Alabama Shootings Question...

[DHJenkins]

If an AR-15 isn't an assault rifle, what is it?

The media is going to embellish any story it gets. It's no different than when they report a drug bust - "police found a pound of pot, with an estimated street value of $18,000..."

If you're going to get upset everytime the media purposefully sexifies a story to grab more viewers, you're going to be upset for the rest of your life.

We don't have news. We have infotainment. Get used to it, because it's not going to change so long as TV ratings exist.

 

[Jorg Nysgerrig]

The point is that the English language has moved on. An assault weapon that is a rifle is an assault rifle. And so is anything derived from the AR platform, or any other "tactical" semi-automatic shooting a rifle cartridge. Get over it.

In that case, perhaps you should say something about common use instead of claim it was defined in the assault weapons bill. As I mention below, equating the terms has done us no favors.

If an AR-15 isn't an assault rifle, what is it?

An M16. By definition, assault rifles are select fire. If we are going to call them assault rifles, we might as well sit here discussing how we load clips of bullets into our machine guns. Failing to make the distinction is one of the reason the AWB had so much public support. The forces behind that movement have successfully obfuscated the issue enough that a huge number of Americans think the banning assault weapons is about getting fully automatic weapons off the street. By equating semi-automatic rifles that look like select fire military weapons with those weapons, the antigun movement has successfully convinced Joe Public that the same weapons found on the streets of Somalia are available over the counter at Walmart.

 

[Walkalong]

The paper here just said semi auto rifle.

 

[rainbowbob]

Whether the media uses "sprayed" or "fired", it doesn't matter.

I dunno Jake...

All of the initial reports I read said he fired a "30-round burst" at police before he took his own life.

That would imply he had full-auto. A CNN reporter brought that up and asked the LEO in charge what he was using. The LEO responded that he had a semi-auto rifle.

I agree with others that the constant confusion sown in the minds of that portion of the public that doesn't know better will help fuel the push for a new AWB.

 

[eye5600]

An M16. By definition, assault rifles are select fire. If we are going to call them assault rifles, we might as well sit here discussing how we load clips of bullets into our machine guns. Failing to make the distinction is one of the reason the AWB had so much public support.

This is tedious, and I don't really want to prolong it, but since you ask... Some titles from the Connecticut AWB (which is pretty much copied from other AWB legislation)

Sec. 53-202a. Assault weapons: Definition. (a) As used in this section and sections 53-202b to 53-202k, inclusive, "assault weapon" means:

(1) Any selective-fire firearm capable of fully automatic, semiautomatic or burst fire ...

2) A part or combination of parts designed or intended to convert a firearm into an assault weapon,...

(3) Any semiautomatic firearm not listed ...
(A) A semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least two of the following:
(B) A semiautomatic pistol that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least two of the following:

So sections 3A and 3B clear define certain semi-automatic rifles and pistols as assault weapons. If you are going to argue that it doesn't constitute a definition as an assault rifle, we are just going to have to agree to disagree. I won't press the matter any further.

 

[Jim K]

Reporters are like lawyers, they become instant "experts" on whatever subject they are engaged in at the moment. Look at all the "journalists" who are giving Obama "advice" on the economy when most of them can't balance a checkbook.

Jim

 

[Jorg Nysgerrig]

That clearly says that an assault rifle can be an assault weapon and a semiautomatic rifle with certain features can be an assault weapons.

In essence, you are saying, "According to Connecticut Assault Fruit Ban, apples are a fruit. Oranges are also a fruit. Therefore, oranges are apples."

As you suggested, we'll have to agree to disagree.

 

[jakemccoy]

I don't know about you guys, but when I write posts on these forums, my sentences are linked. Any one sentence doesn't make sense in isolation. Quoting a single sentence from a post and then debating off that one sentence usually makes no sense. If you're going to do that, then you might as well just have a discussion with yourself instead. It's the same thing.

 

[mcdonl]

For what it's worth I just took an informal poll in my office of non-gun users.

They all stated that an assult rifle/gun/weapon is one that holds a lot of bullets (Hi capacity Magazines....), can be held like this (From the hip.....), is high caliber (Enough to kill a deer) and is usually black.

Now... my opinion, un-educated as it is... An AR-15 is an assault rifle/gun/weapon... what does AR stand for anyway? I am not sure.

 

[DHJenkins]

I think it's Armalite Rifle, but don't quote me.

 

[Hk91-762mm]

WELL WELL Lets let our great gun groupe the BRADY BUNCH tell us what guns they used --It would make sense that the preimminent Gun group should know --!!!
Oh yea when the SHTF I hope someone on the inside can give me the list of Brady members and donators!!!

http://www.bradycampaign.org/media/release.php?release=1118

Following yesterday's assault weapon rampage shooting in Alabama leaving 11 dead including the shooter, America's leading national gun violence prevention organizations – Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, Coalition to Stop Gun Violence, Freedom States Alliance, Legal Community Against Violence, and Violence Policy Center – issued the following joint statement:

“Our sympathies go to all those affected by this terrible tragedy.

“The guns used in yesterday's rampage shooting across Alabama – a

==>>>>>Bushmaster AR-15-style assault rifle and an SKS assault rifle <<<<====–

are military-bred firearms developed for the specific purpose of killing human beings quickly and efficiently. Yesterday's shooting is only the latest addition to a string of preventable tragedies committed with these military-style weapons. America needs an effective federal assault weapons ban to stop the mass production and marketing by the gun industry of these anti-personnel weapons. Today we call on the U.S. Congress to pass a federal assault weapons ban modeled on California's effective law that would ban these weapons once and for all.

“The answer to gun violence is not more guns. Alabama has one of the highest gun ownership rates in the nation – more than 57 percent of the state's households have guns-and some of the weakest gun laws in the country. At the same time, its overall gun death rate for 2005 (16.18 per 100,000) ranks it fifth in the nation. The sad truth is that America will continue to experience these horrific events until Congress listens to the friends and families of the 30,000 Americans who die from guns each year instead of the National Rifle Association.


”Gotta watch out for those SKS Assault rifles =That have no flash suppressor,,NO detachable mag, No folding stock. that hold 10 rnds, No evil pistol grip,, It must be the folding bayonet-Yea thats it All those drive by Bayonetings!!!
Note to Troops-Get A list of the people who donated and belong to brady-when the SHTF I want that list!!!

 

[Carlos Cabeza]

Anyone know what was wrong with the guy that did this ????

It's not the gun, its the person behind it. We all know that and others refuse to admit it.

 

[DHJenkins]

So what about the 40,000 Americans who die from cars each year?

Someone should start an anti-car movement - it would be a great way to lampoon the anti-gun movement.

 

[Jorg Nysgerrig]

So what about the 40,000 Americans who die from cars each year?

Someone should start an anti-car movement - it would be a great way to lampoon the anti-gun movement.

That doesn't work so well. The hoi polloi easily see the utility of cars. The utility of guns isn't as obvious.

 

[CapnMac]

In essence, you are saying, "According to Connecticut Assault Fruit Ban, apples are a fruit. Oranges are also a fruit. Therefore, oranges are apples."

Let us not forget, too, that is a legal description to encompass an image-defined ban--not anything as workman-like as a dictionary or encyclopedic entry.

Which reminds of the possibly apocryphal tale that one of DiFi's staffers was given a copy of Gun Digest's Rifles of the world and a marks-a-lot and was told to mark through "anything that looks like a machine gun" and that is how the 'exclusion list' for the AWB was created.