.223 Rem Primers

[Skinnedknuckles]

I'm new to rifle reloading and would like opinions about these primers. Is the amount of flattening I'm seeing signs I've gone too far, or am I still in good territory?

It's the primer in the middle I'm questioning. On the right is 26.0 gr CFE-223 under a 55 gr Hornady SP in once fired Federal brass and a CCI SR primer. The middle is the same except 27.0 gr CFE-223 (max per Hodgdon is 27.8 gr). For comparison, and the reason I was surprised, is the primer on the right. That is 27.0 gr CFE-223 under a 55 gr RMR FMJ in once reloaded Remington brass and a CCI SR primer.

 

[Reloadron]

The primer on the right looks like low pressure as in a light load. However, you lost me with:

On the right is 26.0 gr CFE-223 under a 55 gr Hornady SP in once fired Federal brass and a CCI SR primer.

The case on my right is the Remington case? I would think 26.0 grains of CFE 223 would have flattened the primer more looking at the CFE load data. The low end is 24.8in the Hornady 9th Edition manual. The Federal cases look OK to me but it's hard to tell if the case on my right had some slight cratering? I just can't tell.

Ron

 

[Rule3]

You have TWO (2) on the right??

The one in the middle looks iffy?

Try a test using all the same brass preferably the same bunch or lot of brass.

How do you measure/weigh your powder?

 

[243winxb]

Center one shows the most pressure. You can not work up to maximum using 2 different bullets with 2 different brands of brass. And on a small capacity case, dont increase the powder charge by 1 full grain of powder.

 

[Hardtarget]

Time to step back a bit. To keep your self (and info) on an even keel...get one bullet, one primer, all one one brass head stamp, and one powder. Increase .2 gr increments so you can really see whats going on.

I got myself into the same problem as you. Tried too many things and made too many variables...I couldn't keep it straight. Several of the good guys here got me on track.

Plus side of this...extra range trips. GOT TO TEST! Shoot every weekend. Thats the fun part!

Have fun . Stay safe with your loads. Good records.

Mark

 

[Walkalong]

None of those alarm me. Listen to the guys, start slow, with one combination, and go from there.

Pick a good bullet, pick a powder, pick a primer, and work up from the start charge with that combination ans see if there is a load your rifle likes. If not, try a different bullet or a different powder. Change one thing at a time.

 

[Skinnedknuckles]

Sorry for the confusion about "my other right" and my explanation of my load work up. I previously worked up the load using Remington brass with RMR FMJ bullets - the case on the right. I shot some of that version for accuracy comparison while testing the new load.

This week I was working up a new load using Hornady SP bullets to see if they might be more accurate than the RMR bullets. Based on the earlier testing in this rifle, I loaded cartridges with 26.0 (Hodgdon minimum), 26.5, and 27.0 gr of CFE-223 using the Federal brass. I felt confident I was in safe territory because of my previous load development and because I was still 0.8 gr below maximum. Thus my surprise at the more flattened primers. The 26.5 gr load showed more flattening than the 26.0 and less than the 27.0. I just didn't include a picture.

 

[243winxb]

Pressure signs.

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[/URL][/IMG] Pressure signs may be different between bolt and auto firearms. What are you shooting the reloads in? The bullets bearing surface/length, if longer, may increase pressure, when using the same powder charge with other bullets. Also solid copper, or partition bullets may raise pressure , when compared to a all lead core bullet.

 

[Load Master]

As others have mentioned, I see nothing (pressure wise) in your photos I personally would not be alarmed with. Anytime you change a major component you need to evaluate your round recipe. Keeping detailed notes of each loading session has worked for me. This includes range test results.

The case on the right in this photo is what I normally see for a Hornady #2267 FMJBT 55gr at 2850fps.

 

[springer99]

FWIW, I wouldn't be concerned about any of those primer conditions. Yes, the center one does indicate some flattening, but the primer external diameter doesn't appear to be flattened at all and there's no indication(that I can see) where primer material is flowing into the firing pin hole. Higher pressure(yes) not not excessively so (IMHO).

 

[hdwhit]

Visual inspection of fired cases can be useful in detecting obvious signs that the case has been subjected to stresses in excess of those which the case was designed to handle. It can also detect environmental factors such as problems with the firing pin.

As several others have already said, I see nothing in the photograph of the primers that suggest obvious signs of excessive pressures.

I do note the case in the middle of the photograph has what appears to be a nick in the rim at about the 4 o'clock position along with a line proceeding from the nick through the "M" and the "E". These could have been pre-existing imperfections and marks, but if they resulted from the firing, the case should be inspected to determine their cause.

 

[mdi]

I rarely go near max with any of my rifle loads and I pay little attention to primer condition. Everything I've read about pressure signs say primers are a poor indication of high pressure. I once during a test loaded some rounds up near the max., 308 bolt gun shooting LC brass with IMR4064 under a 155 gr. bullet. Primers showed little flattening, but case head expansion, while slight (.0005" to .001") indicated the pressure was getting high. No big deal for me, just backed off...

 

[iagbarrb]

I do ot see overpreassure signs on the primers but for comparisons I would suggest you same brand of shell primer bullet and primer.
Flat primer is not the only over preasure sign. You might have flat primers in head space issues. There are very interesting and good articles if you search the internet.

Enviado desde mi SM-N910H mediante Tapatalk

 

[FiveInADime]

I rarely go near max with any of my rifle loads and I pay little attention to primer condition. Everything I've read about pressure signs say primers are a poor indication of high pressure. I once during a test loaded some rounds up near the max., 308 bolt gun shooting LC brass with IMR4064 under a 155 gr. bullet. Primers showed little flattening, but case head expansion, while slight (.0005" to .001") indicated the pressure was getting high. No big deal for me, just backed off...

How did you measure case head expansion?

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

 

[steve4102]

You might have flat primers in head space issues. There are very interesting and good articles if you search the internet.

Here is one such article from Handloader Magazine.

https://www.loaddata.com/articles/PDF/Load Development May 11.pdf

... flattened primers, supposedly
a classic sign of high
pressure. I hate to break the
news, but flat primers aren’t necessarily
an indication of high
pressure, or even a very good sign...When a rifle cartridge goes off,
the primer is pushed backward,
due to powder gas pushing
through the flash-hole, so it
would seem to make sense that a
really flat primer indicates high
pressure. Not necessarily. A really
flat primer can also be
caused by slightly excessive
headspace.
When the firing pin hits the
primer, it drives the case forward.
If there’s a little slop between
case and chamber, the
expanding powder gas first
pushes the primer backward in
the primer pocket. If the pressure
is low enough, as with the .30-30
Winchester, the primers will remain
slightly backed out of the
fired brass. This is common in
ancient and well-worn .30-30
lever actions.
If the pressure is higher, however,
as with the .30-06, the rear
of the primer itself expands a little
as it backs out, since it’s no
longer supported by the primer
pocket. In another micro-second
the case itself is thrust back over
the slightly expanded primer.
At the same time, the case
stretches a little bit...

 

[yugorpk]

None of them look bad.