Alternatives to the military
- Thread starter walking arsenal
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walking arsenal
Member
That one made me flinch too.
jaholder1971
Member
walking arsenal,
2nd generation cadet, second time as senior member. I'm currently working at KSWG HQ as DC. Did you completely drop or just go inactive?
easyg
Member
Sounds the like the same mix that most Soldiers are on...+ cigarettes or snuff!
kannonfyre
Member
An opinion from a draftee culture
As quoted from Strambo in a few posts before this one...
"In Singapore everybody serves, in my 2 weeks there I saw a guy in a wheelchair and a "small person" that did computer work."
As a Singaporean, I can honestly say that the guy in the wheelchair (if genuinely permanently disabled) could easily have obtained a doctors letter and be exempted from COMPULSORY national service. It is true however that my country's draft includes MOST of the men aged 18 and above. I have seen uniformed air force clerks who were born deformed without a hand or even an entire forearm. In these latter cases, it can honestly be said that they CHOSE to serve in a support capacity rather than seek a medical exemption.
WA, I salute your desire to actively serve but at the same time you might want to consider that military service is by no means placid and easy. I know of Asthmatic infantrymen who really find field exercises tough going while my cousin, who is an artilleryman (and has Thalessemia Minor, a blood disorder) finds each day of his draftee service rather gruelling.
As quoted from Strambo in a few posts before this one...
"In Singapore everybody serves, in my 2 weeks there I saw a guy in a wheelchair and a "small person" that did computer work."
As a Singaporean, I can honestly say that the guy in the wheelchair (if genuinely permanently disabled) could easily have obtained a doctors letter and be exempted from COMPULSORY national service. It is true however that my country's draft includes MOST of the men aged 18 and above. I have seen uniformed air force clerks who were born deformed without a hand or even an entire forearm. In these latter cases, it can honestly be said that they CHOSE to serve in a support capacity rather than seek a medical exemption.
WA, I salute your desire to actively serve but at the same time you might want to consider that military service is by no means placid and easy. I know of Asthmatic infantrymen who really find field exercises tough going while my cousin, who is an artilleryman (and has Thalessemia Minor, a blood disorder) finds each day of his draftee service rather gruelling.
mljdeckard
Member
I also agree about lightening up the standards for support-role soldiers, while maintaining the higher standard for combat soldiers. The process of making 19 year-old female clerks keep up with the infantry causes a lot of injuries.
Hazily correct.
Peace Corps is a branch of the US Government - almost certainly State Department.
There are three fundamental tasks:
- Helping the people of interested countries in meeting their need for trained men and women.
- Helping promote a better understanding of Americans on the part of the peoples served.
- Helping promote a better understanding of other peoples on the part of Americans.
You are a US government employee while in Peace Corps, and you receive a living stipend. It's enough live on, but it's not extravagant. The amount of the stipend depends on the expenses in the local country. When I was in (1984-1986), the volunteers in Yemen had the highest stipend in the world $300/month.
When you complete your tour of service, you will get a "readjustment allowance" on return to the US. When I was in, it was about $3000 (that's after two years).
I think that some of my students - I taught ESL - had a very different impression of America after meeting an American. At that time, most people in the 3rd world got their notion of what it meant to be an American from Sylvester Stallone movies. They didn't understand anything about a free press, or any media not controlled by the government. American elections and American football were equally foreign.
I also had the opportunity to live in a traditional Moslem country, which was an eye opener. Living under a tightly controlled military dictatorship was interesting - one of my students was the head of the secret police responsible for the University and the Radio Station.
The Marines at the embassy joke with me one time that we lived/shopped in neighborhoods that were deemed to dangerous for them by the Gunny. One time one of them wanted a jambiyah (ceremonial knife), and I offered to walk with him down to the suq and show him the various jambiyah shops. He just laughed, "Are you out of your mind? We can't go in there!"
I don't know what he meds story wil be for Peace Corps. There are definitely retired folks in Peace Corps who get their monthly meds through the embassy pouch.
You will have to get a security clearance, which means giving the government your fingerprints and permission to talk to friends and neighbors. They will also want your dental records - "Just in case you need any dental work while your in country!" - right. The guys in black helicopters will be able to track you for the rest of your life.
It's also a blast.
Mike
Piedmont Plinker
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LEO
Firefighter
Social Worker
Medical/EMT
Teacher
Desk Jockey at some Gov't Agency (CIA, NSA, FBI, DHS, OIG, DOJ)
Run for office!
Outdoor Ed instructor- still serving the people on a smaller scale
Firefighter
Social Worker
Medical/EMT
Teacher
Desk Jockey at some Gov't Agency (CIA, NSA, FBI, DHS, OIG, DOJ)
Run for office!
Outdoor Ed instructor- still serving the people on a smaller scale
kannonfyre, thanks for the input on Singapore. I don't know all the details of the draft there, I just liked how they made use of all their resources. It's very cool that they can be exempted and that many choose to serve anyway and that the military makes a place for them.
Puncha
Member
Strambo,
Am another Singaporean checking in with a slightly contrasting view.
There are also those who have minor medical conditions (i.e arm broken 5 YEARS AGO, severe "headaches", cooked up psych conditions...etc) who try to weasel out of combat arms jobs during their draft so that they can serve as cooks, clerks, technicians, drivers...etc.
This is a problem as we need every man we can get to shoulder and crew weapons due to our small population (4 mil people crammed into a area the size of washington DC) and potentially unstable geopolitical situation.
BTW, the military makes a place for extremely medically unfit draftees because the draft is mandatory (as earlier stated by Kannonfyre). They are usually turned away for regular service once they finish their draft. Besides it looks good for PR.......(i.e. if he has heart valve problems and is willing to tough it out why can't YOU!)
Am another Singaporean checking in with a slightly contrasting view.
There are also those who have minor medical conditions (i.e arm broken 5 YEARS AGO, severe "headaches", cooked up psych conditions...etc) who try to weasel out of combat arms jobs during their draft so that they can serve as cooks, clerks, technicians, drivers...etc.
This is a problem as we need every man we can get to shoulder and crew weapons due to our small population (4 mil people crammed into a area the size of washington DC) and potentially unstable geopolitical situation.
BTW, the military makes a place for extremely medically unfit draftees because the draft is mandatory (as earlier stated by Kannonfyre). They are usually turned away for regular service once they finish their draft. Besides it looks good for PR.......(i.e. if he has heart valve problems and is willing to tough it out why can't YOU!)
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The comments about the Guard having different standards may be more contextually correct if you are talking about prior service personnel getting back in. Certainly for initial entry everyone goes to the same basic training.
I hate typing long replies, but here it goes:
One post mentioned USAID. That is like Peace Corps but with real funding. There are also contractor positions with DoD and DoS doing all kinds of things that support the military directly.
Did someone mention working as a federal civil servant? Dept of Army civilian? There is that. Check cpol.army.mil for jobs.
Lots of folks overseas have hypertension. It turns out that being rocketed, bombed, and targeted for nasty beheadings can be stressful for some people. Troop medical clinics can take care of that. Having your medical condition under control is the key to being deployable.
Disqualifications for deployment include having battery operated bits inside you (such as auto-defribulators or pacemakers, but not necessarily hearing aids). Mild diabetes treated with non-refrigerated oral insulin is also not necessarily a show stopper. I believe the CPOL website has links to the general guidelines for this.
KBR (Kellogg Brown and Root) has (have?) tons of people working in Iraq and Afghanistan in support of US or coalition military operations. Remember all the crying about Halliburton on TV? That is them. Or part of them. They provide all sorts of services from food services to air conditioning repairs. They work on US bases alongside US troops all over the world. They largely build the bases that the US troops move into.
I mention the last option because it sounded like you wanted to get a little farther stuck in. KBR can use you in some wild and wooly places supporting GWOT.
Security contractors are big in the world right now. Lots of variety in quality of the company and contractor, with some very professional and competent companies out there that are really biting global terror in the butt. These jobs (at least with the companies you would want to work for) would be tough if you are not prior service military or police.
What kind of stuff do you do professionally?
I hate typing long replies, but here it goes:
One post mentioned USAID. That is like Peace Corps but with real funding. There are also contractor positions with DoD and DoS doing all kinds of things that support the military directly.
Did someone mention working as a federal civil servant? Dept of Army civilian? There is that. Check cpol.army.mil for jobs.
Lots of folks overseas have hypertension. It turns out that being rocketed, bombed, and targeted for nasty beheadings can be stressful for some people. Troop medical clinics can take care of that. Having your medical condition under control is the key to being deployable.
Disqualifications for deployment include having battery operated bits inside you (such as auto-defribulators or pacemakers, but not necessarily hearing aids). Mild diabetes treated with non-refrigerated oral insulin is also not necessarily a show stopper. I believe the CPOL website has links to the general guidelines for this.
KBR (Kellogg Brown and Root) has (have?) tons of people working in Iraq and Afghanistan in support of US or coalition military operations. Remember all the crying about Halliburton on TV? That is them. Or part of them. They provide all sorts of services from food services to air conditioning repairs. They work on US bases alongside US troops all over the world. They largely build the bases that the US troops move into.
I mention the last option because it sounded like you wanted to get a little farther stuck in. KBR can use you in some wild and wooly places supporting GWOT.
Security contractors are big in the world right now. Lots of variety in quality of the company and contractor, with some very professional and competent companies out there that are really biting global terror in the butt. These jobs (at least with the companies you would want to work for) would be tough if you are not prior service military or police.
What kind of stuff do you do professionally?
walking arsenal
Member
I'm a certified EMT.
I also do search and rescue professionally.
Other than that I'm a little short on skills that companies will bite on.
Not that I'm not skilled in a lot of things, I just don't have a slip of paper from some mook that says so.
I also do search and rescue professionally.
Other than that I'm a little short on skills that companies will bite on.
Not that I'm not skilled in a lot of things, I just don't have a slip of paper from some mook that says so.
Grizzly Adams
Member
I made a New Years resolution, but you sure tempt me!
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wheelgunslinger
Member
Walking Arsenal,
We find ourselves in the same predicament. Sort of.
I have a couple of old injuries from playing rugby in college that would likely knock me out of military service. Back, wrist...
I jumped back into school after working as a freelance writer for years. I'm pursuing a degree in criminal justice at the local college. I find the education stimulating. I'm learning a lot about the law as well as the subculture of Law Enforcement professionals.
Currently, I have my resume up on the USA jobs website where you can apply for gubment jobs. I'm healthy enough, but really at the limit for a lot of federal positions due to my age (35).
I've found that a lot of companies and agencies come looking in Crim. Justice programs for recruits. Last semester, we even had secret service reps standing in the hallway with a tri-fold presentation and brochures. Very cool.
Like you, I want to do something that will make a difference in the safety of the country. I'm not deluded enough to think it won't be frustrating at many levels to be a government employee after working as a bohemian writer, but I'm going to grit my teeth and do it anyway. I've had it very good for a long time living as I wanted while other people made it possible with their sacrifices. It's my turn.
Ideally, I'm looking at the federal level: Customs and Border Patrol, FBI, CIA, ATF, and others. But, if I strike out there, I'll look at the state or local level.
I have a lot of good skills, including being one heck of a precision rifleman, I'm articulate, intelligent (135 iq), have a good emotional iq, I'm educated, and want to be there. Not just looking for bennies. Much like yourself.
I've found a lot of my initial exploration to be very encouraging. Arrange some interviews with HR types at agencies and ask them what they would be looking for so you can know how to develop yourself. If they take a shine to you, the road may be shorter than you think. Interviews are about making the interviewer like you.
good luck to you. Maybe we'll run into each other in another year or so on the job.
We find ourselves in the same predicament. Sort of.
I have a couple of old injuries from playing rugby in college that would likely knock me out of military service. Back, wrist...
I jumped back into school after working as a freelance writer for years. I'm pursuing a degree in criminal justice at the local college. I find the education stimulating. I'm learning a lot about the law as well as the subculture of Law Enforcement professionals.
Currently, I have my resume up on the USA jobs website where you can apply for gubment jobs. I'm healthy enough, but really at the limit for a lot of federal positions due to my age (35).
I've found that a lot of companies and agencies come looking in Crim. Justice programs for recruits. Last semester, we even had secret service reps standing in the hallway with a tri-fold presentation and brochures. Very cool.
Like you, I want to do something that will make a difference in the safety of the country. I'm not deluded enough to think it won't be frustrating at many levels to be a government employee after working as a bohemian writer, but I'm going to grit my teeth and do it anyway. I've had it very good for a long time living as I wanted while other people made it possible with their sacrifices. It's my turn.
Ideally, I'm looking at the federal level: Customs and Border Patrol, FBI, CIA, ATF, and others. But, if I strike out there, I'll look at the state or local level.
I have a lot of good skills, including being one heck of a precision rifleman, I'm articulate, intelligent (135 iq), have a good emotional iq, I'm educated, and want to be there. Not just looking for bennies. Much like yourself.
I've found a lot of my initial exploration to be very encouraging. Arrange some interviews with HR types at agencies and ask them what they would be looking for so you can know how to develop yourself. If they take a shine to you, the road may be shorter than you think. Interviews are about making the interviewer like you.
good luck to you. Maybe we'll run into each other in another year or so on the job.
leadcounsel
member
Care packages and postcards (postcards are free on various websites) to Soldiers mean a lot.
Vote.
Work on letters to congress for PRO 2A issues and other important issues.
Vote.
Work on letters to congress for PRO 2A issues and other important issues.
Yosemite**Sam
Member
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I've read this entire post and there are alot of very good ideas here. The post that I agree with the most is from KC&97TA:
This kinda brings to mind the closing scenes in the film "Saving private Ryan". Where the now, elderly Ryan is at the cemetary visiting the grave site of the Capt. who had many years earlier rescued him.
This kinda brings to mind the closing scenes in the film "Saving private Ryan". Where the now, elderly Ryan is at the cemetary visiting the grave site of the Capt. who had many years earlier rescued him.
There is a fallacy that "serving your country" means military only. I believe that anything you do to make our country stronger is serving.
http://www.teachforamerica.org/
If you want a huge challenge, try teaching in the inner cities. You'll find courage and sacrifices aren't exclusive to the military and combat.
http://www.teachforamerica.org/
If you want a huge challenge, try teaching in the inner cities. You'll find courage and sacrifices aren't exclusive to the military and combat.
doc2rn
Member
Maritime Marine, they run cargoships with 1/3 the crew of regular Navy. Most are old salt dogs but some want to keep on contributing just like you. Don't remember who said it but getting there is half the battle. That goes for the BBBs as well.
Also didn't the Gov. just say they needed people for the Foreign service, you could be a contractor for them.
Also didn't the Gov. just say they needed people for the Foreign service, you could be a contractor for them.
NGIB
Member
Another way to serve the military directly is to work civil service for one of the DoD branches. I did a 20 year career with the Air Force, then 12 in the private sector, and now I'm a GS-13 with the Army (accountant). If you really wanted to serve up close and personal, there are a ton of civil service vacancies in Iraq and Afghanistan (at least in Financial Management). My son (active Army) is leaving for Iraq soon and I have also toyed with serving there for either a 6 or 12 month tour. Getting a bit old to be in a combat zone though...
TexasRifleman
Moderator Emeritus
Did you talk to the Coast Guard?
They a different set of requirements years ago, might be even more so now that they no longer fall under DoD control.
They a different set of requirements years ago, might be even more so now that they no longer fall under DoD control.
Redd Flynt
Member
plexreticle says "The National Guard seems to have somewhat laxed medical requirements compared to some of the active duty forces. They get the same benefits and spend time in the sand box like everybody else. Talk to them at least." That is utter BS. 
USMEPCOM standards are the same for all armed forces.
USMEPCOM standards are the same for all armed forces.- Status
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