44 Special Pet Loads???

[Float Pilot]

Blue Dot was a disappointment in the short barrel.

BUT,,,, TiteGroup was a bit of a pleasent surprise. It would have been better but I pulled one.... That is waht happens when you start to get cocky when the first 4 shots go so well....

 

[the Black Spot]

Pulled or not that is still a good group!

6.8 gr of bluedot with a 310 gr cast bullet shot pretty good in Bridgeport model charter bulldog, under 2" at 15 yds . Shot high though, but burned cleaner with heavier bullet.

I don't have any titegroup. Bullseye is close to it and shows promise.

 

[Float Pilot]

Went out today and verified a few loads and tossed in a couple new ones.
One of my range compardre's has a 255 grain Keith mold and he gave me 10 255gr (on my digital scale) Keith style semi-wadcutters. He lubed them with some sort of yellow-gold looking lube... No smoke.....

Oct 28, 2012 tests: 15 yards at 32 degrees.

240 grain LSWC,
Star-Line Brass, WLP, 1.487 COL Roll Crimp

6.1 grains HP-38 = 785 fps with a 0.75 inch group with one flyer to 1.25
6.2 grains HP-38 = 800 fps and a 1.25 inch group
6.3 grains HP-38 = 793 fps with a 1.50 inch group
5.4 grains TiteGroup = 780 fps and a 4.0 inch group

255 grain Keith Semi wadcutter
Star-Line Brass, WLP, 1.586 COL, Roll Crimp

6.0 grains HP-38 = 732 fps and a 0.40 inch group with one flyer to 0.75 inch

200 grain Hornady XTP JHPStar-Line Brass, WLP, 1.487 COL Roll Crimp

7.1 grains HP-38 = 830 fps and a 1.25 inch group

207 grain Lead Semi-wadcutter hollow point w/ gas-checkStar-Line Brass, WLP, 1.497 COL Roll Crimp

6.2 grains TiteGroup = 870 fps and a 0.75 inch group, very clean
6.3 grains TiteGroup = 887 fps and a 4.0 inch group
7.0 grains HP-38 = 855 fps, and a 0.75 inch group,
7.1 grains HP-38 = 865 fps and a 1.5 inch group
7.2 grains HP-38 = 895 fps and a 2.0 inch group,
7.3 grains HP-38 = 910 fps and a 1.0 inch group

 

[joneb]

Where are you getting the 207gr lswc gc hp ?

 

[Float Pilot]

A fellow shooter from up in Anchorage (a 225 mile drive from here) sent me about 150 of them in a priority mail box.....

I have asked where he got them, but no answer. I will see if I can post a good photo of one....

I do not know if they are supposed to be 205 grains or 210.... They actually weigh 207

 

[the Black Spot]

Thanks again float for the updates. You using a rest or are these groups just freehand shooting?

Still waiting to get out and try some of my loads. Maybe today.

 

[Float Pilot]

Here are the bullets that seem to be fairly accurate so far.

Left to right.
200gr Hornady XTP, Sierra 210gr HP, Mystery 207gr Lead SWC-HP, HSM 240 grain cast, 255 Keith type via an old Lyman mould.

DOES ANYONE HAVE AN IDEA WHAT THE 207gr SWC-HP-GC MIGHT BE???
It looks swaged to me... maybe... I acnnot find them listed anyplace..

Black Spot:
I am leaning over a table so my arms are supported. This is only at 15 yards.
I am having a problem because my old eye-balls do not do so great with the front sights on short barrels.

And yes , the revolver is dirty. I am doing a grime torture test.

 

[Eb1]

My testing so far with my Rossi M720 has reveled to me that heavier bullets are preferred. I had horrible results with a Hornady 200 grain XTP. I just hope the .44 Mag likes the 200 grain XTP.
Maybe the muzzle loader will like the 200 grain XTP. I have a ton of them. My M720 liked the Remington 246 grain Lead. At 15 yards would shoot 5 shots into one hole touching. I might try the 255 grain Beartooth at a velocity close to 750 fps. Should make a good stopper. After all the meplate is .340 in caliber on that bullet, and they are gas checked.

 

[the Black Spot]

That is some great shooting and groups. I wonder now if I should have dropped some extra coin and got the Taurus instead of the Bridgeport model charter bulldog 44 special.

I am drooling over that five shot group.

Thanks for the taking the time to post all this info.

That 207 gr looks like an older lyman mold. #429215

 

[Float Pilot]

EB-1

If you have a set of calipers handy could you compare some measurements on your Rossi 720... I wish somebody here had a model 396 Night Guard S&W in 44 special.

You can see where I am going with this..

OUTSIDE DIAMETER OF CYLINDER
Taurus 445 = 1.530in Charter Bulldog = 1.450 inch

CYLINDER LENGTH
Taurus 445 = 1.579in Charter Bulldog = 1.582

MINIMUM THICKNESS BETWEEN CHAMBERS
Taurus 445 = 0.100 inch Charter Bulldog = 0.079 inch

BARREL LENGTH
Taurus 445 = 2.110 inch Charter Bulldog = 2.465 inch

Outside

 

[Eb1]

Sure. Gimme a day or so. We got sick kids, and I feel croopy, too.
I loaded the 200 FTP with 6.8 gr unique, man, it was shooting fireballs. I am going with 240 laws from mo. Cast bull lets and a 255 gr from bear tooth bullets that are gas checked. Will probably go with imr4227 or 2400 this go round, and will load trail boss as usual.

 

[Float Pilot]

I found a bullet maker called MATT's BULLETS. He has some very cool stuff on his web site.
http://www.mattsbullets.com/

Including the 180 Grain Full Wadcutters in 44 caliber and a 215 grain Wadcutter Hollow Base......

I have some on order......

 

[Eb1]

Wow! Imagine loading those things backwards.

 

[joneb]

I would have concerns about pushing a HBWC to hard. If thinking of something other than light target loads I would go this rout.
http://www.rimrockbullets.net/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=7&products_id=169
It's listed as a DEWC but I'm not seeing that in the picture.

 

[Float Pilot]

I will see how they do at around 800 fps loaded backwards....

If not, I'll bet that I can get the 180 grain double ended wadcutters going darn near 1,000 fps. Maybe..... based upon being able to push a 240 to 800fps and a 207gr to 900fps.

 

[the Black Spot]

I tested some lee 240 gr tumble lube bullets today loaded backwards, over 9 gr of bluedot. These were wheel weight alloy. Group from a rest ran 2.5" at 18 yds. This from a charter 44 special bulldog.

Some other favorite 44 special loads from a 7.5" barreled uberti cattleman include: 310 gr cast with 9.5 gr of 2400 or same bullet 7.2 gr of bluedot
200 gr cast with 5.5 gr of Bullseye was good also
255 gr cast with 4.7 gr of Bullseye was nice gallery load

 

[Eb1]

Hey all. Help me out with something, please. Handgun bullets do not have the hydro static shock of a high power rifle.
With that in mind wouldn't a .430 230-255 grain bulletin at say 750 to 850 fps be a food SD round? Wouldn't it penetrate deep, and cut a nice perm cavity with some temp cavity damage causing massive blood loss?

Wasn't it said that a 240 lswc @ 800 fps would fully penetrate a full size deer? I think it would probably so it end to end.
So pushing it past 800 to 1000 might be beat left to the .44 Magnum. This is just my opinion, and mostly because I own a .44 magnum. So I don't have to push the special hard. I just want an accurate, effective loading for my M720, and if it turns out to be the Rem factory loadin, which will shoot 5 in one hole at 15 yards off hand, then so be it.

What are you guys thoughts?

 

[Float Pilot]

I agree that 750 to 850 fps is just fine for a 200 to 255 grain bullet that is already as big starting out, as a 38 or 9mm bullet good ever hope to be after a perfect mushroom.

I will be conducting some bone breaking experiments in the next few weeks to see if big , heavy and slow will break a large diameter bone after going through 3 to 4 inches of meat.

In some cases with fixed sights, like my Taurus, you have to play with the weights and velocity to get the point of impact to be close to the sights.

 

[the Black Spot]

Eb1, you said self defense, you talking four leg or two? Personally, I wouldn't want penetration on two leg vermin(obvious pass throughs that hurt bystanders), but four leg critters definitely want penetration. Elmer Keith, shot through a muledeer at over 400 yds with a 44 mag and lead bullet. I would think at 700-800 fps you would still get good penetration. I have a load that I will test on wet phone books, 310 gr cast bullet of wheel weight alloy backed by 9.5 gr of 2400. This load runs about 700 fps from a 7. 5"barrel.

 

[Float Pilot]

Notice how when I find a load that seems to group fairly well at 15 yards, I always get one flyer. It makes me think that I have one chamber in the cylinder that is not lined up as well as the others.
Thoughts???

 

[4895]

Had the same problem with mine. I was working up loads as you have been until I couldn't pull the trigger any more. The extractor rod is bent causing the cylinder to contact the barrel. I shot about 1500 rounds through mine and now it sits until I can send it in to Taurus for repair. My loads were mostly mid range with about 200 rounds near the top end of the scales, but nothing that should have damaged the pistol.

 

[Float Pilot]

While they are better than the two or three Charter Bulldogs I looked at.... they are still not up to par with a Ruger, Colt or S&W. Although the new S&W stuff is looking pretty bad as well.

 

[303 hunter]

Forgot to mention, Speer makes a GOLD DOT bullet (200 grain) that is designed to open at .44 special velocities. I shot 3 different bullets through a gallon of water and captured in water soaked phone book. They all expanded well from start loads to finish loads with Unique. The top end load penetrated about 3" of the wet phone book. I was going to try a few loads with power pistol as it gives top velocity and those Unique loads needed a bit more speed for maximum expansion. Either way, the bullets gave picture perfect expansion and retained all of the original mass. They are kinda spendy, but if you are looking for an expansion round, I would look into those.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/29...grain-bonded-jacketed-hollow-point-box-of-100

I have used this bullet in my 44spl Blackhawk with great results. It will expand at 700fps. Also,look at the 200gr XTP's. They work great as well.

 

[the Black Spot]

I have a 44 special uberti cattleman that gets one flier, I marked that cylinder and don't load it. I carry on empty chamber anyway. My bridgeport charter bulldog 44 special does the same, I put that cylinder under the hammer for the last shot.
It may not be cylinder alignment, it could also be a chamber is bigger(which is the case of my bulldog. The bigger cylinder gets the flier).

Wish ruger would make a five shot sp101 in 44 special.

 

[Eb1]

@ 303 Hunter,

I have also read that the 200 gr XTP is a great bullet for the 44 SPC, but it shot horrible in my M720.
I am finding tha heavier bullets shoot much, much better at 700-800 fps. Bullet weights ranging from 240 LSWC to 255 grian Beartooth bullets.
Could just be my gun