75gr Hornady ELD-M useless for an AR?

[JEBruns]

Decided to try some heavier bullets in my Zev AR, so picked up the subject bullets and some Hornady 75gr BTHP Match. The recipes for the ELD's called for a COL of 2.390", BTHP Match COL 2.250. So I loaded a couple of ladders using H335 and went out to the range. Realized the 2.39" bullets would not fit in the mag. Figuring I'd misread the COL, I just put them in the bag and shot the BTHP's. Horrible groups at 100yds. This AR will put out 1/2" groups of 52gr SMK's. 1:7 twist. But not the point.

So back at the reloading bench and find out 2.390" is correct and there is a note saying they won't fit in an AR mag. They can be over pressure loads if they are any shorter. Disappointing. So I take them to the range and single load them. Good fun. They pattern like crap (H335) too. Talking several inch groups. Brought most of them home and pulled the bullets.

Not real thrilled about loading anymore of these. Are there any recipes for the 75gr ELD-M that will fit in an AR mag? Or are these just no bueno for an auto loader?

 

[Kaldor]

You "may" be able to get them to run in a SSTL mag that allows for a 2.310 COAL, but there is no guarantee. We did this with some Berger 77s a friend purchased that needed that longer COAL to seat the bullet correctly.
If you want to go with heavy bullets that will run at a standard mag length of 2.255-2.260 the 77 SMK is the best bet. If you want to run a 69gr, the RMR 69s are outstanding and very well priced. I would try a different powder with the heavies too as H335 is a bit fast for the application.

 

[AJC1]

You "may" be able to get them to run in a SSTL mag that allows for a 2.310 COAL, but there is no guarantee. We did this with some Berger 77s a friend purchased that needed that longer COAL to seat the bullet correctly.
If you want to go with heavy bullets that will run at a standard mag length of 2.255-2.260 the 77 SMK is the best bet. If you want to run a 69gr, the RMR 69s are outstanding and very well priced. I would try a different powder with the heavies too as H335 is a bit fast for the application.

Another TAC user in the making.

 

[jak67429]

I don't have much luck with h335 and heavy bullets. my ar and my rem 700 both like 55gr varmint bullets loaded with h335 but won't shoot the 75. If I use varget then the rem shoots the 75 better than the 55.

 

[nastynatesfish]

I’ve got 4 boxes of the 73gr elm I got for my bolt gun that don’t group for crap in my 1-9tw. I’ll trade you some if you have more of the 75s

 

[Varminterror]

They can be over pressure loads if they are any shorter.

Running them shorter doesn't create over pressure conditions, but loading 75 ELDm's, as it always was before with the same bullet when it was called an A-max, to mag length will put the ogive within the mouth of the case, meaning neck tension will be partly pushing the bullet deeper into the case, and there really won't be much to stop the bullet from being jammed into the case if it runs into something - like a feed ramp - when feeding.

I've shot THOUSANDS of 75 A-max's and ELD's out of AR's over the years, I windowed a few mags and loaded just 2-3 rounds, but port fed most of them. I predominantly use Varget.

But no, there are no safe loads for a 75 ELD/A-max in AR mag lengths.

The 73ELD is a shorter ogive, made to fit into AR magazines - it gives up a little BC to the 75, but it's a very capable bullet.

 

[thump_rrr]

The Hornady 75 BTHP Match #2279 loads to 2.250".
I still prefer the 77gr SMK to load from a magazine

 

[mavracer]

If you want to shoot the long ogive VLD type bullets at mag length from an AR that's exactly what the 224 Valkyrie was made to do.
The 75 gr ELDs are pretty jump sensitive, typically you have to play with seating depth to get them to shoot good.

 

[JEBruns]

You "may" be able to get them to run in a SSTL mag that allows for a 2.310 COAL, but there is no guarantee. We did this with some Berger 77s a friend purchased that needed that longer COAL to seat the bullet correctly.
If you want to go with heavy bullets that will run at a standard mag length of 2.255-2.260 the 77 SMK is the best bet. If you want to run a 69gr, the RMR 69s are outstanding and very well priced. I would try a different powder with the heavies too as H335 is a bit fast for the application.

Yeah, my gun seems to like SMK's, so the 77gr SMK's are on my buy list. But probably not with H335. I have Varget and CFE223 also, but trying to find a load I like that uses H335. Need to use it up somehow.

 

[Kaldor]

Another TAC user in the making.

That was going to be my first suggestion. I need to test TAC, AA2520 and Staball Match all at once one of these days with 77s and 69s, just havent had the time.

 

[45/30-06OKIE]

Another TAC user in the making.

Yeah! TAC gang represent!

 

[ms6852]

All I use on my AR is Hornady's 75gr BTHP's. My AR loves them but it is a heavy barrel 1:8 twist. I have not tried the ELD's.

 

[Varminterror]

It's always odd to me, how inevitable it seems when someone mentions the 75 ELD/A-max (for at least the 25yrs I've been using online forums), the 77SMK and the Hornady 75 BTHP get brought into the mix, as if their weight class was the only thing of relevance. But these two, and a few others like them, are stubby little bullets with short ogives, specifically designed NOT for maximum aerodynamics, but rather to fit into an AR magazine. Sure, they have decent BC's, but the Hornady 75 HPBT gives up 2/3's of a point of G1 BC - almost a full point in the case of the 77SMK, and .12G1 for the Nosler Custom Competition 77 HPBT - falling behind the 75 ELDm/A-max. The 75 ELDm is long and slippery, with a short bearing surface and a ridiculously long ogive.

 

[ms6852]

It's always odd to me, how inevitable it seems when someone mentions the 75 ELD/A-max (for at least the 25yrs I've been using online forums), the 77SMK and the Hornady 75 BTHP get brought into the mix, as if their weight class was the only thing of relevance. But these two, and a few others like them, are stubby little bullets with short ogives, specifically designed NOT for maximum aerodynamics, but rather to fit into an AR magazine. Sure, they have decent BC's, but the Hornady 75 HPBT gives up 2/3's of a point of G1 BC - almost a full point in the case of the 77SMK, and .12G1 for the Nosler Custom Competition 77 HPBT - falling behind the 75 ELDm/A-max. The 75 ELDm is long and slippery, with a short bearing surface and a ridiculously long ogive.

OP mentioned the 75gr HPBT and that he got horrible groups at 100 yards, I on the other hand did not.

 

[JEBruns]

Saw some TAC at our local Bass Pro this week. Almost picked it up to try. They also had the 77SMK's, and a lot of other stuff. Lots of powders, primers and bullets. Looking like the old days in there, except for the prices.

 

[mavracer]

Running them shorter doesn't create over pressure conditions

It would using powder charges listed for a longer OAL.

 

[Varminterror]

It would using powder charges listed for a longer OAL.

Ok, sure…

Which is EXACTLY the same thing as saying loading any bullet with too much powder beneath it creates an over-pressure condition… so sure, if someone loads a max load or compresses a load without doing any work up and is somehow completely ignorant to the deified “start low, work up,” standard process of reloading, they might add pressure to any bullet.