338-06 vs 35 Whelen

[LRDGCO]

Used the search feature and read a good deal of excellent information and some nonsense, which was nevertheless entertaining.

This is then, an opinion piece. I am leaning Whelen but want to make sure I haven’t missed out on info that favors the 338-06.

I want a rifle for elk under 300 yards to shoot 225 grs bullets at roughly 2600. Both will do so. The Whelen does so with a bit less recoil, but the marginally better defined shoulder of the 338 may mitigate headspace concerns? This will be a hand loading proposition in either caliber, so relative factory ammo availability isn’t a consideration.

The intended rifle is a Thompson/Center Dimension. While no looker, the one I have in 30-06 is quite accurate and the ease of barrel changes means that a JES Rebore (Jesse Occumpaugh in Oregon) of a 24” barrel puts me in a quality, consistent rifle that I am already familiar with in both 30-06 and either 338-06 or 35 Whelen for $400, after having a new 30-06 barrel rebored (ie, in addition to the existing 30-06).

If the consensus is six of one and half a dozen of the other, then I’ll go 35. Thanks for your time and consideration.

 

[DM~]

The Whelen does so with a bit less recoil

IF you use bullets with the same SD, the .338-06 will have less recoil...

With the same weight bullets, you would never feel any difference.

DM

 

[adcoch1]

The advantage of the 35 whelen is the availability of softer bullets for lighter game or downloading for less recoil. There aren't very many 338 projectiles that will reliably expand from a 338-06 unless you max out its loading. For hunting it matters. I went 35 whelen after weighing this question for several years, and while I haven't taken game with my rifle yet, I am confident I made the right choice FOR ME. Ymmv, and it is really a 6 in one hand /half dozen in the other if we are talking max loads. Truthfully thae 30-06 can do the job of both too, and 35 whelen is a big enough difference in diameter to matter to me.

 

[jmr40]

I've had all three, 30-06, 338-06, and 35 Whelen. Unless you go to bullets 250gr + stay with 30-06. A 200 gr Accubond or ELDX from a 30-06 at 2700 fps hits harder, shoots flatter, retains energy for kills far beyond 300 yards, and penetrates deeper than either 35 Whelen or 338-06 at any range. With those bullet weights.

It is bullet LENGTH that determines how well bullets penetrate. A 35 caliber 225 gr bullet is a short stubby bullet that has poor flight characteristics and doesn't penetrate as well. If you go up in caliber, you have to go up in bullet weight in order to gain any advantage.

The added bullet diameter just isn't an advantage. Wrap a strip of paper once around a 30 caliber bullet and you now have a 33 caliber bullet, twice around and you have a 35 caliber bullet. The thickness of 1-2 sheets of paper just isn't going to make a hole enough bigger to matter.

Recoil from a 35 Whelen is almost identical to 300 WM. A 338-06 is ever so slightly less.

Once I saw enough test results showing 30-06 out penetrating 33 and 35 caliber rifles I sold mine. If I were going bigger than 30-06 I'd go 9.3X62. These shoot bullets heavy enough to show some advantage over 30-06. If you go with 35 Whelen I'd be looking at heavier bullets. Another advantage of the 35 Whelen is being able to shoot light loads with pistol bullets. But with todays modern bullets we have people killing elk at 1/2 mile with 24 and 26 caliber rifles. I just don't see the point of anything larger than 30 caliber anymore.

 

[.308 Norma]

I'd go with the 35. To me, the 35 Whelen just seems more "classic" than the 338-06, if you know what I mean. Besides, I think it might be kinda fun to mess around with some of those 158gr, 357 handgun bullets in a 35 Whelen - maybe for rockchucks in the summertime, if I kept the distances within reason.

 

[Slamfire]

I went and got a 35 Whelen because I wanted one









I will say the sucker kicks, that big thick recoil pad is wonderful. I have removed the big scope and put a shorter one on, because I got tired of that scope bell hitting my glasses on recoil. Based on my shooting at CMP Talladega, 300 yards is fine with this cartridge. I tried 200 gr RN at 600 yards and the amount of elevation I had to put on was like, 31 MOA. A 30-06 would be about 12 MOA. I have not gone down and tried spitzer 200 grain bullets yet, that will be interesting. The greatest problem I have shooting accurately with this rifle is due to something called a flinch. Shoot enough 200 grain, 225 grain, or God forbid, 250 grain bullets, and you will be bucking like a jackass before the trigger breaks.

Based on talks with guys who have actually used 35 Whelen's hunting, this round will put real hurt on anything it hits. The bullet mass and diameter makes a wide, deep, hole.

 

[someguy2800]

The 338 is going to be quite a bit flatter shooting with less wind drift with the same bullet weight due to the ballistic coeficient. Given the range your wanting to hunt I would pick the 338-06 or just a 30-06. A 225 grain 358 bullet is pretty stubby.

 

[Varminterror]

If it’s your first, get the 338-06 and be done with it. My first of the two was a 35 Whelen, so I personally enjoy it a lot for that nostalgia, but I almost always recommend the 338-06 over the Whelen to others. It’s not a 50/50 coin flip. Pick your parameter, the 338 will win the toss most often. More bullet selection means more choice of better bullets for whatever application you choose AND more access in inventory.

So when my whimsy shows itself, I shoot a Whelen. More often, my pragmatic side shines through and I reach for a 338-06 over the Whelen, and honestly, I reach for a 338wm more often than either.

 

[Bill1225]

I'm personally a fan of .338 bullets and in my mind all things equal besides the diameter the sd of the 338 will out penetrate the 35 whelan . I also like to keep it simple 210 and 250 nosler partitions just plain work

 

[DM~]

There aren't very many 338 projectiles that will reliably expand from a 338-06 unless you max out its loading.

This is totally NOT true...

Every bullet made for the .338 Federal will easily expand in a deer as will several 200 grain bullets from several bullet makers.

DM

 

[farmerboy78]

I've never handled a 338-06, but I have had a 35 whelen and it is a real winner. make sure you get a brake for it to tame it down some. I used mine for whitetail in Arkansas. the whelen would blow them off there feet @ 150yds with 200gr barnes or 225 sgk... it's more than adequate for elk at the distance you spoke of. it will hit like a demolition ball.

 

[Coal Dragger]

Bullet selection alone would make me pick the .338-06, it’s just a more flexible choice.

If you want to step up and stay on the .30-06 bolt face get a barrel in 9.3X62. In my mind a rifle you can swap between .30-06 and 9.3X62 Mauser will pretty much cover anything you want to hunt in North America. That 9.3X62 opens up bullet choices that can flatten big critters with considerably more authority than a .338 or .35 will open up, not because the two smaller calibers are bad but because the 9.3 is an established cartridge for African hunting and tough heavy bullets are readily available for it.

 

[FLIGHT762]

I went with 338/06. No regrets.

 

[LoonWulf]

I would choose the .338-06 for a bolt gun and the range specified.

I'd personally prefer the .35 wheelen in a slide action with an 18-20" barrel. Tho I'd consider the .35WAI in a bolt gun.

 

[darkcloud]

338-06 with a Hornady 225 grain spire soft point. Plenty tough bullet construction for the caliber and what you want to use it for and will reliably expand. Will even work well for deer and not waste meat like many magnums will with lighter for caliber bullets.

 

[sage5907]

No matter which one of the calibers you select you have to like the rifle before you will like the cartridge. I have seen people turn their nose up at a particular cartridge and it was more about their not liking the rifle than the cartridge. I have heard many gunsmiths say that a 338-06 performs at a level higher than expected and that has been my experience. I have a 338-06 and I really like the rifle and the cartridge. My only regret is that I didn't own one 30 years ago.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

I want a rifle for elk under 300 yards to shoot 225 grs bullets at roughly 2600. Both will do so. The Whelen does so with a bit less recoil,.

Same bullet weight, same velocity, same recoil in rifles of equal weight.

 

[LRDGCO]

Thanks for sharing experiences and experienced views. Lots of support for 338-06 and consensus seems to be that 338 bullets aren’t too hardy for the -06.

A few surprises above but where I’m coming out is that the step from .308 to .358 is significant and from .308 to .338, less so.

Thanks very much.

 

[DM~]

I bought my first 350 Rem. Mag in about 1973, it pushes the same bullet at the same speed as a Whelen does. After about a year of killing big game with it, including a few moose ect., I wasn't super impressed with it. SO, I thought I'd try a .338-06, actually, I had PO Ackley re-bore a 30-06 I owned to .338-06...

After extensive bullet testing, that rifle went hunting and took moose, brown bear and a few other big game animals. I was so impressed with the cartridge, I had another built and it became my full time hunting rifle! Over the years, I shot several moose, blk. bear, brn. bear, caribou and many others.

I still have that rifle and I still think I made the right choice…

DM

 

[Vern Humphrey]

My heavy rifle is a customized '03 Springfield in .35 Brown-Whelen. This is the .35 Whelen, with all the taper taken out of the case, and the shoulder moved forward and made much sharper. I drive a 225 grain Nosler Partition Jacket 2,800 fps. This rifle flattens elk!

 

[VoodooMountain]

I would go for a 35 caliber simply for the ability to use pistol bullets.

Here's an excerpt from a well respected authoritarian who has witnessed the harvest thousands of animals.

-----------------

The increase in frontal area makes the .35 Whelen noticeably superior to the .338” bore. When using the .338 bore, the hunter must at times be careful with bullet selection in order to avoid having a bullet that is too tough for the job at hand. The .338 bore excels on larger bodied deer but can on occasion be left wanting if lean animals are encountered. In contrast to this, the .35 bore firing bullets of the same weight displays far greater and much faster energy transfer. So much so, that we sometimes see bullet blow back as a result of hydraulic forces. In these instances, entry wounds may at times be as large as exit wounds. Furthermore, the .358’s can display this performance at mild impact velocities. The .358’s not wholly reliant on velocity in the same manner as the small bores. In plain terms, one cannot have a full understanding of terminal ballistics until one has studied this bore diameter and this cartridge in particular.

https://www.ballisticstudies.com/Knowledgebase/.35+Whelen.html
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[highlander 5]

Many a moon ago ( late 80s) a friend had a 338 Win mag and at that time 338 cal bullets were like hen's teeth. That may be something to think about in your caliber choice.

 

[Dr T]

35 Whelen. Some of the first factory brass from Remington had headspace problems (I had to get the factory to replace a couple of hundred unfired cases when the first Remington factory brass was introduced). I haven't heard of any problems in over 20 years, however.

 

[Rodman579]

I have owned several of each. the 338-06 will have less recoil than the 35 Whelen as others have stated. I didn't personally see any difference between them on game or a 30-06 with quality bullets. I just sold my last 338-06 a couple weeks ago and it was my favorite rifle but not because of the caliber.

 

[mustanger98]

This thread sounds like hunting an excuse to buy another rifle. As if anybody here really needs an excuse.

The OP question of .338-06 vs .35Whelan... I don't have a frame of reference, so no pro/con comment. However, I recall Jack O'Connor ("The Hunting Rifle", 1971) talking about .30-06 using 180gr and 220gr bullets on Alaskan bears and Indian tigers, respectively. Professional tiger hunters said you needed the 220's to penetrate. IIRC, Mr O'Connor said the 180's would zip through a grizzly and keep going and they're thicker than an average tiger. Now this is just me thinking, but it seems if a modern load of 180gr .30-06 will zip through a big bear, it'd probably do the same on an elk, depending on shot placement/angle, out to 300yds.

Whatever you get, have fun.