44 Mag revolver/carbine load suggestions

[mcb]

What about 800-X? I remembered I have a partial pound left in the back of the powder locker. I normally use 800-X for 10mm Auto 180 gr and 200 gr XTPs in my S&W 610 and it really shine there. Seems like 240gr 44 Mag might be another good candidate for 800-x. Yeah it does not meter well at all but at the volume of rounds I will be loading 44 Mag I am going it on a manual 3 hole reloading press (not my 650XL) and don't mind weighing each charge. Anyone ever try 800-X in 44 Mag and have some experience or data they would like to share?

 

[Walkalong]

Never tried it, but no reason it wouldn't "work".

 

[Middletown]

I also never tried 800X for 44 Mag. I do have a pet load 800X and 200 grain hard cast lead bullet in 44 Special but that is using my 5 in. barrel Super Black Hawk. You could probably make it work in the revolver. Not sure about the carbine but that depends on your expectations. If you do try 800X let us know how it works.

 

[brewer12345]

If you try 800X, please let us know how well it works. I have been using a lot of it for 20 gauge shotshell loads so always have it around.

 

[mcb]

I'll let you guys know how it works. Hodgdon's website shows 14.2 gr max charge under a 240 gr jacketed bullet. I loaded some at 13.5 and 14.0 gr and will hopefully Chrono it in both guns soon.

 

[Toprudder]

I used 800x in some 357mag loads, and they did fairly well. Have not tried it in 44mag, though.

 

[Equestrian]

Never tried it in a rifle but 7-8gr tail boss under 240gr lead is about near free to load, stupid accurate in my Blackhawk, and all polite enough to make for all day practice. Blue dot for middle power, 296 for big ugly stuff

 

[mcb]

Yeah I am definitely going to try some Trail Boss for plinking ammo. Get some coated lead bullets. I use that combination for my IDPA 38 Special ammo.

 

[Equestrian]

It's really pleasant stuff to work with. No powerhouse but meters nicely and it's pretty hard to have a screw up.

 

[Walkalong]

Back when I was loading .44 Mag for a carbine, I did not have a .44 Mag revolver, so I don't know if my .44 Mag load would have shot well in a revolver. Once I got a revolver, I had given the carbine to my elder child, so only had his feedback, and I doubt he wrung them out well.

I loaded 100 rounds for him Sunday evening with 180 Gr XTPs (Blems from Midway). He likes them as they recoil a bit less when running at only 1325ish FPS. I run 240s at 1350ish. (5.5" Revolver) You can get more than 1350 with a 240 Gr from a 5.5" Redhawk, but pushing them at 1350ish with AA #9 or N-110 is very accurate and more comfortable to shoot (For me) than barn burners with H-110 etc.

 

[LUCKYDAWG13]

I just cast up a bunch of 265gr bollets for my RSBH I will see how they run in my marlin 1894

 

[1976B.L.Johns.]

Nice! What sizer and lube do you use?

 

[LUCKYDAWG13]

I use a Lyman 450 sizer and use White Label Lube this is there Carnauba Red http://www.lsstuff.com/

 

[1976B.L.Johns.]

Thanks for your reply, LUCKYDAWG13 !
I also use the Lyman, (probably older than I) with their "Super Moly". May graduate from old school & check out the other lubes.

 

[mcb]

Well life got in the way and after a two and half month hiatus I finally got a chance to chrono the 44 Mag loads I load up way back when. Nice warm/wet day in middle Tennesse to do some shooting. Managed to get it all in before the rain came back.

The loads were all the same except the powder charge. I was looking for a nice moderately powerful 44 Mag load for both my M29 and M92. I was hopping for between 1200-1300 fps with a 240gr XTP bullet. I loaded two loads each of three difference powders (six loads total) and chrono'ed each from both the 6.5-inch S&W M29 and a 16-inch Rossi M92 carbine. I measure velocity with a Shooting Chrony Alpha about 12 feet from the muzzle. All the data is for five shot averages.

Bullet: Hornady 240gr XTP
Primer: Federal Large Pistol
Brass: Remington for the 4227 and Midway for the 800-X and H110
OAL: 1.590 with a moderate crimp into the cannelure

Powder: IMR 4227
--
Charge Weight: 22.0gr
Revolver Average: 1183 fps
Std Dev: 16.73 fps
Carbine Average: 1416 fps
Std Dev: 26.41 fps
Delta Velocity : 233 fps
--
Charge Weight: 23.0gr
Revolver Average: 1242 fps
Std Dev: 16.06 fps
Carbine Average: 1486 fps
Std Dev: 19.56 fps
Delta Velocity : 244 fps

-----------------

Powder: Hodgdon Hi-Skor 800-X
--
Charge Weight: 13.5 gr
Revolver Average: 1336 fps
Std Dev: 10.39 fps
Carbine Average: 1555 fps
Std Dev: 21.14 fps
Delta Velocity : 219 fps
--
Charge Weight: 14.0gr
Revolver Average: 1372 fps
Std Dev: 9.79 fps
Carbine Average: ~1600fps **
Std Dev: --
Delta Velocity : ~228 fps

** Forgot to write down the chrono data from this string. The three shot I remember seeing where all within single digits either side of 1600fps.

-----------------

Powder: Hodgdon
--
Charge Weight: 23.0gr
Revolver Average: 1319 fps
Std Dev: 22.69 fps
Carbine Average: 1673 fps
Std Dev: 13.96 fps
Delta Velocity : 354 fps
--
Charge Weight: 23.5gr
Revolver Average: 1351 fps
Std Dev: 11.74 fps
Carbine Average: 1708 fps
Std Dev: 12.36 fps
Delta Velocity : 357 fps

-----------------

I was disappointed with the IMR 4227. It did not burn very well leaving noticeable unburt powder residue in the cases and cylinder.

The 800-X was my favorite. It was super clean, very uniform velocity, and although the two loads were a touch faster than the two H110 loads in the Revolver the perceived recoil felt less than the H110 loads. Not sure how much of that was a slightly lower recoil impulse due to less propellant mass and how much of that was the significantly lower muzzle blast produced by the 800-X versus the H110. H110 in the revolver has lots of flash and blast. The 800-X had no flash and much less blast.

Now the H110 benefited the most from the carbine barrel length. The 4227 and 800-X only got 219-244 fps gain from the 9.5 inches longer barrel length where the H110 gained over 350 fps in the carbine

All the loads except the 4227 where above my original goal of 1200-1300 fps but in my limited test the lighter 800-X load shoot very well for me and the recoil was stout but not uncomfortable. I think my next step will be to load up some more of the 800-X and then sit down and shoot some serious groups with both guns.

 

[LUCKYDAWG13]

the powder you need to use for mid range is 2400 or even BlueDot H110 is a great powder for top end loads but thats it I never found a
good load with IMR4227

 

[gotboostvr]

4227 needs a heavy crimp and a full case.
If you've got unburnt powder flakes, increase your charge.

It works "in theory" for redcuded charges. It won't cause dangerous issues like 110/296, it's just REAL dirty and so-so accuracy. It's very consistent when pushed hard.

I've shot it through multiple guns, 29-2, 2x 629-6's, a Taurus tracker, and my 16" Rossi M92. A 240gr XTP over a full dose of 4227 and tightly crimped into place has given best accuracy results and enough velocity to bang-flop my last two deer from my carbine.

 

[Toprudder]

H110 in the revolver has lots of flash and blast. The 800-X had no flash and much less blast.

I've used both N-110 and H-110 in 44mag, and even though I get very close to the same velocities, the H-110 loads are much louder. There is no flash from the N-110 and huge flash from H-110. Recoil felt slightly higher with the H-110 loads as well.

Now the H110 benefited the most from the carbine barrel length. The 4227 and 800-X only got 219-244 fps gain from the 9.5 inches longer barrel length where the H110 gained over 350 fps in the carbine.

I have not tried my H-110 loads in my carbine yet, but I have seen a similar result using 300-MP. With the 300-MP in my 357 revolver, I reached a velocity plateau long before I reached max charge - there was zero increase in velocity with a 1.5gn increase in charge. This was with a 5" barrel. But when I tried 300-MP in my 16" carbine, I saw a velocity increase all the way up to max charge, and a 600fps difference between 5" and 16" barrels (1200fps vs 1828fps, 158gn XTP). When I started working up loads for my 44 carbine, I started with 300-MP and 240gn Zero JSP, was very happy with the results (similar to the 357) and have not bothered trying anything else. I settled on 25.4gn of 300-MP which gave 1811.6 fps, 6.7 fps standard deviation, and 12.1fps extreme spread (5 shots). I may go back and look for some lighter loads, though. I did all my range testing using a lead sled, but this past weekend I shot those loads for the first time with the gun on my shoulder. That little 5lb carbine hurts! LOL.

Thanks for sharing your results!

 

[mcb]

Thanks guys.

I might have to give the 4227 one more try with a max 24gr load and make sure I have a good crip. it should get me to ~1300 fps or a touch more in my revolver and we'll see if it burns cleaner with a little more pressure.

H110 as much as everyone likes it, it is awfully barky for what it is. I have use it in both 357 Mag and now 44 Mag and I think I am going to relegate it back to what I originally bought it for, 410 shotgun shells. It works great in those without out the blast I get from my revolvers.

800-X impressed me with both its cleanliness and its relatively low blast at the muzzle. I am definitely going to play with that a bit more in 44 Mag.

 

[Airman Basic]

My best luck with IMR4227 and 240 grainers in .44 mag, is when the powder charge is nearly compressed or slightly compressed. This will vary with bullet selection, but it should be over 23+ gr. Walkalong's charge of 23.5 is probably right there. You cannot get enough 4227 under a 240 grainer in .44 mag to make it dangerous. As long as the bullet compresses the powder and seats to the cannelure, you are good to go. IMR 4227 can be downloaded, but when it is downloaded too much it gives inconsistent performance and gets pretty dirty. Use it like H110/W296 and stick to the upper limits of it's parameters for best performance.

25 grains of 4227 and a 240/250ish grain Keith, the one with lots of bullet sticking out the case, is a compressed load for sure. But it's the most accurate 44 load i've got, and very little powder left over. Don't think you can get enough 4227 in a 357, 41 44, and maybe 45 to be an overload.

 

[Charliefrank]

I developed loads years ago for a Marlin 1894 and a model 29. 240 grain hardcast semiwadcutters over 2400 for full power and unique for reduced loads. At that time 21.5 grains of 2400 was listed as max. Nowadays it's more like 18.5. After thousands of rounds through both I see no reason to change. If it ain't broke.

 

[mcb]

I developed loads years ago for a Marlin 1894 and a model 29. 240 grain hardcast semiwadcutters over 2400 for full power and unique for reduced loads. At that time 21.5 grains of 2400 was listed as max. Nowadays it's more like 18.5. After thousands of rounds through both I see no reason to change. If it ain't broke.

Aliant's online reloader guide still shows a load with a Speer 240gr GDHP with 21 gr of 2400.

The problem is I fear that by the time I get powders like 2400 or 4227 running clean I am going to be running so fast that the recoil is going to be more than I want. I am not afraid of recoil for the most part and can tolerate a fair amount but I also have no desire to shoot a gun that hurts me when I shoot it. That 1351 fps H110 load between the recoil and muzzle blast was unpleasant verging on painful to shoot in the revolver. The 13.5gr 800-X load was stout but did not hurt my hand.

 

[Walkalong]

I was disappointed with the IMR 4227. It did not burn very well leaving noticeable unburt powder residue in the cases and cylinder.

22 Grs is too low.

I might have to give the 4227 one more try with a max 24gr load and make sure I have a good crip

Try 23.5 first before going to 24.0.

The problem is I fear that by the time I get powders like 2400 or 4227 running clean I am going to be running so fast that the recoil is going to be more than I want.

Have any 180 Gr bullets?

The formatting didn't come over, but this is my Load # 23 (Post # 35) for .44 Mag.

Load # 23 ***

(Updated seater setting after buying a Redding Competition seater.)

Date : 9-09 Temp : 66 Degrees Conditions : Sunny 82 in the Sun
Case : FC & Hornady Range Brass
Crimp : Medium Plus Roll *
Seater Setting(s) : 2.05 Redding Seater
Trimmed : 1.270
Primer : WLP
Cartridge OAL : 1.600 +/- .003
Powder : N110 Weight : 21.7 Grs. Setting / Measure : 94.0 on 10X by R # 2
Bullet : XTP Blemish Sale
Weight : 180 Gr.
Type / Dia. / OAL : JHP .430 / .558

Comments : *Used RCBS Seater sans stem to crimp.
94.0 is MAX on 10X measure. 21.7 Grs N110 is all it will do. 97% Load density.
Need to Chrono. Recoil was nice. Much less flame and recoil than 19.9 Grs AA #9
and a Magtech 240 Gr JSP. John and I hit a 100 yard target with it without adjusting
the sights. Hit about an inch low at 7 yards, and went through the same hole as Load
# 22 at 7 yards. Very accurate. Loaded on LNL.
Great plinker. Max N110 with a 180 Gr bullet is 27.1 by Vihtavuori data.

Ruger Redhawk- 5.5" - 6 shots
HI 1334
LO 1291
AVG 1310
ES 43
SD 15

 

[Charliefrank]

Aliant's online reloader guide still shows a load with a Speer 240gr GDHP with 21 gr of 2400.

The problem is I fear that by the time I get powders like 2400 or 4227 running clean I am going to be running so fast that the recoil is going to be more than I want. I am not afraid of recoil for the most part and can tolerate a fair amount but I also have no desire to shoot a gun that hurts me when I shoot it. That 1351 fps H110 load between the recoil and muzzle blast was unpleasant verging on painful to shoot in the revolver. The 13.5gr 800-X load was stout but did not hurt my hand.

I used a set of Pachmeyer grips and recoil was quite manageable. I was able to shoot 100 rounds a week all summer without issue. The rifle didn't have a recoil pad on it and would spank you if you were only wearing a t shirt

 

[mcb]

I used a set of Pachmeyer grips and recoil was quite manageable. I was able to shoot 100 rounds a week all summer without issue. The rifle didn't have a recoil pad on it and would spank you if you were only wearing a t shirt

I have a Pachmayr Decelerator grip for an N-frame, IIRC is came on my 627 but it does not fit my hand well. I have the round butt Hogue Monogrip on all four of my N-frames. All four guns are set up very similar to each other.

Yeah my M92 has the recoil reducing steel butt plate , but at least for all the loads I tested above I did not find any of the recoil objectionable. Shoulder was just a touch sore after the shooting session in hunting gear it would be a non-issue.