20 gauge 870 Express for HD

[Gun Geezer]

I want to get a 20 gauge to get the girls (age 12 and 14) to learn on and wish this same shotgun to double as and HD weapon for my wife. They are all on the smallish side with a 12 1/2 to 13" LOP. A 23" bbl version would do nicely. They have all held one and can deal with the weight, etc. Seems to fit them well enough.

I am looking at several of the 870 Express models for these 2 purposes.

I am NOT concerned about the lack of smoothness in the action. But I am concerned with reliablity of the Express models as HD as I have read the trigger assembly is not all metal (some plastic) and there are some MIM parts.
Plus, I've personally seen one Express model that locked up on it 1st day of shooting.

For HD, what ever I pick MUST work 100% reliable. No hick-ups. EVER. Will the 870 Express fill the bill?

 

[Tim the student]

Mine has been fine, but it's maybe 15 years old. I've heard the new ones have had some issues, but I don't know anyone personally who has had any issues with theirs. I have no doubts you can find a boatload of threads on 870 reliability.

 

[Virginian]

Just like a handgun for self defense, you need to shoot it and see that is reliable with the loads you plan to use. That goes for any gun. The new Expresses are built to a price point, no doubt about that. If the chamber is rough, and it has been known to occurr on the 12 gauges, either fix it, or make Remington fix it. (It's a pretty darned easy fix) That is the most likely "first day lock-up" cause, and it is greatly exacerbated by using cheap ammo like the Winchester Universals at Wally World.
Replace the MIM extractor with a forged one if you are worried about it. (I don't disagree with you.)
Personally, I wouldn't worry about the plastic trigger guard issue, and I don't know if they have those on the 20s or not anyway. Have you looked at a Glock or an M-16. Don't tell anyone, but that's plastic.
You can probably save some money, and get a smoother gun and skip any concerns with a used Wingmaster.

 

[Snarlingiron]

I have 2 12 ga 870 Expresses. I have had no issues with either one. I am a fan, and frankly, most of the issues I have seen described in this and other forums have been relatively minor. A large number of them have been due to the new and uninitiated owners failing to read and follow the manual. I.e. disassemble and thoroughly clean the gun before firing it. Another large group of issues has been with the unrefined chambers in combination with super cheap ammo. Again, relatively minor and as noted by Virginian, easily taken care of.

I believe WAY too much is made of the plastic trigger housing. The metal ones are cast aluminum, and probably prone to breakage more than the plastic ones.

Both of my guns have been shot a lot and as I said I have had no issues. One of them had been through a three day hardcore shotgun class. If the MIM parts concern you, I would order non MIM replacements and keep them on hand for quick replacement if one should break.

Lastly, I would encourage everyone to think about this. The 870 is the most widely sold shotgun in the world. Do you think that everyone that buys one and has no issues rushes to post that on the forums? No, it is just the ones that have issues that get lots of exposure. While I have no statistics at hand, I would bet good money that as a percentage of guns sold, the ones that have problems is quite small.

Add to that the fact that you can get parts for an 870 in just about any Podunk Junction gun shop in the US, and it is a package that makes a lot of sense. I wouldn't hesitate to buy another one, and in fact have recommended the 870 Express to a number of folks that have bought them and love them.

For all the same reasons, the Mossbergs are good too. I just don't happen to have very much hands on experience with them.

 

[oneounceload]

I am NOT concerned about the lack of smoothness in the action. But I am concerned with reliablity of the Express models as HD as I have read the trigger assembly is not all metal (some plastic) and there are some MIM parts.

Why would you NOT be concerned about the smoothness of the action in case they needed a follow-up shot, but you are concerned about MIM parts?

Take to a range where you can try both 12's with reduced recoil loads and 20......20's can tend to recoil MORE because they are lighter in weight.....swinging a gun in the store and firing it are two different animals

 

[KBintheSLC]

I have an 870 Express in 12ga and it is "old faithful". The trick to reliability with the 870 is to teach them proper form... rack the pump fast and hard... all the way back and all the way forward. The only time they will have trouble is if they short-stroke the pump, or if they do not rack it fast/hard enough to properly eject the hull.

With proper form, the 870 is utterly reliable, and 20ga is plenty for SD/HD using good quality buckshot.

The action should smooth out a bit with use. The 870 is the most used shottie in law enforcement if that means anything to you.

 

[Fred Fuller]

If the family budget can handle it, you might want to step up to the 20 gauge 11-87 youth model. A few months ago, it was reviewed very favorably in Women and Guns. Kathy Jackson ( www.corneredcat.com ) shot it and was impressed- and she is no big fan of long guns. See http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/shotguns/model_11-87/model_11-87_compact_sportsman.asp .

There's nothing really wrong with the 870 Express youth guns. Gander Mountain has an even shorter one than the Youth model - see http://www.gandermountain.com/modpe...ander-Exclusives&aID=510E&merchID=4006&r=view . But the gas gun will kick less. Reliability with good ammo is about the same for either, in well trained hands.

Thing is, you cannot divorce the shooter from the gun. And the gun can't make up for shortcomings on the part of the shooter. Good training is critical...

hth,

lpl

 

[Gun Geezer]

Why would you NOT be concerned about the smoothness of the action in case they needed a follow-up shot, but you are concerned about MIM parts?

Take to a range where you can try both 12's with reduced recoil loads and 20......20's can tend to recoil MORE because they are lighter in weight.....swinging a gun in the store and firing it are two different animals

Why? Because the "buttery slippery super slick feel" of my 35 year old Wingmaster is not needed to kill bad guys. On the other hand, a broken MIM part will shut the gun down and reduce it to not so well balanced club.