose than the adjustable sights, but that doesn't make it crappy at all.
tomrkba
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Your budget is a bit low for the stated purpose. Avoid Taurus due to lack of quality internal parts. S&W and Ruger revolvers can be expensive, but are the best options at this time. I prefer Ruger over S&W because they're far easier to work on.
The Ruger Alaskan in 44 Magnum will do the trick. Just add night sights and swap the stocks out.
The cartridges shown are Speer Gold Dot Short Barrel 200 grain JHP. They're tuned for self-defense. Swap the ammo out for 240 grain jacketed soft points for bear.
The Ruger Alaskan in 44 Magnum will do the trick. Just add night sights and swap the stocks out.
The cartridges shown are Speer Gold Dot Short Barrel 200 grain JHP. They're tuned for self-defense. Swap the ammo out for 240 grain jacketed soft points for bear.
In looking closely at the 4" sp101 w/ adjustable sights and exposed hammer, does that rule it out as a CC due to chance it could get caught on clothing in self defense scenario?
Should any time be spent worrying that for CC an exposed hammer (and or adjustable sights) could get caught up when drawing?
Should I only be looking at "internal" hammer designs for CC? I can't imagine that is a big thing to worry about, but some reviews have mentioned it.
Should any time be spent worrying that for CC an exposed hammer (and or adjustable sights) could get caught up when drawing?
Should I only be looking at "internal" hammer designs for CC? I can't imagine that is a big thing to worry about, but some reviews have mentioned it.
After reading your most recent comments, it seems that you are striving for that one perfect gun that meets all of your exacting requirements. In truth, that's not generally how it works. One typically doesn't use an ultra-lite CCW revolver to kill bear, and likewise one doesn't generally use his bear killing gun for CCW. Now that you've added concealed hammer to the equation, things just got a little more unrealistic. As some have said, there are guns that you can press into multiple roles, but the reality of things is that you would probably be best served by multiple guns tailored to your own specific requirements. Yes, that's a bit more expensive, but take your time, and acquire the ones that you need most, first. Pick up others as you can. Enjoy the process.
If you're absolutely set on a CCW, bear/snake revolver, the 3in S101 probably comes closest to an all purpose gun for the purposes you've mentioned. Get the hammer bobbed if you are worried about it, but most wouldn't consider it a pocket gun. Adjustable sights aren't ideal on a CCW gun, and the fixed sights of the 3in model aren't ideal on a hunting gun; but if CCW were more likely going to be the main purpose of the gun, than the fixed sights would probably serve most useful.
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Samari Jack
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With my skinny body, living in the steamy South, I'd have to have two and padded shoulder holsters to conceal these for CCW. My Dolly Pardon disguise.
sgt127
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You have some pretty difficult criteria for what you want to do;
Light weight.
Compact.
Shootable.
Accurate.
Lots of energy.
Acurate to 50 yards.
Good for pissed off mid sized bears.
Easy to carry.
concealable.
Honestly, I don't think there is one gun that meets all those points.
If its lightweight, its going to be a bitch to shoot with rounds that can stop a bear.
If its easy to conceal, Its not going to have the sight radius and sights big enough to shoot at 50 yards.
I suppose a 3-4 inch K frame .357 Magnum would be about as close as you can get. A three inch SP101 is a great gun, making good hits out to 50 yards is going to be very tough.
For bears, even medium sized bears, I would not feel comfortable until we get into the .41 Magnum-.44 Magnum-.454 range.
I'm in the market for a new car. I would like a top end of around 155 MPH. 0-60 under 3.5 seconds. I'd like sub 8 second quarter miles at about 125 MPH. Comfortably seat 4. Nice big trunk. Good air conditioning. Superb handling. Under $20,000. And, I would like to get at least 40 MPG. Can't seem to find that either.
Light weight.
Compact.
Shootable.
Accurate.
Lots of energy.
Acurate to 50 yards.
Good for pissed off mid sized bears.
Easy to carry.
concealable.
Honestly, I don't think there is one gun that meets all those points.
If its lightweight, its going to be a bitch to shoot with rounds that can stop a bear.
If its easy to conceal, Its not going to have the sight radius and sights big enough to shoot at 50 yards.
I suppose a 3-4 inch K frame .357 Magnum would be about as close as you can get. A three inch SP101 is a great gun, making good hits out to 50 yards is going to be very tough.
For bears, even medium sized bears, I would not feel comfortable until we get into the .41 Magnum-.44 Magnum-.454 range.
I'm in the market for a new car. I would like a top end of around 155 MPH. 0-60 under 3.5 seconds. I'd like sub 8 second quarter miles at about 125 MPH. Comfortably seat 4. Nice big trunk. Good air conditioning. Superb handling. Under $20,000. And, I would like to get at least 40 MPG. Can't seem to find that either.
Vern Humphrey
Member
There is an article by Charles Petty in the current issue of Handloader, "Compact Versus Full Size: The Cost of Small."
The article compares compact automatics to full size, but he closes it with a paragraph that I consider absolutely brilliamt:
The article compares compact automatics to full size, but he closes it with a paragraph that I consider absolutely brilliamt:
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