.338 Win Mag to 35 Whelen conversion.

[GuyWithGun]

Have been reading you guys' posts for a long time and I dig this site! Had some tech questions and figured I would finally register and start here for info.

I have a newly manufactured Winchester 70 in .338 Win mag that is proving to be an issue. It never really shot that well (3 moa at 100y was the BEST it ever did with any load) and took it to a gun smith several times for various adjustments and other things. At the end of the day, has just gotten to be more trouble than is worth. Started looking around for new 338 Win and the recoil thing kept nagging at me, so looked into .338-06 or 35 Whelen... 35 Whelen won. Looked at actions and old 30-06 class rifles to build it out of and then remembered I have a perfectly good (presumable) Model 70 long action to build it out of. The issues start there:

1) The gunsmith I had working on it bedded the barrel in an attempt to "stiffen up the barrel". It helped but not much, put up the gun and didn;t think too much of it until I tried to take it appart recently... silly guy had glued to barrel to the stock with the epoxy. Not sure if it was intentional or not, but didn't fix the accuracy problem and now can't get the gun appart. How does one fix that? Can it be done without screwing up the Bell and Carlson stock I kind of like and would rather not mess up?

2) How to you convert the bolt from .338 wign to .30-06. New assembles from Winchester are kinda steep, is there another way to do it?

Thanks,
Eric

 

[StrawHat]

Converting from a large belted case to a smaller unbelted case will require a new bolt, at least. Not sure how common they are for Winchesters. (I have a Remington 722 that needs a bolt and am not having much luck finding one.)

Than you would also need a new barrel as the 35 Whelen would swim in the 333 WM chamber.

How big is your freezer? I believe if you could freeze the rifle, the barrel would detach from the stock.

 

[jmr40]

It'd be much cheaper to sell it and buy what you want than to try to convert it to one of those chamberings.

 

[hardluk1]

As jmr40 said.
Sounds like your smthy ,really is not a gun smth after all.

 

[Mobuck]

Just sell the 338 for whatever you can get out of it and buy a factory 35 Wh or the components to have someone other than the guy who worked on your 338 build a 35 Wh. I've had I.T.&D. in Minerva OH rebarrel several Mausers and all have been adequate for my uses. They might even have a takeoff barrel that would save you some bucks.
If you want to salvage the B&C stock, put the rifle in the deepfreeze for 10-12 hours. Make sure ALL the action screws are removed, get someone to help hold the stock upside down, and whack the bottom of the barrel just in front of the fore end tip with a nonmarring hammer. It might also be handy to have a wood dowel or other nonmarring punch that will fit through the magazine well so you can whack there also. This treatment usually breaks the bond on accidently glued in actions.

 

[GuyWithGun]

Is a wife thing. Made a deal a couple years back that I could modify any gun I wanted, as much as I wanted, just couldn't buy new ones. I'm sure I could sell it and get a new one, but would feel bad knowing it is a lemon. If I can get the barrel out without ruining the stock would be worth doing I think.

I doubt I would have to replace the entire bolt assembly, just not sure what parts need changed. Rebarreling was a given, too skinny to ream out to a .358 bore anyway. Looking at putting a 22" #5 on whatever I build. If can salvage the stock and not buy a whole bolt assembly I would still come out way ahead of buying a new one (don't like the 1:16 twist of factory barrels anyway) because have to but a new barrel either way.

Worse cone to worse, I could buy a new Howa and even with new barrel would still come in under $1000. If I can salvage what I have cheaper than that, would rather make it work.

And yes, smithy is fired...

 

[Patocazador]

Is a wife thing. Made a deal a couple years back that I could modify any gun I wanted, as much as I wanted, just couldn't buy new ones. I'm sure I could sell it and get a new one, but would feel bad knowing it is a lemon. If I can get the barrel out without ruining the stock would be worth doing I think.

I doubt I would have to replace the entire bolt assembly, just not sure what parts need changed. Rebarreling was a given, too skinny to ream out to a .358 bore anyway. Looking at putting a 22" #5 on whatever I build. If can salvage the stock and not buy a whole bolt assembly I would still come out way ahead of buying a new one (don't like the 1:16 twist of factory barrels anyway) because have to but a new barrel either way.

Worse cone to worse, I could buy a new Howa and even with new barrel would still come in under $1000. If I can salvage what I have cheaper than that, would rather make it work.

And yes, smithy is fired...

Just be honest with the potential buyer if that's the sticking point. As I see it, the truth is that you are recoil sensitive like me. The gun shoots as good as a lot of new rifles out of the box. With a free-floated barrel and handloads you could probably get the gun to shoot better. Someone would be glad to have the gun if it was less than retail.

 

[jmr40]

You would have been better off to have contacted Winchester about returning the rifle to them rather than letting a gunsmith work on it. If it is one of the new producton FN rifles I'm sure they would have made it right even if it meant sending you a new rifle Even if you didn't buy it new.

Now that it has been modified by a gunsmith I doubt if they will work on it under warranty, but it wouldn't hurt to ask. If they find the problem was a factroy defect they may still cover the costs. Even if they charge you for the work you will likely get a satisfactory rifle, for less than you paid your gunsmith.

You also need to expain the economics of modifying, vs selling and buying to your wife. Gunsmths are more expensive then gunstores

 

[StrawHat]

...I doubt I would have to replace the entire bolt assembly, just not sure what parts need changed...

Are Winchester bolts not one piece? I know some of the companies had bolts with removable heads but was not aware that Winchester followed that practice.

 

[R.W.Dale]

I get around those "wife things" on the technicality that a TRADE isn't buying a new gun

 

[natman]

You can't convert a338 to a 35 Whelen, at least not for a couple of times what it would cost to buy a new gun in 35W.

 

[panhead58ak]

Sometimes a tightly bedded gun can be tough to take apart,sometimes freezing helps .hopfully they used a mold release,some times you need to plug holes with clay and pay attention to geometric shapes that would lock the action in place when the bedding hardens. another trick I use is to turn a piece of aluminum bar stock to fit in the bolt recess tap a 1/4 inch hole in it to attach a slide hammer to often a quick shock to the receiver seperates more than a lot of slow steady pressure. goog luck!

 

[GuyWithGun]

The "no new guys" wasn't a economic decision as much ad a having a bunch of guns I don't really use one. She would rather me spend more money on a gun I don't use to make me like it enough to pull it out of the safe regularly than buy a new one to add to the pile. Having said that, a trade would work. If the freezing thing works and I can get the silly thing apart, I consider it tradeable. I have my serious doubts it will ever get even close to MOA even with handloads, but if somebody else wants to try that is their business.

Is kind of funny how impractical magnum cartridges are for the most part. When I started looking into the .338-06 and realized there was little if any functional difference between that and my 338 win I felt silly for even buying it to begin with. It seems that you spend a whole bunch of money, put up with heavier guns and more recoil, and increase your reloading expenses to buy a magnum rifle that will make, possibly, a small difference from 400-500 yards over a non-magnum rifle. folks tend to learn from things that hurt and from things that cost them money... This rifle has done both! :banghead:

 

[Craigman]

I felt silly for even buying it to begin with

Dont feel bad at all! Where is the average guy going to find 338-06 ammo or 35 whelan ammo. Or much of a selection. Also the recoil on those is very close to the 338win mag. I have a whelan and a 338wm. The whelan is less but i attribute that mostly to the Pachmeyr pad on it. Maybe try a pad.? I just put one on my .375HH and it feels easier to shoot than my 270wsm now. A good pad makes a Big difference!!!

 

[Abel]

I would just send it to Rifles Inc. and let them "fix" it. New stock, new barrel, new bolt. Same receiver/action.

http://www.riflesinc.com/riflemodels.html

 

[natman]

I would just send it to Rifles Inc. and let them "fix" it. New stock, new barrel, new bolt. Same receiver/action.

http://www.riflesinc.com/riflemodels.html

That won't address the feed rails, which will be too wide in a magnum. It's one thing to open up feed rails to fit a wider cartridge, but it's hard to close them up to fit a narrower one.

The OP would be money ahead to throw the 338 in a lake and just buy a 35 Whelen if that's what he wants rather than try to turn a 338 into a 35 Whelen.

 

[lathedog]

Did you discuss this with your wife?

She might grant you a waiver.

I concur with the posts that the guy who did the work did you dirty. Not a real gunsmith.

 

[GlockNation]

Deal with the Devil

Is a wife thing. Made a deal a couple years back that I could modify any gun I wanted, as much as I wanted, just couldn't buy new ones.

Go to the crossroads and deal with the Devil for a new 35W.

 

[lefteyedom]

Be differant and original M70 in 264 Winchester

Be different and Original at the same time.

Find a Gunsmith that knows what he is doing, Then spend the money and have the action trued up and a new barrel correctly installed.

If you are not in love with the 338 Win Mag (I love mine) then go to the other end of the 458 parent case and get a 264 Win Mag Barrel.

This would require only a rebarrel, there are a plenty of 7Mag and 300 mag but not many 264 Win Mags