9mm 147 gr lead bullet powder comparison

[LiveLife]

Disclaimer: Following post lists loads not in currently published load data - Use them at your own risk.

While I have been happy with 3.5 gr of W231/HP-38 for the 9mm 147 gr lead bullet, I have been wanting to do some comparison range test. Also, since I have been fairly happy with the performance from 4.0 gr Red Dot/Promo and 124/125 gr lead RN (my plinking load), I was curious what Promo would do with the 147 gr bullet.

owen's recent thread gave me the final push to test not only some popular loads but also lighter loads to provide reference points for reloaders looking for start charges for their powder workup as most of these loads are not listed in current published load data.

As to comparison of felt recoil, I used (5) to reflect the felt recoil from reference 3.5 gr of W231/HP-38 and used smaller number to note lighter recoil loads and larger number to note heavier recoil loads.

Glock 22 and KKM/Lone Wolf 40-9 conversion barrels were used with 1.155"-1.160" OAL/COL for Z-Cast 147 gr lead FP bullets (I wanted to use softer 14-16 BHN bullet for the testing of lighter loads) along with .378" taper crimp. Initial test done at 10 yards and shot groups were measured center-to-center.

Range Test:

For this initial range test, I was pleasantly surprised by Promo loads which produced light/mild recoil loads that were relatively accurate. I don't plan on testing higher Promo powder charges. Bullseye produced light loads that still cycled the slide and I plan on testing higher powder charges. 3.5 gr Titegroup produced the smallest shot group and I don't plan on testing higher Titegroup powder charges. All the test loads cycled the slide of Glock 22 and KKM/Lone Wolf barrels were clean without leading or significant fouling deposit.


W231/HP-38 3.5 gr - 1.14" with mild recoil (5)
Promo 3.1-3.3 gr - 1.44" with light recoil (4)
Promo 3.3-3.5 gr - 1.10" with mild recoil (6)

Bullseye 2.7 gr - 1.46" with very light recoil (3)
Bullseye 2.9 gr - 1.30" with light recoil (4)
Bullseye 3.2 gr - 1.18" with light recoil (4)

Titegroup 3.1 gr - 1.64" with mild recoil (5)
Titegroup 3.3 gr - 1.26" with mild recoil (6)
Titegroup 3.5 gr - 1.04" with moderate recoil (7)

 

[TooManyToys]

Interesting post, that's for the info & pictures!

 

[tightgroup tiger]

It may be my imagination but from looking at your targets and from my own personal experience with 9mm with 124gr bullets, and I shoot a lot of 9mm 124gr, I've found that accuracy seems more dependent on good quality bullets that fits the barrel more than powder choice, with the powders that are proven to be good for 9mm.
I've also found, the same as your targets show, that loading hotter in 9mm does improve accuracy with all the loads I've tried.
I'd like to see a report like this on longshot powder, With my 9mms accuracy really shined at .2gr under max load with 124gr bullets.
I don't know how longshot would work with 147gr bullets, that would be interesting.

 

[Owen]

3.3gr Titegroup with Precision Delta 147gr FMJ is what I use for USPSA. It's just a hair over the minor power floor, accuracy is suitable, and the cost is decent. When I bought my stock of PD bullets, the $/1000 was just $2-3 more than cast bullets.

 

[Catpop]

clarification related question: RD/PROMO, are they the same powder like Win231/HP-38 is?
Also glad to see someone else using RD in 9mm besides me.

 

[LiveLife]

It may be my imagination but from looking at your targets and from my own personal experience with 9mm with 124gr bullets, and I shoot a lot of 9mm 124gr, I've found that accuracy seems more dependent on good quality bullets that fits the barrel more than powder choice, with the powders that are proven to be good for 9mm.

Yes, I would agree. My preferred bullet weights for 9mm are 124/125/115 gr so I keep many more bullet types (jacketed/plated/lead) with well identified loads that are much more accurate. Based on the initial range test results with only one bullet type, I can say the heavier 147 gr lead bullet produced some more accurate loads than some 115/124/125 loads but not as accurate as well defined accurate loads. Since I am curious, I probably continue my range test with the 147 gr lead bullet using other powders/charges and see what develops.

I've also found, the same as your targets show, that loading hotter in 9mm does improve accuracy with all the loads I've tried.

This has been my experience also. As powder charges increase, at some point, powder burn becomes more efficient due to more consistent chamber pressure development and produces more consistent muzzle velocities/lower SD numbers which translates to smaller shot groups. For my powder work up, I first usually look to identify the start charge that barely starts to cycle the slide but even the really light Bullseye loads all cycled the slide.

I'd like to see a report like this on longshot powder, With my 9mms accuracy really shined at .2gr under max load with 124gr bullets.
I don't know how longshot would work with 147gr bullets, that would be interesting.

I thought about including slower burning powders like WSF that has published load data but I did not have enough time. On my future range trips, I can do comparisons like Universal/Power Pistol/WSF etc. If you noticed on my recent threads/posts, during current powder shortage, I am trying to help those that may have to work with limited supply of powders to load and offering practical/workable start/max range to produce accurate loads. Hopefully things will improve so we don't have to "improvise" using less suitable powders or powders without published load data.

 

[Schwing]

clarification related question: RD/PROMO, are they the same powder like Win231/HP-38 is?
Also glad to see someone else using RD in 9mm besides me.

Yes Promo and red dot are the same powder with one little disclaimer. Red dot is, supposedly, cleaner and takes up slightly more volume. This may seem contradictory but alliant has stated that the same data can be used for both powders as long as you are measuring by weight and not volume.

 

[LiveLife]

clarification related question: RD/PROMO, are they the same powder like Win231/HP-38 is?

No, they are not the same powder like W231/HP-38. According to Alliant, they are the same "burn rate" but have different density (Promo is denser than Red Dot) so we use Promo with Red Dot load data by "weight" and not by "volume" - http://www.alliantpowder.com/products/powder/promo.aspx

As you can see in the comparison picture below, Promo has larger flake size than Red Dot and lacks the "red" speckles. It is the largest flake powder I have used, but found that I can meter within .1 variance from Pro Auto Disk as long as the disk retracts completely for a full disk hole fill from the hopper by making sure the bead chain is tight with the use of the small spring at the bottom of shell plate carrier. As long as I can keep the powder weight consistent, I have found like Red Dot, it is capable of producing accurate loads. Of course, if your metering is inconsistent, shot group size will increase.

Also glad to see someone else using RD in 9mm besides me.

Promo is my current favored plinking powder for 9mm lead bullets (124/125 gr RN) for cheap plinking/range drill practice and while it burns dirty, it produces acceptable accuracy while allowing me to save more popular/preferred powders for jacketed/plated bullets. I also like Promo for 45ACP 200 gr SWC loads to the point that when the 8 pounds of Red Dot I recently bought runs out, I may not buy anymore Red Dot but keep buying Promo instead.