A nearby Whataburger robbery tonight...WHAT WOULD YOU DO IF YOU WERE THERE?

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Min

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This happened this evening (7:00 pm) at a Whataburger not too far from where I live. It could have been me in there!

If you carry, and two men came in with guns, asking everyone to lie on the floor or something, would you comply, or would you draw?

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/metropolitan/2304977

Dec. 17, 2003, 11:17PM

Police searching for two Whataburger thieves
Two robbers of fast-food restaurant sought

Copyright 2003 Houston Chronicle



Police are looking for two gunmen who held up patrons Wednesday night at a southwest Houston fast-food restaurant.

The robbers were armed with a pistol and a shotgun when they entered the Whataburger restaurant at about 7 p.m. at the Southwest Freeway near Weslayan.

They forced customers to the ground before taking their money and also cash from the safe, police said. The gunmen, who fled the scene, may be linked to other recent holdups at other area Whataburger restaurants. There were not reported injuries.
Click to expand...
 
Yeah. Depending. Take out the shottie first, then the pistolero. Prefer to get them as they walk in, but the customers on the ground would be out of harms way.

"Clean up by the condiment counter" :D
 
As every situation is different you cannot just blanket every situation with "I'll draw and take those #$@$#@s down!" Do what is best at that time in moment and be prepared to have your life change completely.

Kenneth Lew
 
No I disagree, Kenneth Lew. This situation is pretty cut and dry. Two guys come in with guns to rob. They robbed.

They can take all the money they want (I don't care about Whataburger profits or my petty cash), BUT who knows if they decide to massacre everyone or at least several in the place before they leave?

Anyone who puts me at the wrong end of a firearm is fair game, IMO.
 
Well..if they were just there to rob the establishment, then have at it. I'm not paid to protect Whataburger. Nor am I under any obligation to attempt to stop a crime in progress, as in off duty LEO.

Things got personal when they started taking money from the folks, which would be me included. My best bet would be to take cover and try to take out the shotgun first if at all possible. Chances are they will run after the first shots are fired.

If you lay down and let them take your money you stand a good chance of having your weapon found. Then you are really in trouble.

But in a standard robbery...sorry, Whataburger is just gonna lose some cash.

Good Shooting
Red
 
Hopefully, I would be aware of 2 gunmen coming in through the door. I do not think anyone coming into a restaruant with a shotgun in hand is there for friendly reason and would be fair game coming across the parking lot or at the very least through the doors.
 
Depends if i'm in a bad mood :D

If it makes any difference, I have the "Bad Mother F***er" wallet from Pulp Fiction. That could make for some fun.

Note: The above section of the post is satire (some people just don't get it)

On a serious note, money isn't worth killing someone over, well, at least the $16 I have in my wallet isn't worth killing someone over. If they were acting very threatening (physically abusive) or started offing customers, out comes the gun.
 
Tough one. If the situation seems to be a robbery and you pull your sidearm, you're unmistakably injecting yourself into a dangerous situation. Can you still claim self-defense? In Texas, are you allowed to use lethal force to stop any felony you're a witness to?

Putting aside the legal question, distance and cover being equal, I agree with 7.62's ordering of targets. The problem is once you've complied and are on the ground, you're screwed if you have to take action.
 
Hopefully, I would be aware of 2 gunmen coming in through the door. I do not think anyone coming into a restaruant with a shotgun in hand is there for friendly reason
Click to expand...
Hold the horses there. What if you're in a right to carry state? CCW allows open carry there. Just gun him down?
 
Min,

1. Are you confident you can take out 2 arms robbers with weapons already drawn?
2. Have you ever been robbed before? (I have as an intended target)
3. Have you practiced shooting while moving w/ moving targets?
4. What about the unarmed bystanders?
5. Did you fully access the situation?
6. How would you react?

This is not a textbook scenario. You may or may not be able to get a clean shot and engagement with the other person.

Kenneth Lew
 
The one thing I notice people assuming in these threads is that the perps are some sort of expert marksmen and have nerves of steel...


As if as soon as they see the gun they'll instantly blast away...

I think that in this type of situation, they'll at least do a doubletake on seeing the gun... add that to an already 'scary' situation for the criminals... if you are set on taking action and have decided to fire on the shotgun carrier you will have the element of surprise. not so much in the way of not being seen/noticed, a customer drawing a weapon is going to make them ???? 9/10 times. which gives you an advantage. pop guy w/ shotgun, then you are left with a few options... #2 will most likely run like hell, or he'll want to get you, either way I see the CCW'er having the upper hand especially if you practice shooting/drawing/movement with your carry piece.

but in this scenario, Id lay low until they turned attention towards the customers, or became violent to anyone. At that point I would attempt to take out the one w/ shotgun, once that was done, Id have to make a pretty quick assesment of #2 and proceed from there.


~Brian
 
The one thing I notice people assuming in these threads is that the perps are some sort of expert marksmen and have nerves of steel...
Click to expand...
You need to assume that they are a coupla ex-Delta guys on meth suffering from PTSD induced paranoia. If they're a coupla retarded drunks, then lucky you.

The problem in these 'cut and dried' situations is the Murphy factor.

You know, the one where you get a fistfull of shirt in your draw and when you shoot the first guy from retention he drops his granpa's decrepit old shotty and it goes off catching you in the gut and spraying your entrails across the room. Of course, this totally freaks out the second guy and he runs scared and is never caught.

YAY! You foiled the robbery! You're a hero!

:)

Life sucks sometimes. Plan for the worst and hope for the best.
 
Hard to say . . . if you're already staring at the wrong end of a shotgun, you're unlikely to be able to draw fast enough to shoot and stop before he does.

How much of a crowd is there? If you're the only customer, they'll be giving you, personally, more attention than if there's a lot of other people around.

And what if they have a backup OUTSIDE with another shotgun or a rifle? And if, looking through the windows, he sees you draw?

Generally speaking, if they're only robbing the cash registers, I'll do nothing.

If I am threatened - a robber waving a gun around IS a threat - I'll take cover, draw, and fire until the threat is over.

Not a good situation any way you look at it. That's why I don't go into fast food restaurants late when there are few - or no - other customers.
 
"In Texas, are you allowed to use lethal force to stop any felony you're a witness to?"

If you believe that anyone is in imminent mortal danger, and are prepared to go to court to defend yourself, yes. A Texas grand jury is very unlikely to indict you, unless you were illegally carrying, or out prowling for felons.

For this situation, let's not forget that one of the big events in favor of concealed carry was the mass shooting of people in a restaurant--"If we were allowed to carry, we could've stopped him," ran the argument.
 
I sometimes eat at a local Whataburger...usually later in the evening. There tend to be fewer customers there at that time, mostly the usual immigrants who just got off work or out of church and are there with their young kids, and maybe a couple of high school kids who are there for the fries.

My dad taught me a long time ago that you always sit with your back to the wall, facing the door anywhere you go. It's a good habit to practice and cultivate.

I suppose that since I'm probably the only person there with a CHL and carrying, if the situation happened and an armed robber(s) decided that a 'no witnesses' policy was a good idea, or that my wallet would attempt to leave me or my cover blown it'd be a moot point whether or not I'd have to intervene at that point. It'd be a given that there'd be resistance, and I daresay that someone with ill intent would have a nasty surprise from my little corner of the burger joint.

Of course, I'd rather it be a Luby's or larger establishment where I could have the advantage of distance and cover, but that's a luxury one just can't assume. You have to work with what you've got, and if it's going to come to making a move or taking one to the back of the head while kneeling in the walk-in cooler, I know what I'd do.

Irregardless, it's always going to be an armchair quarterback thing until it happens. Play it as it lies.

Regards,
Rabbit.
 
I would definitely be a good witness.

I might be more, depending on the situation. Every situation is different.
 
I would try to be a witness. I don't care if Whataburger loses all of its money. Until the robbers start offing people, which is highly unlikely, I'll just sit tight and keep my eyes open.
 
Don't ya love these types of discussions? The Internet is a great place to live out your hero fantasies. I would do a Mozambique Drill (two to the body one to the head) on each of the bad guys and the whole deal would be over in less than 4 seconds. Hoo-rah...
 
Don't ya love these types of discussions? The Internet is a great place to live out your hero fantasies. I would do a Mozambique Drill (two to the body one to the head) on each of the bad guys and the whole deal would be over in less than 4 seconds. Hoo-rah...
Click to expand...


I didn't intend this to be a fantasy. This really happened near where I live last night, and I could have been a customer there.

I have a CHL, so I was trying to get a consensus of what would be a prudent thing to do in such a situation.
 
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