38 Special Target Load Advice

[Knowone]

I am preparing to begin reloading for the first time in ~35 Years. I have been reading through a number of posts here and really appreciate how you help each other out.
My first loads will be 38 Special target loads using Berry's 125 gr FP bullets. My understanding is that I need to limit myself to a moderate taper crimp to avoid damaging the plating. I have also read that some powders need either a strong crimp or full load to burn consistently. Considering the powders that I have available (Accurate #2, Alliant BE-6, Hodgdon CFE Pistol, and Ramshot True Blue), A#2 appears to be best suited for target loads. The Western powder load data shows a min 4.2gr A#2 with a Rainer 125gr HP and COL of 1.440". Starting with this load, can anyone give me advice on the COL for the Berry's 125gr FP? I know that it should be shorter than the HP, but not by how much. I will be shooting these out of a S&W Model 60 3" bbl.

 

[mdi]

I think I'd use starting data and OAL for a 125 gr. JHP. The 38 Special is a very forgiving caliber and a lot of "lee way" is allowed. Personally, I don't (won't) use plated bullets in revolvers mainly because of crimping (I reloaded my first 38 in '69 and seated the bullet to the crimp groove and have done the same with all my revolver loads since). "Normally" slower powders need a firm crimp and AA#2 should be OK with a taper crimp...

 

[tightgroup tiger]

Your shooting 38 spl out of a .357 Magnum pistol, and your starting at minimum load for .38 spl. It won't matter where you seat as long as it's close to the Ranier's seating depth.
You can make the seating depth the same as the hollowpoint or you can make them longer as long as you have good neck tension.
I started using 38 caliber taper crimp dies with my plated bullets for .357 Magnum mid range loads. They don't slip around from recoil so your .38 spl or +P loads won't either.
You don't have to use a roll crimp.
The ,38 SPL case is so big that the slight decrease in OAL won't even effect it if you want to shorten them up anyways. Just take a cannulared 125gr bullet and hold it up against the side of the case and set your seater with your Berry's 125gr FP to mimic it as if it had a cannular.
There is no magic formula.

 

[Dudedog]

I don't believe that bullet has a crimp grove, so I would just seat it where most of the bearing surface is in the case.
OAL should not be super critical in a revolver.
More of the bullet in the case gives better neck tension and seems to shoot better for me.

 

[.38 Special]

I agree that OAL is not especially important in this situation. With a fast burning powder like AA #2 the crimp doesn't much matter either, assuming the expander die isn't overdoing its job.

In the OP's shoes (and I have been) I would ensure that the bullet is a tight fit in a sized case. Then I would seat it so that between two thirds to three quaters of the parallel portion of the bullet is inside the case, and then crimp enough to remove the case mouth flare. Then I'd shove the cartridge nose against the edge of the bench to see if the bullet wants to stay put. If not, the crimp die can be adjusted for a bit more grip, or - my preference - the expander ball can be turned down just a bit to ensure good case tension.

 

[Cokeman]

I am right where you are with the same Berry’s bullets, just different powder. Mine is HP-38. I got a roll crimp die at the advice of people here. I am hoping that I can make the crimp the same as the factory ammo I have. I figure I can do a light crimp and then adjust heavier if needed.

 

[George P]

I have never had good luck with 125 grain, regardless of lead, plated or coated in my 38s and 357s. My guns all prefer either 148WC or 158 SWC for best accuracy.

 

[rfwobbly]

I know bullets are hard to come by right now, but the standard bullet for 38 target loads are 148gr. Berry makes a very nice Dual Ended Wad Cutter (DEWC) in that weight that performs very nicely.

When you use bullets without a cannelure (like plated bullets are often found), then you must taper crimp. The one exception to this is the DEWC which seats flush and gets the mouth of the case lightly roll crimped over the meplat.

Hope this helps.

 

[Knowone]

Thanks all for your replies. Since the consensus is the this load should not be sensitive to bullet seating depth, I will take the advise from Dudedog and 38 Special and seat the bullet using most of the land and ensure a snug fit. I went with 125’s since I couldn’t find the 148 HBWC that I initially intended. I went with plated to reduce lead exposure. The impetus to do this is that my wife has expressed interest in going to the range. I will have her shoot my 380 and the 38 spcl to see what she prefers.

 

[lowcountry308]

My 357/38 liked the CFE Pistol in the 125 grain bullets. You might want to try it if the AA doesnt meet your need.

Its a 2.5” barrel. It prefers the 158 hands down though.

 

[MEHavey]

Fast Accurate#2 -- Check
"Taper Crimp" using the resizing die.

...with light recoiling loads, that's all you need.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

A 158gr LSWC over 4.0gr W231.

 

[Riomouse911]

I use a touch of a roll crimp even with plated bullets, having a bad experience back in my SASS days undercrimping some rifle loads. It has been said if you overdo the crimp it can mess up the plating by cutting through it and possibly having it separate from the lead bulked when fired, but I can’t say I’ve ever seen that.

These two .38 Spl loads are with the Extreme 125 gr FP, it has the cannelure rolled into the bullet to help with seating depth, and a Berrys 125 gr FP that has a little groove (The loose bullet). Both are loaded over 4.4 gr Unique for a fun plinking load that has very tolerable recoil in snub revolvers and almost none in K L and N frame .38 and .357 revolvers. It also is a steel plate “tinker” in my Rossi 16” 1892 clone.

The OAL for these are both at 1.438” according to my Dillon micrometer.



Good luck finding a load that works well for you .

Stay safe.

 

[joneb]

I find some 38spl cases can vary in length .015" after sizing so I trim them to 1.147" and chamfer the inside of the case mouth and debur the outside. For plated bullets I use a 9x19 taper crimp die in a fourth step. For 357 mag with plated bullets I use a Lee collet crimp die with plated bullets in a fourth step.

 

[.38 Special]

Thanks all for your replies. Since the consensus is the this load should not be sensitive to bullet seating depth, I will take the advise from Dudedog and 38 Special and seat the bullet using most of the land and ensure a snug fit. I went with 125’s since I couldn’t find the 148 HBWC that I initially intended. I went with plated to reduce lead exposure. The impetus to do this is that my wife has expressed interest in going to the range. I will have her shoot my 380 and the 38 spcl to see what she prefers.

Amen, brother. We all are stuck with shooting what we can get. You are on the right track and I'll bet your results are just fine. I hope you will report back.