6.5 carcano and 7.7 arisaka

[mio]

i was just at a gunshop and they had both of these in good shape the carcano was a berretta and the arisaka was the 99. i dont know much about these old surplus rifles but i like the feel of them and was wondering if the prices were about right at 200 for the carcano and 150 for the arisaka and about ammo availibity. they had a couple of boxes of each for 39.95ea but when i looked at thier rem cor locts in .35 rem they wanted 28.95ea which is real high around here so im guessing that thier other ammo is probably priced equally high.

any help would be appreciated since ill be back in that area later this week.

 

[jimmyraythomason]

Aimsurplus has 6.5 Carcano ammo made by Prvi Partisan for 10.50 per 20 soft point and 9.95 per 20 FMJ. They didn't have any 7.7 Jap. Prices change and desireability changes but there is NO WAY I would give 200 for ANY Carcano(but that is just me). Assuming the Arisaka type 99 was in original form with mum intact It is a steal at $150.00

 

[mio]

ok ive partially anwsered my own question since i see the ammo at sportsmans guide reasonably priced and i see that when i asked if they carried ammo and they showed me 6.5 jap ammo for the carcano that wasnt the right ammo.

still need some insight on gun prices though because as usual gunbroker has listings that are all over the place and with little reguard to condition.

 

[mio]

what is the mum? and do you have a pic of what it looks like?

 

[WardenWolf]

$150 was going rate for decent-condition Arisaka 99's a few years ago. Hornady produces new 7.7 Jap, and the brass reloads with .303 bullets. Arisakas can be very fine guns, and, assuming it is in good condition, I would recommend it.

The mum, or chrysanthemum, is a flower-shaped emblem on top of the receiver. It is the imperial symbol of the Japanese emperor. The mum was ground off most captured rifles. Only a few captured earlier in the war and shipped home have an intact mum.

 

[mio]

thanks both of you.

ill sit here for a bit and see af anybody else has something to add.

 

[JWF III]

Nobody will beat the price of ammo from Aim Surplus. Their prices are outstanding. It's just like anywhere else though, sometimes they have what you want, sometimes they don't.

Check Grafs for ammo for the 7.7Jap. They have Hornady listed at $24.99, and PCI listed for $18.99. Both use reloadable brass. Hornady uses Prvi brass from what I've heard. And PCI uses Grafs brass.

Even though Prvi makes brass for the 7.7 Jap, I have yet to see loaded ammo from them. Oh how I hope they do that soon. I got several that are getting hungry.

Both guns are excellent rifles. Maybe not to Mauser standards, but excellent none-the-less. The Carcano got a bad rap years ago after JFK, and has never been able to shed it. You did good on both purchases in my book.

The Arisaka was tested to have the strongest action of all WW2 battle rifles. Made with some of the best steel known at the time. In the Last Ditch guns, quality did suffer, so be careful with those.

I would also reccomend getting the headspace checked on each. (Or you can buy the gauges for less than what most smiths will charge to check them.) Enjoy shooting them, they are highly addictive.

Wyman

 

[Snood Dewlap]

Don't be afraid of a Carcano. There's a lot of prejudice against them stemming back to the Kennedy assasination and comments made then about their quality. Its amazing how many times times I've heard the disparaged based on repeating others opinions without any personal experience with the gun. There a lot of carcano models and two calibers (6.5 and 7.35mm) and variations in sights from elegant adjustables to stone simple notches. So prices are varied depending on the model and of course condition, which like all mil surps can vary greatly. Don't look to one to make into a sporter, but leave it as it was built and it can be safe and intersting firearm.

 

[jimmyraythomason]

First let me say that my dislike for Carcanos has NOTHING to do with JFK's assasination nor does if have to do with hear-say. My opinion of the Carcano comes from personal experience. The Carcano is a good little plaything for those that like them. I don't. If you want to pay $200 for one that is your business. A side note you will need stripper clips for the Carcano.

 

[mio]

i really liked the feel of the carcano what is your personal experiance with it? was it extremely inaccurate? did it jam a lot? what didnt you like about it?

 

[amd6547]

I have a carcano carbine, and I love it. It is short, light, and VERY slick and fast to manipulate...one of the slickest bolt guns I have ever fired. The 6.5 Carcano is a very capable round. Yeah, you need clips to use it, but the clips load into the action very easily and work great.
My carcano carbine is my trunk gun.

 

[mio]

thanks amd. what kind of accuracy do you get? have you tried it on deer or just coyotes and such?

 

[JWF III]

A side note you will need stripper clips for the Carcano.

To correct that statement...

You will need enbloc clips. Two totally different things.

Wyman

 

[mio]

can you explain the difference?

 

[WardenWolf]

En bloc clips: what the M1 Garand uses. Effectively there is no internal magazine. It's one big squarish clip that you insert into the top of the rifle. The problem here is that you must have those clips, and the clips themselves experience wear with use.

 

[Cannonball888]

What is the mum? and do you have a pic of what it looks like?

Mums the word. The real deal




Note: Beware of crooks who have engraved a mum where the mum was ground off. You can often tell by the receiver being slightly flat where the original mum was ground off, residual grind marks, or sloppy fake mums with wrong number of petals or symmetry. Original mummed rifles bring a significantly higher price thus the abundance of fakes.

 

[elmerfudd]

Arisaka's were made in a wide variety of types and series. To start with, there are the type 38's and the type 99's. The type 38 is the older one, (38th year of Meiji I think), and had a notch type rear sight and was chambered in 6.5 Jap. It was replaced by the type 99, (not sure where that name came from), which was in 7.7 Jap and had a rear peep sight as well as anti-aircraft sights, a monopod and a bolt cover. Japanese soldiers usually ditched all that fluff, so if the rifle has it, it is worth more. It was also the first rifle with a chromed bore.

Now there are also type 30's, paratrooper take down rifles, and others, but these are generally far more rare and worth considerably more.

Within the type 99 family however they had 20 some odd different series of rifles built at a dozen or so different armories. The early ones were very good, but as the war started going badly they started to cut corners and at the very end they were turning out a monkey model commonly called the "last ditch". These often had non adjustable sights, a nailed on wooden buttplate and would have used a rope for a sling. They aren't necessarily worth less to a collector though.

There are also training models. These were made for drill only and are not safe to fire.

 

[amd6547]

No, we have a few coyote, but the city frowns upon shooting them...likewise, rifles are not legal for deer in Ohio.
My Carcano carbine is a low cost self defense weapon, one which can be carried in the car trunk and which can provide penetration of cover in a traditional looking, "non threatening" envelope.
Accuracy using the PRVI loads is fine for 100yd shooting...about a plate-sized group. This is due to Prvi using slightly the wrong diameter bullet. Hornady loads the correct diameter bullet, but I havn't tried any yet.
My Carcano is the 16" barreled version, the type which was made with a folding bayonet--mine was removed before I got it.
I have owned lots of different bolt guns, but the Carcano I own is the lightest and fastest handling, as well as shortest. The only bolt gun that comes close is the Enfield jungle carbine. A fine combat bolt gun, but longer and heavier.

 

[mio]

thanks guys ill be taking a better look at both rifles next time im up there in a couple days. cant afford both but i plan on buying one of them (got a mosin a couple years ago and now i have the surplus bug) im leaning toward the caranco because it felt so nice but we will see.

 

[Joe Demko]

First let me say that my dislike for Carcanos has NOTHING to do with JFK's assasination nor does if have to do with hear-say. My opinion of the Carcano comes from personal experience. The Carcano is a good little plaything for those that like them. I don't. If you want to pay $200 for one that is your business. A side note you will need stripper clips for the Carcano.

No. The Carcano takes en bloc clips, not stripper clips.
What was your personal experience with Carcanos that gives you a negative opinion of them? I owned one in the early 80's that was rather a nice little carbine. In workmanship it compared favorably with other pre-WWII military bolt actions. The only reason that I got rid of it was that virtually the only source of ammo at the time was Norma-produced and it was expensive. A box of the Norma ammo costed about the same as what I paid for the gun.