1911 Love/Hate

[Jesse Wales]

1911's

I love 1911's , and have had a few...
over the years if heard of problems and it always seems to be the off brands or guys will say that the new ones that are so tight that they dont work like the the orriginal Colt was designed to work, in freezing rain, to sand and mud, Ive had Colts and now I have two Springfields
a fully loaded A-1 , and my wife has a micro campact
ive never had any problems with any of the quality 1911's ive had
keep them clean and oiled and its a dependable machine
DS

 

[fivejades]

There are numerous articles in the internet on how to tune an extractor. Mr. Bill Wilson has one and very simple and comprehensive.

 

[Walkalong]

The realiability/need to tinker characteristics in threads like this one keeps me from buying one. You would think after 100 years someone would have figured out the design problems and fixed them.

Don't let the 1911 haters scare you off. It isn't one of the most popular designs around after 100 years for no reason.

The main problem after 100 years, is all the changes to the original design makers use to cut corners or "make them better", not to mention all the sloppy manufacturing and using customers for quality control instead of actual inspectors at the factory. Every Tom, Dick, and Harry is trying to get some of the huge 1911 market, and many are not up to the task.

The OP isn't interested in a 1911 debate, just curious as to his problem and sharing his frustration at a new product not being right. we have all been there with something, so should be able to empathize. We can bash or rave on 1911's somewhere else.

 

[Plan2Live]

Okay, let me rephrase that, I empathize with the OP, I too would like to warm up to (love as originally posted) an EMP but based on numerous posts and person to person testimonials about how they (EMP style pistols) have to be tinkered with before they run right, I just can't convince myself to plop down $1,000 for one. And I feel really bad (hate as originally posted) about that since I shoot them (EMP like pistols) so well. I feel your pain and am truely sorry you had the typical experience. Better?

 

[Walkalong]

My EMP is great. I would not be afraid to buy another one.

 

[smalls]

Small update:
I watched a few videos on extractors, and the tension seems fine.
So I checked the chamber with a spent casing. It doesn't drop freely, or at all. I have to yank lightly on it to get it out. So, I'm going to guess my chamber is too tight.

I appreciate the help, support and empathy guys. I've went this long without a 1911, I'm guessing a few more weeks ain't gonna kill me. I'm going to request they put more than a few "test rounds" through it, to make sure it's going to run correctly, to avoid sending it back again.

 

[rcmodel]

You can't tell a thing with a fired case.

They expand to fit the chamber when fired, and unless you can put them back in exactly the same position they came out, they will always be tight.

That is one reason why reloaders have to resize every fired case so they can use it again.

rc

 

[smalls]

Damnit! You might be onto somethin there!
I read the advice wrong, cause I was thinking exactly that. But I shrugged and said "well, if that's what they tell me to check, I'll check it."

 

[trickyasafox]

STI will definitely take care of you (as they should) please let us know how it works out when you talk to them.

 

[smalls]

I will. I'll be calling first thing Monday morning. I'm sure they'll make it right.

 

[peacebutready]

There's only a few issues that will cause failure to extract in a 1911. There's a reason people used to buy a genuine colt for $600 and then send it to a reputable gunsmith for another $600. It's to work out all the kinks.

Any of these things can be problems with any semi auto: it just so happens that engineers have found ways to minimize all of these occurrences. MOST semi auto's are still basically a modified form of the 1911. Glocks have benefited from re-engineering which 1911's have not. When you work with an out-dated design: you end up stumbling over flaws that newer guns generally don't have.

An apparently well respected 1911 expert on these forums has mentioned the new 1911's are made tight compared to the looser ones of many decades ago. He attributes that to more jams in recent decades. It seems that all things being equal with manufacturing quality, the lower and mid-tier models would be better if they made them to looser specs. Some (don't know how much) accuracy will be lost but reliability will be better. Reliability is obviously necessary if the pistol will be used for defensive purposes.

The 1911 expert on the forums also said the manufacturers know a lot of the 1911's will not be fired much, and skimp on quality as a result. My Para GI Expert is a lemon.

About flaws with the 1911 that newer guns like Glocks don't have, maybe there needs to be some evolution with the 1911 design. Para-Ordnance came out with the double-stack magazine 1911's and the Power-Extractor. There have been a lot of problems with both. Para got rid of the Power-Extractor for 2012. I think that extractor was MIM instead of machined. Maybe it would have been a success if it was machined. I don't know. I don't know why there have been problems with the double-stacked Para's but maybe just more evolution is necessary.

 

[mljdeckard]

Interesting. I ordered a custom Para almost a year ago as part of a commemorative order for the unit I deployed with, and it has been delayed repeatedly. They say it should be done at the end of the month, and that they were waiting on a new supply of slides. Maybe it won't have a power extractor. I really wasn't looking to having one in the first place.

(Their web site still says it is included on all pistols.)

 

[smalls]

Mljdeckard, when I was doing my research on which 1911 to buy, I was quickly turned away from Para. I even had emplooyees of the company say to stay away!

Some people don't trust the 1911, but I think as long as you get a well built one, and run it through the paces to be certain it runs, you can't beat it. You've gotta run em hard before you trust them, just like any other gun.
Yeah, I got one that needs a little tweaking, but I bought it from a reputable manufacturer, who (hopefully) will make this thing run like a sewing machine. Sometimes, one or two falls through the cracks. No big deal to me, as long as they make it right, and isn't costing me more money to fix.

 

[johnnydollar]

Very helpful Qman, I'll check that out when I get home tonight.
Another piece of information I forgot to mention is that when it failed to eject the last round in the mag, the empty brass would be laying on top of the empty mag, on the follower.

Leaving empty brass rattling around inside the slide (usually on top of the empty mag) is almost ALWAYS an extractor problem. I will, on further reflection, go so far as to say it is ALWAYS a problem of extractor tension.

 

[Walkalong]

I am glad my 1911's cannot read. It would really hurt their feelings to get online and find out how terrible they are. Well, how terrible they are supposed to be anyway.

 

[smalls]

Johnnydollar, I checked the tension on the extractor, and it seemed fine. Like others have said, it could be the wrong one. I have no way of knowing, or any others to compare it to.

 

[peacebutready]

Interesting. I ordered a custom Para almost a year ago as part of a commemorative order for the unit I deployed with, and it has been delayed repeatedly. They say it should be done at the end of the month, and that they were waiting on a new supply of slides. Maybe it won't have a power extractor. I really wasn't looking to having one in the first place.

(Their web site still says it is included on all pistols.)

Check out the quality of other Para's sold/given to other vets. If you don't like what you read/see, maybe you can just get your money back.

I recently saw an advertisement for the power extractor even though they are gone for 2012.

Para's 2 web sites have the GI Expert with 2 different types of finishes, MSRP's, and are possibly constructed with 2 different metals. Mine is black so I had assumed it was cast steel but it's not, it's stainless...

 

[knockonit]

I have a STI ls9, it shot round corners without trying, though I was trying to curve the shot lol. and it had an extraction problem, called sti, they sent a recall ticket to ship back, and in a week or so, I had it back, new barrel and a couple other goodies, it shot well, then a mag problem, its the compact mag made by metalform, and very hard to find, infact was at crossroads show today trying to find some, found all the fullsize one could want, but no shorties.
Anyhows, I really like the platform, its accurate and easy on the hand, just need mo mags.
haha
good luck, I"m confident STI will handle the issue.

 

[smalls]

Knockonit, just out of curiosity, what kinda goodies did they send ya? Hah .

If you're looking for mags, try cdnn, brownells, or midway. If you still can't find em, try calling STI, they may be able to help you out.

 

[mljdeckard]

I don't need to guess. I already have one. A friend of mine got one a few years ago for his deployment, and I am holding it for him while he is in a place where he can't take it. I know full well exactly what I am getting. When he got this one they had squeezed the slide too tightly in a vise (probably when they were installing the sights) and the plug and rod were stuck in, we had to send it back to the factory. (which they made good.)

I wish it was a different shop making it. But at the same time, they can't all suck. It is commemorative to my deployment, I needed a 100th anniversary 1911, and one to celebrate the state gun of Utah. If it had been a different shop, it probably would have cost more, and I wouldn't have bought it. $749 for the gun with custom markings, 5 mags, case, and night sights. It's not my only gun, I will be willing to make Para fix it if there is something wrong. (I've already waited a year for it for pete sake.

 

[smalls]

I wish you well in getting a good one, then

 

[mnhntr]

I had an STI Lawman that the extractor broke on the first magazine. I called STI and they said they would send a label and instructions to ship it back or they would send a new extractor. I received the extractor put it in and it worked fine. They called me twice to make sure everything was good. I have nothing but praise for their customer service.

 

[dcarch]

Wish you all the best in getting her up and running 100%. STI will take care of ya.

 

[smalls]

I'm really impressed that they called you twice to make sure everything was good. I'm really happy I went with an STI, from everything I've been hearing about their CS.

 

[makarovnik]

I had a Auto Ordnance 1911 and rounds would get hung up or bumped by the internal aspect of the last round hold open lever. Check it for signs of brass hitting it.