5.56/223 getting started questions!?

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dryfiregen4

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I started with loading 9mm now i feel comfortable so i wanna start doin 223 to feed my AR. I just wanna make sure i know everything that ill need and specifically the die set.

Im very new to this so bare with me..

I have a lee classic turret press, so im looking at the lee ultimate 4 die set for 223..come with full length sizer, collet necksizer, Easy Adjust Dead Length Bullet Seating Die & Factory Crimp Die. is that all i need for the dies? also i this may be a dumb question but can i use my pro auto disk powder measure with these..if so which die?

Thanks a lot. just wanna make sure im good to go
 
You most definitely for sure don't need a neck sizing die for a semi-auto rifle!
Especially an AR-15 semi-auto rifle!

Save your money, and buy an RCBS AR two-die set.

And a Wilson case gage!

And a real powder measure & scale.

rc
 
The other thing you will need is a way to trim the cases and likely a way to remove the crimp from the primer pockets if you are going to use range brass. A lot of 5.56 and 223 brass has crimped primer pockets. I'll leave it the more experienced folks to recommend tools for this job. I use a lee trimmer and a drill press for trimming and a Lyman small primer pocket reamer for the crimped primer pockets. My solution, while inexpensive, takes a lot longer if you are doing large quantities and one can easily develop blisters :).
 
rcmodel, RCBS AR Series Small Base 2-Die Set with Taper Crimp 223 Remington..that one?? i copied and pasted that from midway lol so you just so the seating die crimps so case??

what about the pro auto disk measure?? cant use that? if not what do you recommend?
 
what about a powder measure?? all i have is the pro auto disk.

for the crimpped primer pockets ..all i need is one of the hand tools right? (i dont mind that time it will take)

so it seems like so far yall are saying the rcbs 2 die set. Im guessing the seating die puts a crimp on it as well??
 
I started loading for my AR several weeks ago and after getting feedback from the forum, I bought RCBS standard full length sizing dies and they have worked perfectly. You will also need to trim rifle brass. If you are loading brass with crimped primers, you will need to swage the primer pocket to remove the crimp before priming. I also don't crimp the case mouth as neck tension securely holds my bullet in place.
 
BYJ04 did you get the rcbs 2 die set? and also what powder measure do you use? i have a lee turret press with the pro auto disk measure..id like to use that since i already have it. any thoughts on that??

Thanks
 
Yes, the seating die will also crimp.
If you adjust it to crimp.

If you decide you really want to crimp.

However there is no need too.
IF the die expander leaves the case as it should and you have proper case neck tension on the seated bullet.
As you must have anyway.
Whether you decide to crimp, or not.

I very seldom have in the last 44 years of loading .223.

rc
 
Ok thanks RCMODEl..now my last couple questions..why rcbs over lee dies? and also what about the powder measure..what do you recommend ? like i said i already have the pro auto disk measure
 
Because, IMO, they are better.

Nothing against Lee dies, but I have had better luck longer with RCBS dies.
100% luck for 50 years in fact!

If you have the Lee disk powder measure, use it.
I just prefer metal powder measures with an infinitely adjustable micrometer adjustment.

rc
 
Those RCBS dies are nice.
They don't come with a shell holder, RCBS will rob you for $8 extra for that.

The Lee dies might not have the light green tint, but they work fine also. They also come with the shell holder.

I load for ARs on the Lee dies, they work fine.
This set.
http://ads.midwayusa.com/product/434975/lee-pacesetter-3-die-set-223-remington?
This is what I use on my classic turret for the auto-disk. It works great.
http://ads.midwayusa.com/product/792057/lee-auto-disk-rifle-powder-charging-die-22-to-30-calibers

The neck sizing die in the ultimate set is for bolt guns, if you ever think you'll fire a bolt .223 some day it might be useful.
 
I am using lee dies also. I have the factory crimp die but I don't use it. With what you have now you will probably need:

Double disk kit for the auto disk
Rifle charging die
A way to trim the brass (the cheap lee will get you in the game)
Something to chamfer, deburr, and remove crimps with (I use the Lyman multi tool)
Case lube (the lee toothpaste lube works fine)
Two loading blocks (I prefer batch loading 223)

Not shilling for lee. I just assume you have the kit that comes with a good amount of that stuff.
 
As already pointed out you do not need a Lee Collet Neck die for and AR rifle.
You also don't need a small base die either. If you are going to load in volume and you wish to cut down/eliminate trimming you can get an RCBS "X" die without going Small Base.

I bought an RCBS Small base die for my Grendel. It sized the case down so small it looked like a Belted Magnum. I called RCBS and they had me send it back with 5 fired cases. Instead of trying to fix the die, they replaced it with a Standard FL die, all is well with my Grendel now.

grendelSBdie.jpg
 
I also use Lee dies and the LCT press for .223.
http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=0000690502

Auto disk system works just fine for .223. You will need this:
http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=0000690194
And this:
http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=0000690195

If you don't have a trimmer, look at this one.
http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=000157862003

Do get a case gauge. For dealing with crimped primer pockets, the Dillon 600 super swage does a great job. It's not cheap, but if you plan on doing a lot of AR shooting it is a real time saver/convenience IMO. There are cheaper solutions and many threads on the subject, so just do some research.

Most of the work in loading .223 is in the case prep.
 
Absolutely buy a case gauge. The AR is a well made machine and it likes a well made round. You can avoid a lot of trouble if you check your cases with one.
I have RCBS, Lee, and Lyman dies. They all work well. I prefer the RCBS. The Lees dies work just fine and are easier to find. If you do buy Lee you are GTG.
I don't care for the cheaper Lee equipment. Some of their equipment is pretty cheap for a reason.
RCBS normally has good service and warranty, however the last 2 times I ordered from them it's taken a month each time. My last order still isn't straightened out and it's been 6 weeks.
 
I agree that a case gauge is valuable. The gauge made by JP Rifles is substantially better than any other gauge because it's cut to match SAAMI specs.

http://www.jprifles.com/buy.php?item=JPCG-223

Other gauges are oversized. What this means is if a sized case, or a loaded round, fits into the JP gauge, then it's a guarantee that it will chamber in any rifle of that caliber. Since other gauges are oversized, a sized case may fit in to the gauge but still not chamber and that will jam up your rifle in a bad way.

This is great if your building ammo where you want the greatest possible chambering reliability. But does not mean that it actually fits your particular chamber. So ammo made with the drop in type of gauges will not be precision ammo, it's more like defensive and plinking ammo, and for non-precision competitions as well.

Once you decide to load precision rounds, you'll want a few additional tools, but first things first.
 
Most everything has been covered above.
I have/have used both RCBS, LEE and a number of other DIE sets over the years. They will all get the job done. So, ends up being your preference.
I have never found a rifle that required 'Small Base' DIEs. There must be some out there, I've just never found one.

Crimping. I don't. It can cause should set back even with canalured bullets, roll crimps don't do well with bullets that don't have canalures (the cuts in the bullet that goes all the way around and I don't spell the name correctly) Load with out a crimp and try to press the bullet in deeper with your hand. If neck tension doesn't hold, then look to a crimp (full length/factory crimp or what ever other name they use), I would still stay away from the old roll crimp. But, that's me.

Check the 'web' (not the internet but case's web - the area just in front of the head that tapers into the body of the case) for roughness at some point each reloading. I use a mostly straightened out large paper clip and drag the tip down the inside of each case. If rough, that case is scrap.
I always trim to length.
 
GT1 said:
Those RCBS dies are nice.
They don't come with a shell holder, RCBS will rob you for $8 extra for that.

The Lee dies might not have the light green tint, but they work fine also. They also come with the shell holder.
Click to expand...

I now appreciate why RCBS and others don't include shellholders.... I have probably 12 Lee #2 shellholders because they are in every lee die set I've purchased. I'm pretty sure I don't need that many. :)

I'm going to loading 223/5.56 starting in a couple of weeks when my son ships off to Marine Corps boot camp and I take over the care and feeding of his MVP in 223 and several other guns. The annoying part is that now I'll need to start buying small rifle primers.

Matt
 
I have probably 12 Lee #2 shellholders because they are in every lee die set I've purchased. I'm pretty sure I don't need that many.
Click to expand...


You obviously aren't buying enough presses. ;)
 
Case gauges.
Buy the Wilson, or even the Dillon can usually be found on ebay for $30 shipped.

Both of those are good gauges.
 
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