1903A3 Sporter question (pic heavy)

[P.B.Walsh]

Hi, went in a pwn shop today and was looking for an 03' rifle that was sporterize to be built into a custom rifle. I found one for $370, but I talked him down to $260. Thinking about buying it tomorrow. It is an Springfield Armory rifle serial number 429xxx that has been drilled for scope mounts, 3 up front, 2 rear. The bolt handle has been scalloped and the bolt has some shine to it. Trigger is a stock one. Fajen wood stock, 22" bare sporter barrel. This rifle will be used with iron sights only of that matters.

Is it worth it? Here are some pictures.









Like I said, this will be the last rifle for a very long, long time, so I need it to be a solid choice. Or would it just be better to buy a stripped reciever from AIMsurplus: http://www.aimsurplus.com/product.a...+Stripped+Receiver+and+Bolt+Action&groupid=12

Thanks ya'll,
P.B.Walsh

 

[rondog]

Question is - is it worth it to you? Looks like an 03 to me, not an 03A3. Hard to tell anything from the photos. But if it's already d&t'd for scope mounts, I'd scope it. Why not?

 

[Trent]

That is a low serial #!

Be careful shooting it. Not all heat treating in the 1903-1918 range is safe!

 

[Trent]

Yours was made in 1911.

1911: 456376‑502045

Anything under 800,000 made at Springfield Armory has dubious heat treating.

EDIT: Here's some history.

http://m1903.com/03rcvrfail/

 

[Trent]

And .. if that is in original condition and hasn't been sporterized that's not a bad deal. Cheaper than I paid for mine of similar vintage, by a considerable amount.

EDIT: I noticed it was tapped for a scope base. Do those threads look OK? Either way, that hurts the value a bit. Where the rear one is placed if the threads are junk in the hole, you won't have any room to over-bore and re-thread. It's so close to the edge. That might ruin it for doing a "sniper" version if you ever change your mind and decide to put glass on it.

Can you give some pics of the full rifle?

 

[Trent]

(Also I missed where you said you were also looking at a stripped receiver..)

You'll be out a lot more than 260 if you put together an entire rifle.

But, you'll get a known-good receiver, a brand new barrel of your choice, a stock of your choice... etc.

If you're looking for a sporterized one and don't mind the work, why not go full custom?

If this is your last rifle for a while, there's something to be said about shooting one that you BUILT.

 

[tahunua001]

ok I'll try to be organized.
1. that is not a 1903A3. it is a 1903. the 03A3 was only manufactured by remington and smith corona and serials started in the 3 millions if I remember correctly. the 03A3 had a rear sight mounted to the back of the receiver rather than to the barrel

2. I don't think that is a factory stock either. the wood grain is a little too perky for a gun that's been doused in linseed oil for the last 102 years. it could be but from the pictures I doubt it.

3. springfield heat treatment is hit or miss in the lower serial number ranges. as stated the affected serials are anything lower than 800,000. the problem is that at the time springfield was using primitive production methods, even by the standards of that era. the workers had to eyeball the guns in the furnace to tell when the metal was hot enough based on the coloring. however when exposed to direct sunlight metal has to get a lot hotter to begin to glow so at certain times of day when the sun was shining through windows onto the factory floor those guns would be heated for too long and became brittle since all of the carbon was cooked out of the steel. only certain guns were affected at certain times of day so there are no batches that are known safe and no known bads. some of these guns made it through both world wars and were fired so much that they needed barrels replaced and new bolts. even those have been known to give way suddenly and the shooters usually make an abrupt trip to the ER when it happens. there is no way to test without risking damaging your receiver and even the test is capable of developing a fracture which could eventually give way so it all boils down to a judgement call. do you want to risk shooting it or not? that rifle has been drilled and tapped so it is even more likely to go than most. I personally own a low serial springfield and I have shot probably 100 rounds through it before I had even heard a peep about low serials and everything I shot was US surplus. I don't shoot it often anymore but when I do I shoot light loads out of.

 

[P.B.Walsh]

The serial number concerned me, I want to shoot full power 30-06 loads in this rifle, so I am going to have to opt out of this one, maybe AIMsurplus recievers are 800,000 plus so I can do that.

Didn't take a hard look at the threads, just didn't like the fact that it was drilled. I want irons because..... well I don't have a good reason, I just like them a bit better. I do not have any full length pictures, its just a bisic sporter configuration, nothing special.

Has anybody used the AIM surplus ones? Again, looking to use these with full power loads.

I'll call them to take it off hold.

 

[rcmodel]

Low number receiver = Not good for a shooter.

Plus, the scope mount holes in the receiver are also very problematic.
No scope mount of the time, or today, used three holes in the front receiver ring.

Two in the front and one in the rear.
Or two in the front and two in the rear are normal.

You might have to make a scope mount to get one to fit it!!

I would step away if I were you.

rc

 

[tahunua001]

I believe that the receivers that AIM has are gibbs receivers. gibbs is the current maker of a number of 1903A3 type rifles from demilled 1903A3s as well as replica 1903A4 snipers. Those are all smith corona and remington recievers and are completely beyond reproach.

 

[tahunua001]

aim is currently sold out, here is the gibbs from their sister company, currently on sale.

 

[P.B.Walsh]

What do you mean, completely beyond reproach? Please excuse my ignorance.....

I thought S&C/Remington recievers were supposed to be the best and comprable to modern actions.

I called the shop and told them to take it off hold, I didn't get a good feeling with it anyways.

 

[tahunua001]

oh I'm sure someone will nitpick my wording to where it sounds like they are the best gun in the world but what I meant was that there are no worries about the heat treatment since they 1903A3 receivers and built long after the single heat treatments were phased out.

 

[P.B.Walsh]

Ok, sorry for the confusion on my behalf, that is exactly what I wanted to hear!

So these will stand up to any in spec load correct? Just covering all based.....

 

[Trent]

Yeah anything except Springfield < 800,000 and Rock Island < 286,506 should be good to go for full power loads, PB.

 

[P.B.Walsh]

Hmm, they did have an RI..... but I want Remington on the side of my reciever..... as a tribute to the former glory of big green.....

Ok, one last question and I will hush, do I have to use a GI A3 rear sight, or can I use something more user adjustable/friendly?

Well maybe one more stupid thing, what problems would I encounter with using a short action cartridge (.308) in the action? Feeding problems?

Ya'll are great

 

[Trent]

PB - it's your rifle, use what rear sight you want.

My 1903 has a non-drilled/non-tapped rear sight affixed to it. Little bit of heat to loosen the adhesive, and I can peel it right off. So I'd think you have as many options as there are aftermarket sights...

I can't speak for the other question on alternate chamberings because I haven't done it. From an ammunition perspective when selecting an alternate chambering, you'd need to be mindful of pressures. There's a 2,000 PSI difference between 308 maximum (62,000) and 30-06 maximum (60,000). Not a significant difference, since the rear shearing effect you have to worry about is more of a function of the acceleration of the projectile, which will be about the same rate, and weight... (I'd think "they are close enough")

 

[tahunua001]

well I'm not aware of any that don't require drilling and tapping but the rear sight just mounts on a dovetail. if you could find rear sights that use the same dovetail it would be a simple matter to mount it. however I personally like the A3 sight compared to other options out there. it is adjustable for long range and windage. all you really need if you know what you are doing. I had a 1903A3(ish) that could do holes touching at 50 yards with the stock sights... but you might be different.

as for cartidges, you may have some work ahead of you. the only real thing you'd have to do is to put a magwell block in it to keep somebody from putting 30-06 in it and that would also involve shortening the follower and might require a new follower spring... other than that it'll just be a long throw bolt... technically you would probably be able to get away with just using everthing as it is but I would personally feel safer knowing that if I ever sell it or loan it to somebody that they cant accidentally stuff 30-06 in it.

 

[P.B.Walsh]

Alright, that was all just very helpful and eased my mind about a few things. I think this might just win over a pre-2012 FNH Winchester 70.

 

[tahunua001]

be sure to come back and post some pics when it's done.

 

[P.B.Walsh]

Oh I'll definitely post up reports, with whatever action that I go with. For the price, the Remington A3 is very tempting.

 

[CaptHank]

PB... I'm also working in a 1903 "sporter" in 7mm Mag. Next step is adding a scope and taking it to the range.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=737554

 

[P.B.Walsh]

Nice rifle, I am going to see if McMillian can do me a special HTG mold for the 03 action. Hope it will not kill the project!