1911 slide peening question

[Bfh_auto]

The 1911 in question is a stainless para 1911 Expert.
I'm working up a load and want to avoid damage.
An I correct in thinking the slide should not contact the slide stop when firing?
Also how often do I change the spring?
I'm at approximate 700 rounds of ball ammo and about 200 light target loads that barely cycled it.
Currently there is no damage and I want to stay that way.

 

[WilsonCQB1911]

Well, this one is harder to answer as I'm not quite sure what you are asking. Is the slide stop contacting the slide during normal operation? So is it locking open every shot? The slide stop will contact the slide when the magazine is empty. What kind of peening and where are you seeing it?

If you are using standard piano wire recoil springs I'd replace them every two thousand rounds. I've sometimes replaced them every 1k since they are cheap. Replace the firing pin spring when you do so. This keeps the pistol somewhat drop safe. I'm assuming you are talking about a 45 ACP gun.

 

[Charlie98]

I've sometimes replaced them every 1k since they are cheap.

That... +1

An I correct in thinking the slide should not contact the slide stop when firing?

What are you calling the 'slide stop'? The rearward movement of the slide is stopped by the frame (in the area forward of the trigger guard.) If you've ever hear of ShokBuffs, that's what they are designed to prevent... frame battering.

If you are seeing peening somewhere, it's likely because of poor or improper heat treat... I had a Taurus 1911 that peened the slide at the rear, and I couldn't get the firing pin retention plate out.

 

[shoobe01]

Agree with everyone. Need to see what part, and also seen lots of people say "peening" when they mean some other level of interaction.

More details or best is photos with descriptions, arrows, etc.

 

[CoalCrackerAl]

I recommend Wolf springs when it comes time for replacing.

 

[tarosean]

An I correct in thinking the slide should not contact the slide stop when firing?

correct until the last shot.

are you worried about this type of peening? Rails, VIS, Lugs or ?

*Stolen picture from internet.

 

[Bfh_auto]

Well, this one is harder to answer as I'm not quite sure what you are asking. Is the slide stop contacting the slide during normal operation? So is it locking open every shot? The slide stop will contact the slide when the magazine is empty. What kind of peening and where are you seeing it?

If you are using standard piano wire recoil springs I'd replace them every two thousand rounds. I've sometimes replaced them every 1k since they are cheap. Replace the firing pin spring when you do so. This keeps the pistol somewhat drop safe. I'm assuming you are talking about a 45 ACP gun.

There is no peening. It functions properly at the moment. I'm just making sure I understand what to expect and take the steps to prevent it.
I read about the damage happening with neglect or too hot loads.
I've read both positive and negative on shock buffers.

 

[Bfh_auto]

correct until the last shot.

are you worried about this type of peening? Rails, VIS, Lugs or ?

*Stolen picture from internet.
View attachment 1120594

Sorry I used the wrong terminology.
It's where this part of the frame would contact.
The dirt from during had marks from the frame contacting it. I am not sure if it was from me field stripping it or the gun cycling.
I tried researching and found a bunch of arguing over spring weight, shock buffers etc. I've come to trust THR over most of the other sites.

 

[tarosean]

It's where this part of the frame would contact.

The slide will eventually crack there. Course you will have to put 50-100k + rounds through it first before worring about that.. Even then keep shooting until it really opens up then congratulate yourself for outshooting a gun.

*Zero experience with Para so your milage may vary.

 

[shoobe01]

The slide will eventually crack there. Course you will have to put 50-100k + rounds through it first before worring about that.. Even then keep shooting until it really opens up then congratulate yourself for outshooting a gun.

This.

I like buffers on some guns (all .45s, 1911 and Stars among them) but for comfort. By the time you manage to kill a pistol from over-use, you have probably gotten your money's worth out of it. Remember that lots of the experienced names in smithery et al are that way because they shoot for a living, so can burn up a pistol in a year. Even hobbyist competitors who only shoot weekends are hard pressed to kill pistols fast enough to notice. Much harder wearing than say a rifle barrel if you are thinking along those lines of lifespan, so I wouldn't worry about it unless you buy ammo or components by the pallet.

 

[CapnMac]

I'm just making sure I understand what to expect and take the steps to prevent it.

Ah. Ok.
So, "slide peening" can take several forms.

One is where the barrel lugs have pounded the slide cuts, and one or both are rounding, or showing rabbets or the like. It's the sort of thing that a person needs to watch out for around ten or twenty thousand rounds into a 1911 (maybe 50K with powder-puff loads).

Some slide stops will peen around a mere 5K rounds, but most will soldier on for 10-20k with barely a scratch (might be polished white, though). A slide stop is pretty cheap to replace.

Now, there are any number of flamewarriors out there who will pound their keyboards if a person, any person, does not Do Everything Exactly As They Do!!11!! (whether said worthies own anything beyond airsoft, muddying the waters no small amount).

If it matters here is my Series 70, bought used, with more than 10K rounds (or near every description) run through it

I owned an AMT Hardballer, I was more worried about the sloppy parts fit than peening.

 

[Bfh_auto]

Ah. Ok.
So, "slide peening" can take several forms.

One is where the barrel lugs have pounded the slide cuts, and one or both are rounding, or showing rabbets or the like. It's the sort of thing that a person needs to watch out for around ten or twenty thousand rounds into a 1911 (maybe 50K with powder-puff loads).

Some slide stops will peen around a mere 5K rounds, but most will soldier on for 10-20k with barely a scratch (might be polished white, though). A slide stop is pretty cheap to replace.

Now, there are any number of flamewarriors out there who will pound their keyboards if a person, any person, does not Do Everything Exactly As They Do!!11!! (whether said worthies own anything beyond airsoft, muddying the waters no small amount).

If it matters here is my Series 70, bought used, with more than 10K rounds (or near every description) run through it
View attachment 1120602
I owned an AMT Hardballer, I was more worried about the sloppy parts fit than peening.

Thank you.
Another question. Is the square firing pin a plus for heavier loads? That was another thing I saw thrown around over and over.
I'm not planning on running Plus P. But I'm running heavy bullets with relatively slow burning powder.

 

[drband]

square firing pin

I assume you mean the flat bottomed firing pin stop. It’s useful for mitigating recoil because it slows the slide’s speed of travel to the rear & in doing so helps absorb some energy.

 

[shoobe01]

I owned an AMT Hardballer, I was more worried about the sloppy parts fit than peening.

Peening in the lower lug and locking recesses just tightens it all up

 

[Charlie98]

I read about the damage happening with neglect or too hot loads.
I've read both positive and negative on shock buffers.

But I'm running heavy bullets with relatively slow burning powder.

How heavy? 230grn? ...or heavier? FWIW, the .45ACP doesn't really lend itself to slow burning powders; about the slowest I would go would be Unique/Universal/WSF/AA#5'ish powders, although I'm sure there is data for slower powders. Honestly, if you are just poking paper and such, you don't need heavy bullets, nor the wear and tear they provide over something like a 200grn RN or SWC bullet... but it depends on what you are doing, of course.

Shock buffers. I consider them a once-and-done item... install it when you go shooting, take it out and trash it when you are done. They DO work, but how much they really reduce frame battering I don't know, and that question can be good fodder for an internet squabble, much like replacing recoil springs. I used to run them in my Springfield Government .45, and they would be chewed up pretty good at the end of a range session... so they are doing something. I do not recommend them in shorter (sub-5") pistols, because of the reduced slide travel.

 

[Bfh_auto]

How heavy? 230grn? ...or heavier? FWIW, the .45ACP doesn't really lend itself to slow burning powders; about the slowest I would go would be Unique/Universal/WSF/AA#5'ish powders, although I'm sure there is data for slower powders. Honestly, if you are just poking paper and such, you don't need heavy bullets, nor the wear and tear they provide over something like a 200grn RN or SWC bullet... but it depends on what you are doing, of course.

Shock buffers. I consider them a once-and-done item... install it when you go shooting, take it out and trash it when you are done. They DO work, but how much they really reduce frame battering I don't know, and that question can be good fodder for an internet squabble, much like replacing recoil springs. I used to run them in my Springfield Government .45, and they would be chewed up pretty good at the end of a range session... so they are doing something. I do not recommend them in shorter (sub-5") pistols, because of the reduced slide travel.

I'm using 5.7 gr silhouette and a 255 RNFP.
The primary intent is to have an accurate load that can kill a deer during alternative season.
I like the larger metplat of the 255. Recoil is on par with factory ball. Ejected brass lands closer than ball ammo.

 

[tark]

I'm using 5.7 gr silhouette and a 255 RNFP.
The primary intent is to have an accurate load that can kill a deer during alternative season.

Ditch the heavy bullets. A deer won't know the difference.

Shok buffs are the answer to a non existent problem. They aren't needed and Les never put them in a gun unless they were specifically requested. I've seen 1911s with over 100,000 rounds under their belt that never saw a shok-buff.

Springs are critical. Stick to a standard, 15-16# recoil spring and change them every 2000 or so rounds. DO NOT go to a heavier spring for "hot loads." This will result in battering the barrel lugs ( the bottom lug that contacts the slide stop ) resulting in eventual cracking. That heavy spring will slam the slide forward with too much force. Once the lug is cracked the barrel is junk. In the 21 years I worked for Les I lost count of the number of ruined barrels I saw from doing this.

 

[Bfh_auto]

Ditch the heavy bullets. A deer won't know the difference.

Shok buffs are the answer to a non existent problem. They aren't needed and Les never put them in a gun unless they were specifically requested. I've seen 1911s with over 100,000 rounds under their belt that never saw a shok-buff.

Springs are critical. Stick to a standard, 15-16# recoil spring and change them every 2000 or so rounds. DO NOT go to a heavier spring for "hot loads." This will result in battering the barrel lugs ( the bottom lug that contacts the slide stop ) resulting in eventual cracking. That heavy spring will slam the slide forward with too much force. Once the lug is cracked the barrel is junk. In the 21 years I worked for Les I lost count of the number of ruined barrels I saw from doing this.

Thank you for the info.

 

[halfmoonclip]

I tried shock-buffs years ago, they often resulted in short strokes.
For the OP, if you really want big power in a 1911, perhaps consider a 10mm.
With any kind of halfway reasonable .45 load, wearing out the gun is pretty far down the worry list.
Moon

 

[Bfh_auto]

I tried shock-buffs years ago, they often resulted in short strokes.
For the OP, if you really want big power in a 1911, perhaps consider a 10mm.
With any kind of halfway reasonable .45 load, wearing out the gun is pretty far down the worry list.
Moon

I'm not interested in pushing the limits of the platform. I was more looking for what the actual limits are. So I don't push them. If that makes sense.

 

[Tinman357]

OP, I too trust the vast knowledge base that resides here on THR. That said, I am seeing some awfully low "service life" round counts estimates. I have a 1996 Kimber custom classic that has fired well over 150K and no sign of peening other than the slide stop notch. (Yes, I'm the guy that ordered a case or two of ammo every month for over 20 years. Yes, really) Even that stopped progressing after a while, but I keep an eye on it.

I hear that because it's just a junk Kimber it'll wear out and fall apart any minute now.

Parts wear. That is just a fact when you shoot. Stay on top of your spring changes and stay with factory weight springs. A small radius firing pin stop will reduce slide velocities, a shok buff isn't needed.

No need to exceed standard +P loads. They just beat up your gun for very little gain. My old Kimber sees 99% standard target loads, the rest are +P as that is what I mostly carry. I don't see any signs of peening or even much wear yet.

Keep it clean and lubed, change out the springs as needed. Unless you are in your 20's and shoot seriously in competition and the requisite practice, you probably won't live long enough to wear it out. If you do, the cost of a new one, even a Wilson, will pale in comparison to the cost of the ammo you will need to shoot to do it.

 

[halfmoonclip]

Question; "small radius firing pin stop"; we're talking about the flat plate that retains the firing pin in the slide? I take it some have a less pronounced curve, which adds resistance while camming the hammer out of the way?
Hmmm. Do I have that right? Learn something every day.
Moon

 

[Tinman357]

Yes. Some are more rounded to lessen the force needed to operate the slide, others have a barely rounded edge to delay unlocking as long as possible.

Its a balancing act. But in relation to your first post, you seem to want to prevent peening/frame battering, if I understand correctly. A small radius firing pin stop is one solution.

 

[Russ57]

To Bfn_auto, the real answer to your question comes down to "1911 timing" and the quality of the frame/slide and the rest of the parts in your gun. If the frame/slide are poor quality, and/or timing is off, service life will be reduced. If all of that is good, the internal parts can be easily replaced with better quality ones. Some fitting may be required but it is generally within the abilities of most end users.

If I was hunting deer, I'd go with a lighter bullet, at higher velocity, attempting to get some expansion.

To halfmoonclip, you have it right.

 

[Bfh_auto]

Yes. Some are more rounded to lessen the force needed to operate the slide, others have a barely rounded edge to delay unlocking as long as possible.

Its a balancing act. But in relation to your first post, you seem to want to prevent peening/frame battering, if I understand correctly. A small radius firing pin stop is one solution.

I'm waiting on it to be delivered.
I found a 4.5 gr load of bullseye and a 230 cast bullet ejected the brass 2 feet from me. It's stupid mild. If it stays reliable I'll use it for range ammo.
The 255 load is perfectly zeroed at 25 yards and shoots into 2 inches. So it will be good enough for me.