Too simple a question without more detail so here's a video with Larrin Thomas, PhD breaking down categories and steels within them.
3 best steels?
- Thread starter hso
- Start date
Interesting. I liked how someone sneaked in the Spyderco logo at about 7:10 while talking about some companies offering many different steels for various knives.
I've not tried magnacut, but it sounds like a good choice. For my uses I've found SV30 or 35 to be a good balance of the properties I'm looking for including price.
I've not tried magnacut, but it sounds like a good choice. For my uses I've found SV30 or 35 to be a good balance of the properties I'm looking for including price.
Madcap_Magician
Member
I really love MagnaCut. Really, really. The only thing it isn't is tough as tough carbon or tool steels. It's very tough for stainless, just that stainless isn't very tough compared to carbon or alloy tool steels. MagnaCut is like the toughness and sharpening ease of AEB-L with the edge holding of M390 and great edge stability.
Dr. Thomas and his willingness/ability to share knowledge is a real gift to knife enthusiasts.
That said, I wouldn't buy new knives in Magnacut to replace working S30V/S35VN knives--I don't think that would make sense. If I were looking for a new knife, though, I would certainly see if I could find something in Magnacut.
The tool steels will tend to look a lot like the high wear resistance stainless steels in terms of toughness.
It's going to beat them in toughness, wear resistance and corrosion resistance, if you look at the raw numbers. That's what makes it so impressive--that it can beat a high wear resistance steel for wear resistance and still be tougher.
That said, I wouldn't buy new knives in Magnacut to replace working S30V/S35VN knives--I don't think that would make sense. If I were looking for a new knife, though, I would certainly see if I could find something in Magnacut.
Sorta. Magnacut won't beat the tough carbon steels, because, as you say, it's hard to make a high wear resistant stainless steel that's also really tough. Toughness and wear resistance tend to be competing properties--if you push one up, the other goes down. Magnacut was designed to try to maximize the tradeoff. To get the most wear resistance and toughness in a stainless steel that's feasible with the current state of metallurgy. It does a good job, but one can definitely find steels with higher wear resistance (they will have lower toughness) than Magnacut and one can also find steels that have much better toughness (they will have lower wear resistance) than Magnacut.
The tool steels will tend to look a lot like the high wear resistance stainless steels in terms of toughness.
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Flat Rock
Member
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- Dec 28, 2022
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- 173
well said. I have made a few knives in Magnacut and am very impressed.
I got some of the steel from the original pour and still have it.
that said, some of my favorite steels are"
80CRV2 for a tough, excellent all round carbon steel
CPM154 for a great all round stainless
AEB-L for a TOUGH stainless that takes a WICKED edge
S35 VN for a great wear resistant stainless
S45VN was the best all around stainless before Magnacut came on the scene, and is still VERY VERY good.
CPM 154 is still one of the best stainless steels of all time, and I use it frequently in my knives.
Joe
RA40
Member
The Porsche GT-3 RS is necessary for every type of driving task.
I come across people who buy up these pieces yet invariably they are carrying/using an S35 or CPM154 bladed production knife. Not that Magnacut requires frequent sharpening so IDK what to make of it. For the kitchen knives Magnacut seems excessive, a bushcraft level knife more fitting. I've not tried any though plan on making some for the holiday season.
I come across people who buy up these pieces yet invariably they are carrying/using an S35 or CPM154 bladed production knife. Not that Magnacut requires frequent sharpening so IDK what to make of it. For the kitchen knives Magnacut seems excessive, a bushcraft level knife more fitting. I've not tried any though plan on making some for the holiday season.
The Porsche GT-3 RS is necessary for every type of driving task.
I come across people who buy up these pieces yet invariably they are carrying/using an S35 or CPM154 bladed production knife.
I’ve been carrying a VG-10 Endela a lot that I got as a Black Friday freebie when I bought a “nicer” Spyderco.
I think that it would be very difficult for most to truly justify a new knife if the only change were an upgrade from a decent steel to a premium one. I buy knives that I like that have decent steels and if I can find one I like with a premium steel, that's even better.
If you want to sharpen one of the high-wear resistant stainless steels with a natural stone, you have your work cut out for you. I figure anyone who can afford a knife in a high-wear resistant stainless can afford a diamond or cubic boron nitride sharpener. There's no difference in how hard/easy it is to sharpen a conventional steel and a high-wear resistant stainless steel if you're using one of those two sharpener types. But certainly those who refuse to use a sharpener commensurate with the wear properties of the steel they're using can set themselves up for frustration.
What most folks want out of a kitchen knife is a steel that will take a fine edge and stand up to light chopping on a good cutting board (plastic or wood, NOT glass or stone). There's absolutely no reason to go with a high-wear resistant stainless for that because that kind of steel is designed for cutting through things that are abrasive. Foods are not abrasive as long as you don't use your fine-edge kitchen knife for cutting through bones. Something with good corrosion resistance, and reasonable toughness (for a stainless steel) will be a good option for a kitchen knife and won't break the bank. I think AEB-L would be a really good kitchen knife steel, but frankly, just about any decent stainless will do a really good job if the knife is not abused.
Ranger99
Member
Just me- if I can't restore an edge
with my old Norton 2 sided pocket
whetstone in the middle of nowhere,
It's not something I need.
I've managed to get closer to the
end of my days with decent quality
cutlery that can be easily restored to
sharpness by hand, and I don't
really need anything better.
( I've had expensive knives with
blades of "supersteel" and they don't
cut any deeper than a run-of-the-mill
decent knife from wallyworld)
IMO- the whole supersteel thing is
because the art of sharpening one's
own cutlery freehand with a common
whetstone has been lost along the
line somewhere. There's not really
any shame. That's why the replaceable
blade knives are so popular today.
To each their own
with my old Norton 2 sided pocket
whetstone in the middle of nowhere,
It's not something I need.
I've managed to get closer to the
end of my days with decent quality
cutlery that can be easily restored to
sharpness by hand, and I don't
really need anything better.
( I've had expensive knives with
blades of "supersteel" and they don't
cut any deeper than a run-of-the-mill
decent knife from wallyworld)
IMO- the whole supersteel thing is
because the art of sharpening one's
own cutlery freehand with a common
whetstone has been lost along the
line somewhere. There's not really
any shame. That's why the replaceable
blade knives are so popular today.
To each their own
Ranger99
Member
^ ^ ^ ^ these ^ ^ ^ ^
If I can't easily sharpen a knife in a
few minutes, it's useless to me
The people that cut up meat for a
living don't use cutlery costing
hundreds of dollars per piece.
The majority use the same knives
that any of us can readily buy
for 20-30 dollars each
Most of my big using knives are in 5160. I tend to use them for a few minutes, give them 7 licks on each side with steel, etc. My smaller knives are mostly in S30V or 440C.
I've regularly used 5160 knives for over 25 years
John
I've regularly used 5160 knives for over 25 years
John
Yup. Learning to use a honing steel properly can significantly improve cutting performance between sharpenings and extend the useful cutting life of an edge before sharpening is required. Especially for conventional carbon steels and low alloy stainless steels.
They can also do just the opposite because most people don't understand honing steels, how they work, how to use them properly, or even what they should look like. The latter is compounded by the fact that a lot of honing/"sharpening" steels are not really made the way they should be.
They can also do just the opposite because most people don't understand honing steels, how they work, how to use them properly, or even what they should look like. The latter is compounded by the fact that a lot of honing/"sharpening" steels are not really made the way they should be.
Flat Rock
Member
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- Dec 28, 2022
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- 173
Yep, expecting to sharpen a Vanadium Carbide rich steel (S30-S90V etc) with stones is gonna be frustrating.
In my opinion, AEB-L is a fantastic kitchen knife steel. It was made to be thin and tough as it was originally developed for shaving razor steel.
It takes a wicked edge, and can be ground very thin, resulting in excellent cutting geometry.
And you can touch it up with a steel in a few strokes.
The knives in my kitchen are AEB-L
Old Dog
Member
Great question and comments. Concur 100%. When the super-steels became more common, I was onboard all the way, until... it became time to sharpen them.
PS - @Flat Rock Dinner at your place? Are you the chef? Rarely do threads on THR make me hungry for a good meal, but here we are...
Flat Rock
Member
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2022
- Messages
- 173
We cook almost every night around here!
couple nights ago...
got some oyster mushrooms, and herbs from the garden
made chicken roulades stuffed with smoked ham, muenster cheese and sauteed oyster mushrooms
mushroom cream sauce, broccoli rabe and rice pilaf
Old Dog
Member
^ wow! Rarely compelled to show threads on this forum to the wife (the chef in our family), but I think she'll be impressed with your style.
Good looking chef's knife, too, by the way. AEB-L is something we need to look into.
Good looking chef's knife, too, by the way. AEB-L is something we need to look into.
OP
OP
Car, watch, lawn mower, ... Beyond need it is just want.
OP
OP
Steeling, stropping, and honing will keep a knife sharp longer and avoid the abrasive lose of material longer that sharpening results in.
dobedo
Member
If you can get ahold of some it would be HY80 or HY100C3
md7
Member
This post makes a ton of sense.
Admittedly, my carbon steel Case Trapper is nowhere close to being the best. But it’s easy to sharpen, does what I need, and I really enjoy the knife. Guess enjoyment is reason enough, or close to it.
I can’t see how I’d be well enough served by the latest and greatest to justify leaving what I have.
That, and I’m not sure I have the skill set to sharpen some of these new steels if I’m totally honest.
But I do see the appeal for knife enthusiasts, and it’s interesting to watch progress.
