30-06 load; considering 2 powders

[johnandersonoutdoors]

Hey all,

I am not a new reloader, but I have not loaded for rifle yet. I am looking to take advantage of a sale on H380 or H414. I noticed that my Speer manual marks these choices with an * which indicates that "magnum primers used with this powder." I also have a the Modern Reloading manual, but I see no such indication in that manual.

I only have standard rifle primers on hand. Can anyone speak to using a standard rifle primer in this scenario? Will I be able to develop a descent load that is also safe? Btw, I am also planning to pick up some Sierra 150 SBT or maybe the 180s.

I appreciate any input you can provide.

 

[Curator]

Both powder choices are "OK" for use in the .30-06. Unfortunately, you did not specify what kind of gun you will be shooting with your reloads. (semi-auto, Military, bolt action, etc.) I have never found magnum primers to be necessary with either powder, but I am in Florida. In cold situations, magnum primers do offer better ignition with slow burning powders. In my experience with several .30-06 rifles, I have found the 180 grain bullets give better accuracy with slow powders, and flat-based more accurate than boat-tail at ranges under 300 yards.

 

[johnandersonoutdoors]

Curator,

I will be loading for my bolt action Remington 700 adl. Thanks for the reply.

 

[sage5907]

I don't know what state you are in but unless you are going after elk or moose you wouldn't need 180 grain bullets. The Sierra 150 grain GameKing is a great bullet and will work well for you. It is my choice for the 30-06 and I shoot several hundred of them each year. As you mentioned, the powders that you listed are shown in the Speer manual and they will work with standard rifle primers unless you hunt in really cold temperatures. I have always used magnum primers with IMR 4064 but that is because I hunt in temperatures down into the teens. I think the powders that you listed are ball powders and that explains why Speer makes that reference. If your accuracy is not very good that will tell you to get magnum primers. When you get around to trying other powders my favorite with the Sierra 150 grain GameKing is 57 grains of Reloader 17 and it works with standard large rifle primers.. Another of my favorite loads is 51 grains of IMR 4064 with magnum primers and it gives less recoil than the Reloader 17 but it is not quite as accurate. There are many experienced users of the 30-06 on thehighroad and you will get some good suggestions. Good luck with your reloading.

 

[johnandersonoutdoors]

Sage,

Thanks, I guess 150 would be more appropriate. I will be using the loads for target practice and possibly hunting. Being that the Speer manual recommends magnum primers with those powders, I am concerned about consistent ignition and accuracy (based on some online reading of forums, etc). In your view, it shouldn't be a problem?

 

[GooseGestapo]

You're overthinking it.
The .30/06 is VERY flexible in regards to both bullet weights and powders.
I've shot and loaded for the .30/06 for 43yrs. I've used many powders, most from Bullseye to H4831.
However, there are so many suitable powders I haven't gotten around to, and likely won't. H380 is just one of them. Appears to give excellent speed, but less efficient cost wise, and temp sensitive. (Hence need for mag primers in cold climates).
I have used H414, and it's good. Very similar to its extruded analog, IMR4350. However, it (H414) isn't as accurate as IMR4350. 59.0gr IMR4350 with 150-155gr is highly regarded as a target powder in bolt action rifles, but I've never tried it with 150's!
IMR 4064 is outstanding, but needs to be individually weighed like IMR4350 as they don't measure real well.
After decades of shooting bolt actions, I aquired an M1, then another! (Strange how that happens!). I've found that I now MUCH prefer good old H4895.
I run 48.0gr in my M1's with the Hornady 150gr FMJ for practice and Garand matches. I like this load with the 150gr Hornady soft points for deer, and have become indifferent about the extra 200fps possible with other powders due to its accuracy and easier nature (less expensive, measures accurately and less recoil/muzzle blast).

Varget, BLC2, and RL15 besides IMR4064 and both 4895's are my preferences for the .30/06. No need for mag primers, though the use of them won't hurt either.
For 165gr or heavier, you can't beat either H4350, my absolute favorite, RL17!
Good luck! It's a deep forest you're heading into (reloading the .30/06). Lots of side trails, for sure!!!

 

[MEHavey]

FOR THE OP:
Both are Ball Powders --> Recommend MAG (or military CCI-34) primer as default.
Of the two, I'd go w/ H380

 

[Dale shaver]

IMR or Hodgdon 4895 work wonderful. Good for hunting and long range shots.

 

[johnandersonoutdoors]

Thanks for the replies.

So the magnum primer is recommended by the Speer manual, and others on this thread. However, it isn't necessary. I guess I will have to experiment and see the results that I get.

 

[243winxb]

Ball powders need a mag primer.

Standard primers caused no ignition issues at the max load but posted higher extreme variations in pressure and velocity in the lower pressure regimes of the start loads. In extreme cases, the start loads produced short delayed firings—

Read more: http://www.shootingtimes.com/ammo/ammunition_st_mamotaip_200909/#ixzz58GHIuS5O

 

[ArchAngelCD]

H414 = W760. It is very similar to H4350 which is my favorite bolt action 30-06 powder.

Your Speer manual recommends a magnum primer for H414 because it's a ball powder and back then all ball powders were thought to require a magnum powder. Ball powders in larger cases do preformed better with magnum primers.

There is nothing wrong with a 180gr bullet in the 30-06. While the 150gr bullet is popular in the 308 Win the 180gr bullet is almost standard in the 30-06. That said I go in a slightly different direction and load a 165/168gr bullet in the 30-06. It's also my main hunting cartridge in a bolt action rifle.

H414 will work well especially with a 180gr bullet but I found accuracy to be better with either H4350 or IMR4350. I use a CCI or Winchester LRP with 4350.

 

[hot chili powder]

Have loaded 100's of '06 ammo using 150 or 165 gr Nosler BT or Hornady SST bullets. My load is 55 grs of H414 with COL of 3.35....great hunting accuracy in a Rem 700, just sayin'!

 

[eastbank]

rem 7600 carbine with a 2x7 leupold scope and loaded with a 165 nosler BT and 55grs imr 4350 at 100 yards, left target three shots with 180gr factory and the right target three shots with my reloads.

 

[illinoisburt]

If this was a few years back during the component shortage, I would understand. As it is now I dont get it. Unless the powder is super discounted (like under $10/pound) it will take a heck of a lot of volume to realize much savings versus more common and better performing standards like 4064, 3031, or 4895, especially if different primers might be needed for reliability in cold temps.

 

[Captcurt]

Can't go wrong with IMR-4350 or IMR-4831 in a 06 when you are talking 150gr-180gr.

 

[LUCKYDAWG13]

I think your 06 will decide I went through a few powders and bullet weights I did end up with IMR 4350 and a 150gr bullet

 

[johnandersonoutdoors]

Thanks for the replies everyone.

hot chilli powder
In the load you described are you using standard primers?

illinoisburt
All I know is the two powders I asked about are on the list in both of my books and the discount is extremely deep, like 50%. Therefore, I thought maybe I could give them a try, but then I saw the * that said using magnum primers so I came here to ask.

Again, thanks everyone. I am in no rush on this. I have about 100 rounds of factory 30-06 sitting around, but I have the dies and few hundred pieces of brass that was once fired in my rem 700.

 

[Slamfire]

For a bolt gun I am going to recommend any of the 4350's. That is IMR 4350, AA4350 or H4350. These are also outstanding powders in the 6.5 cartridges, the 270 Win.







I am going to re test loads in this Sako, my 100 yard testing shows good ten shot groups.







This load was a standard match load with 168's, and 175grain bullets. IMR 4895 is an outstanding powder in the 308 Win, it was the powder used in the National Match cartridges, both 308 and 30-06. Very accurate, a bit slow but still very accurate.

 

[Reloadron]

I noticed that my Speer manual marks these choices with an * which indicates that "magnum primers used with this powder." I also have a the Modern Reloading manual, but I see no such indication in that manual.

See the post #10 by 243winxb. My older Speer #12 Manual uses the same * to denote the use of magnum primers. The logic behind using the magnum primers is to ensure full and complete uniform ignition of ball or spherical powders. You will see the same for powders like Hodgdon H380, Win 760, AA 2520 and other ball or spherical powders. Newer manuals, as you have noticed seem to have abandoned this practice, matter of fact I was told the following Speer #13 manual stopped the practice but I don't know that for sure. My older Lyman 45th Edition also makes no mention of using magnum primers. While I seldom load those powders in my 30-06 cartridges when I have I used magnum primers simply because I have them available. The link 243winxb posted is a good read on the subject.

Ron

 

[Varminterror]

For 30-06, if it can’t be done best with 4064 or one of the 4350’s, then you’re not doing it right.

For me, after 25+ years reloading the .30-06, bullets outside of 165-180grn no longer interest me. It’s best performance is achieved in these weights.

 

[Catpop]

H4895 under 150 gr Sierra at 200 yards. 2 scope adjustment shots and one final 3 shot group. This was factory recommended 60% of max load from a 1973 30-06 Win m70. Rifle sighted in at 100 yards dropped 11” at 200 yards with 60% Load.

 

[jmr40]

There isn't much downside to shooting 180 gr bullets in 30-06. Although my Winchester seems to like 165 gr Accubonds just a touch better. H4350 is my go-to powder, but have used IMR4350 and Ramshot Hunter in the past with good results as well.

 

[Stumper]

The question isn't so much whether you must have magnum primers with H380 or 414 so much as what primers do you have? CCI developed magnum primers a LONG time ago because their testing with ball powder showed a need for higher brisance with those powders......CCI standard primers are very mild. OTOH Winchester/Western/Olin who developed the ball powders loaded scads of it with standard primers......but the Winchester standard primer is almost as hot as the CCI magnum!

 

[Nature Boy]

I worked up a good load for this hunting season using 180g Sierra Prohunters and RL22



60.5g of RL22 gave me 2,745 fps. Cold bore shot on the left, 5 shot group on the right.



I was pressed for time (day before leaving for a week of hunting) so I cut load development short and called it good. Likely could have tightened that group up with some tweaking.

Got to the camp the next day. Threw my hunting togs on and halled ass to my spot so I could get a hunt in before dark.

I was in my spot a total of 15 minutes when he hopped the fence and into the field about 140 yards away



Punched through both shoulders.

Load = developed

 

[johnandersonoutdoors]

Stumper,

The large rifle primers that I have on hand are sellier & bellot.